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Old 01-06-2012, 12:36 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Am I DRUNK? How is this a 10 centering?

Check out this new listing. How did Beckett give this a 10 for centering?

2011 Bowman Chrome Bryce Harper Gold Refractor Auto!!! BGS 9.5 w /10!!! 16/50!! | eBay
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Old 01-06-2012, 12:37 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Wow definitely off top/bottom... very surprising.
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Old 01-06-2012, 12:41 AM   #3 (permalink)
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NFL Refs>Consistency of Becketts grading team

And THAT'S saying something

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Old 01-06-2012, 12:42 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Noahkalifungo View Post
Wow definitely off top/bottom... very surprising.
First thing I noticed - o/c t/b
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Old 01-06-2012, 12:44 AM   #5 (permalink)
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NBA Refs consistency of calling traveling>Consistency of Beckets grading team

And THAT'S saying something
Fixed it for ya
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Old 01-06-2012, 12:48 AM   #6 (permalink)
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They threw in an extra $20 for beckett to put a 10 on.
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Old 01-06-2012, 12:51 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I can't believe that people are still surprised by the grades that cards receive by beckett. Nobody should be surprised at all. At the very best grading is extremely subjective and doesn't even use actually instrumentation that I am aware of to determine if the measurements actually fit within their specified parameters. At it's worst for all I know it's a completely arbitrary process. I don't think that's the case but it certainly wouldn't surprise me.
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Old 01-06-2012, 12:57 AM   #8 (permalink)
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I honestly can't tell....

I'm not sure why SOME people think they're better at it than experts.
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Old 01-06-2012, 12:58 AM   #9 (permalink)
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It's Bryce Harper. He and Strasburg are entitled to 10 Centering, even if it looks to be 8 Sad, but true. Remember the Strasburg Super a year or more ago.
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Old 01-06-2012, 01:07 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Its slightly off left-right as well.
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Old 01-06-2012, 01:33 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by danimal875 View Post
Check out this new listing. How did Beckett give this a 10 for centering?

2011 Bowman Chrome Bryce Harper Gold Refractor Auto!!! BGS 9.5 w /10!!! 16/50!! | eBay
Someone's money, that's how.

Does the Harper look better than this on centering?



How long their monopoly exists is determined by how long the collecting hoards give them that power to do so.
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Old 01-06-2012, 01:34 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Check out this new listing. How did Beckett give this a 10 for centering?

2011 Bowman Chrome Bryce Harper Gold Refractor Auto!!! BGS 9.5 w /10!!! 16/50!! | eBay
It looks good to me. Seriously, all this conspiracy talk about BGS is getting really old. It is simple. Do not use them to grade your cards and/or do not buy cards that are graded by BGS, if you have such a problem with their service. Looking at the scan of the card, it looks right on to me. Enlarge the scan as much as you can and measure the borders. Looks like a 10 to me. Also, with a lot of BGS graded card scans, the card itself can be arched or the sleeve reflection can give a false appearance. Do not get me wrong. Like everyone else in the world, BGS employees make mistakes. This card is not one though.

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Someone's money, that's how.

Does the Harper look better than this on centering?



How long their monopoly exists is determined by how long the collecting hoards give them that power to do so.
To answer your question, YES, the harper centering looks better than your 9. Yours is way off L to R. Very easy to see. I knew you would not be able to stay away from spouting off on this thread. I am sure if the Harper was yours it would grade a RSGS 10 PRISTINE.
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Old 01-06-2012, 01:39 AM   #13 (permalink)
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It looks good to me. Seriously, all this conspiracy talk about BGS is getting really old. It is simple. Do not use them to grade your cards and/or do not buy cards that are graded by BGS, if you have such a problem with their service. Looking at the scan of the card, it looks right on to me. Enlarge the scan as much as you can and measure the borders. Looks like a 10 to me. Also, with a lot of BGS graded card scans, the card itself can be arched or the sleeve reflection can give a false appearance. Do not get me wrong. Like everyone else in the world, BGS employees make mistakes. This card is not one though.
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To answer your question, YES, the harper centering looks better than your 9. Yours is way off L to R. Very easy to see. I knew you would not be able to stay away from spouting off on this thread. I am sure if the Harper was yours it would grade a RSGS 10 PRISTINE.
You're as blind as you are intelligent.
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Old 01-06-2012, 01:40 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Someone's money, that's how.

Does the Harper look better than this on centering?



How long their monopoly exists is determined by how long the collecting hoards give them that power to do so.
It's not a monopoly when they have competition like PSA. And yes, the Harper centering looks better than yours.
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Old 01-06-2012, 01:43 AM   #15 (permalink)
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You're as blind as you are intelligent.
I can never argue with someone who is always right and everyone else in the world is wrong.
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Old 01-06-2012, 01:47 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I can never argue with someone who is always right and everyone else in the world is wrong.
clear the ego from your eyes and look again, sherlock:



Now, revisit my initial question on the matter. CLEARLY one is a 10 and the other a 9, right? Or, er, wait a moment here. Perhaps the sleeve in the harper is skewing the proportions, but not in the Doubront, right? Funny guy this Tyson is. Funny indeed.

Or how about this 8 on centering, which BGS gave a 9? Makes the Doubront look like a 10, eh?


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Old 01-06-2012, 01:56 AM   #17 (permalink)
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clear the ego from your eyes and look again, sherlock:

Now, revisit my initial question on the matter. CLEARLY one is a 10 and the other a 9, right? Or, er, wait a moment here. Perhaps the sleeve in the harper is skewing the proportions, but not in the Doubront, right? Funny guy this Tyson is. Funny indeed.
I still see the same thing as before, as I stated. A petulant little child who wines when he does not get what he wants.
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Old 01-06-2012, 01:59 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Well those two cards definitely aren't a full point off from each other..
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:20 AM   #19 (permalink)
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I still see the same thing as before, as I stated. A petulant little child who wines when he does not get what he wants.

Harper is 9.5 centering at best, without seeing the back. Just better than 45/55 T/B, being very generous, 50/50 L/R.

Doubront is a 9.5 on centering, also: 50-50 T/B, and better than 45/55 L/R. Back is gem, too.

BGS made a mistake on both. And so did Tyson. What else is new?

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Old 01-06-2012, 02:22 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Judging a scan for grades is absolutely useless. I've scanned thousands of cards an many times, the scan doesn't give the card justice, even on centering. I've held many cards in my hand and thought they were perfectly centered, but when I look at the scan, it looks different. Unless you have the card in your hand to look at it, there is no way you can judge.
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:32 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Judging a scan for grades is absolutely useless. I've scanned thousands of cards an many times, the scan doesn't give the card justice, even on centering. I've held many cards in my hand and thought they were perfectly centered, but when I look at the scan, it looks different. Unless you have the card in your hand to look at it, there is no way you can judge.
I disagree. Scans are often far clearer, as you can blow them up for easier viewing. Enough with the "card's warped in the plastic slab" nonsense. Those things are flat as a pancake.

Here's something to help Tyson a bit more, though he will never admit he's wrong about anything, I'm sure. I suspect he works for BGS and he probably graded both the Harper and the Doubront.




here are a couple legit "10" on centering cards that I have, and I believe most people who have any degree of familiarity with measuring such can know a "10" is a true "10" where there is no doubt about it-- when there is doubt, something is off:



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Old 01-06-2012, 02:49 AM   #22 (permalink)
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I disagree. Scans are often far clearer, as you can blow them up for easier viewing. Enough with the "card's warped in the plastic slab" nonsense. Those things are flat as a pancake.

Here's something to help Tyson a bit more, though he will never admit he's wrong about anything, I'm sure. I suspect he works for BGS and he probably graded both the Harper and the Doubront.


You may disagree, but I think you are wrong. Like I said, I've seen it many times. A card scan is rarely the way it looks in your hand. I'm not even talking about cards in a slab. That is why grading is so subjective. As far as I'm concerned, any threads asking for an opinion of grade from a scan are a waste of time. You need to be in a room together and pass the card around to get the best idea of how it will grade.
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Old 01-06-2012, 02:56 AM   #23 (permalink)
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You may disagree, but I think you are wrong. Like I said, I've seen it many times. A card scan is rarely the way it looks in your hand. I'm not even talking about cards in a slab. That is why grading is so subjective. As far as I'm concerned, any threads asking for an opinion of grade from a scan are a waste of time. You need to be in a room together and pass the card around to get the best idea of how it will grade.
it may be so in some cases, sure, but in most cases, I believe and have experienced, a clear/good scan is very revealing. Look at the 3 different cards I posted-- can you not clearly see the Vitek and Anderson are 10 and the Doubront, when put sideways, is clearly a 9.5? And can you not clearly see the Harper is at BEST 9.5-- clearly off T/B, as many others noted and it measures out as, and a debatable 50-50 L/R? Be honest stump, you can tell a whole lot looking at these scans.
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Old 01-06-2012, 03:10 AM   #24 (permalink)
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it may be so in some cases, sure, but in most cases, I believe and have experienced, a clear/good scan is very revealing. Look at the 3 different cards I posted-- can you not clearly see the Vitek and Anderson are 10 and the Doubront, when put sideways, is clearly a 9.5? And can you not clearly see the Harper is at BEST 9.5-- clearly off T/B, as many others noted and it measures out as, and a debatable 50-50 L/R? Be honest stump, you can tell a whole lot looking at these scans.
I can see what it appears to be, but I still don't have much faith in scans as far as judging marginal differences. Some of the more obvious examples are more believable. But if your talking differences like 45/55 or less, I just can't trust a scan. We all have different sized screens with resolutions set at who knows what. All I can say is that I've seen many cards in a scan that look off, but when I hold them in my hand, they look dead center. I'm no expert, all I can offer is what I've experienced in my humble relation to the hobby.
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Old 01-06-2012, 03:19 AM   #25 (permalink)
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For example, click the link to the gold Harper in the origional post. At first glance it looks like it's obviously off center left to right. But if you use the zoom feature in that auction, it doesn't look nearly as far off.
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