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-   -   Terry Francona To Be Named Indians Manager (http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/baseball/379519-terry-francona-named-indians-manager.html)

lambeauleap87 10-06-2012 04:33 PM

Terry Francona To Be Named Indians Manager
 
Per Ken Rosenthal:

[url]https://twitter.com/Ken_Rosenthal/status/254677113507033088[/url]

I love it...hopefully Sandy Alomar will stick around the staff.

IamRalpho 10-06-2012 04:54 PM

Good work Cleveland, I am very jealous.

I bet Alomar lands a managing job, I can see Florida if they do Ozzie, or even Boston as a back up to that idiot from Toronto.

CTown 10-06-2012 04:59 PM

Hate it.

Chris Perez comments after Acta's firing says it all... Acta was too laid back and didn't push or challenge the guys enough... What is Francona's style of managing? Super laid back, look at everything that went on in Boston when he got fired. We need a different style here. I think Sandy is the best choice.

Though, I will speculate with Francona - more free agents will give more consideration to Cleveland... though the free agent market is slim at best.

BostonNut 10-06-2012 05:00 PM

Cleveland just became a contender. Tito is a class act. I will certainly be following the Indians next season.

IamRalpho 10-06-2012 05:24 PM

[QUOTE=CTown;3431439]Hate it.

Chris Perez comments after Acta's firing says it all... Acta was too laid back and didn't push or challenge the guys enough... What is Francona's style of managing? Super laid back, look at everything that went on in Boston when he got fired. We need a different style here. I think Sandy is the best choice.

Though, I will speculate with Francona - more free agents will give more consideration to Cleveland... though the free agent market is slim at best.[/QUOTE]

At the very end of Tito's career was he too laid back, and a lot of that had to do with his impending contract situation.

Francona >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Acta and Acta isnt a bad manager either, but Francona relates to players, they all love him, he manages teh game well and he holds people accountable. Dont let the last 2 months of an amazing 8 year run cloud what he did.

He should still managing in Boston.

HadWayTooMuch 10-06-2012 06:47 PM

Cleveland will finish with 70-75 wins if they are lucky next year. Book it!

Francoma is a great manager when he has all stars at every position. Check out his work with a makeshift team (See late 1990s Phillies.)

Though he doesn't have to actually use strategy since he's in the AL so that will help.

Bad manager and you are going to see just how bad next year. Mark my words!

IamRalpho 10-06-2012 07:02 PM

[QUOTE=HadWayTooMuch;3431958]Cleveland will finish with 70-75 wins if they are lucky next year. Book it!

Francoma is a great manager when he has all stars at every position. Check out his work with a makeshift team (See late 1990s Phillies.)

Though he doesn't have to actually use strategy since he's in the AL so that will help.

Bad manager and you are going to see just how bad next year. Mark my words![/QUOTE]

Based on what? What he did 15 years ago in Philly hes going to be bad? But we need to ignore what he did in Boston?

How do you base that? You could argue he is a better coach because he did it with so many stars, issues, attitudes.

The 1997 Phillies had less talent than the Indians do. It was Curt Schilling and thats it, 1998 had Schilling and Rolen and some of Bobby Abreu. 1999 he actually had some talent but no pitching.

This was also at the height of the Braves dominance when they won over 100 games in each of Franconas seasons in Philly.

HadWayTooMuch 10-06-2012 07:10 PM

[QUOTE=IamRalpho;3432024]Based on what? What he did 15 years ago in Philly hes going to be bad? But we need to ignore what he did in Boston?

How do you base that? You could argue he is a better coach because he did it with so many stars, issues, attitudes.

The 1997 Phillies had less talent than the Indians do. It was Curt Schilling and thats it, 1998 had Schilling and Rolen and some of Bobby Abreu. 1999 he actually had some talent but no pitching.

This was also at the height of the Braves dominance when they won over 100 games in each of Franconas seasons in Philly.[/QUOTE]

Nobody, not even I could deny his ability to handle personalities. Just like nobody can deny his lack of ability in handling situations and teams with lousy players.

If he took over a team of stars with attitudes, I'm confident he could do well. He has proven this. He has proven nothing when it comes to taking a team that isn't good and making something of them.

The Indians are doomed unless they add about $100million in payroll so Francoma can manage an all star team again.

RedSoxFan28 10-06-2012 07:34 PM

[QUOTE=HadWayTooMuch;3432053]Nobody, not even I could deny his ability to handle personalities. Just like nobody can deny his lack of ability in handling situations and teams with lousy players.

If he took over a team of stars with attitudes, I'm confident he could do well. He has proven this. He has proven nothing when it comes to taking a team that isn't good and making something of them.

The Indians are doomed unless they add about $100million in payroll so Francoma can manage an all star team again.[/QUOTE]

Honestly Tito and the Indians will do alright next year. They don't need a $100 Million plus payroll like the Yankees to do well. Look at the A's at $49,000,000 Payroll, the Reds at $75,000,000, the Rays at $65,000,000, O's at $80,000,000, Braves at $82,000,000. You don't need a 100 Million+ payroll to make the Playoffs or do well.

MVPete 10-06-2012 07:43 PM

[QUOTE=RedSoxFan28;3432154]Honestly Tito and the Indians will do alright next year. They don't need a $100 Million plus payroll like the Yankees to do well. Look at the A's at $49,000,000 Payroll, the Reds at $75,000,000, the Rays at $65,000,000, O's at $80,000,000, Braves at $82,000,000. You don't need a 100 Million+ payroll to make the Playoffs or do well.[/QUOTE]

All of those teams minus the O's have starting pitching, the Indians do not. I expect them to bring in some new arms and try some of their young arms out next year. Hafner is gone I believe so that frees up a ton of money. They were the worst team in the AL this year IMO so they have a lot of work to do.

RedSoxFan28 10-06-2012 07:49 PM

[QUOTE=MVPete;3432192]All of those teams minus the O's have starting pitching, the Indians do not. I expect them to bring in some new arms and try some of their young arms out next year. Hafner is gone I believe so that frees up a ton of money. They were the worst team in the AL this year IMO so they have a lot of work to do.[/QUOTE]

Of course the Indians need work, but they don't need a $100,000,000+ Payroll to be a decent team

jlzinck 10-06-2012 07:52 PM

And the Cleveland ownership won't float stories out about Terry and drugs and marital problems like the scumbags in Boston did.

MVPete 10-06-2012 07:54 PM

[QUOTE=RedSoxFan28;3432221]Of course the Indians need work, but they don't need a $100,000,000+ Payroll to be a decent team[/QUOTE]

Well if you don't spend you need a solid farm system, and the Indians haven't been able to develop quality players in awhile.

IamRalpho 10-06-2012 08:07 PM

If the Indians suck next year or the tenure of Tito's contract, its gonna be because of poor drafting and poor scouting.

Santana, Kipnis, Lindor are a good start. They need to draft better and cut bait from the Sizemores and Hafners of the world

Ubaldo sucks too but so does Pomeranz so what are they losing?

MVPete 10-06-2012 08:10 PM

[QUOTE=IamRalpho;3432313]If the Indians suck next year or the tenure of Tito's contract, its gonna be because of poor drafting and poor scouting.

Santana, Kipnis, Lindor are a good start. They need to draft better and cut bait from the Sizemores and Hafners of the world

Ubaldo sucks too but so does Pomeranz so what are they losing?[/QUOTE]

Yes but I would imagine the Indians would like to have tried Pomeranz out in Cleveland to see what he can do over what Ubaldo has given them, which is terrible inconsistency. The Rockies and Jim Tracy with their 75 pitch limit are idiots, and who knows what his numbers would be like at Jacob's field as opposed to Coors.

HadWayTooMuch 10-06-2012 09:34 PM

[QUOTE=RedSoxFan28;3432154]Honestly Tito and the Indians will do alright next year. They don't need a $100 Million plus payroll like the Yankees to do well. Look at the A's at $49,000,000 Payroll, the Reds at $75,000,000, the Rays at $65,000,000, O's at $80,000,000, Braves at $82,000,000. You don't need a 100 Million+ payroll to make the Playoffs or do well.[/QUOTE]

You missed my point though. My point is, Francoma is a lousy manager when he doesn't have a $150million all star lineup and that will be proven in 2013 by the Indians.

The teams you mentioned have good managers, not just guys that can handle the personalities of a $175million payroll.

JTWcards 10-06-2012 09:38 PM

[QUOTE=RedSoxFan28;3432154]Honestly Tito and the Indians will do alright next year. They don't need a $100 Million plus payroll like the Yankees to do well. Look at the A's at $49,000,000 Payroll, the Reds at $75,000,000, the Rays at $65,000,000, O's at $80,000,000, Braves at $82,000,000. You don't need a 100 Million+ payroll to make the Playoffs or do well.[/QUOTE]

Notice you didn't mention Red Sox payroll. The Yankees aren't the only one who has(had) 100+ million pay roll. The guys they pay the most don't do diddle (Arod). They're better off with a lower payroll...

IamRalpho 10-06-2012 10:26 PM

[QUOTE=HadWayTooMuch;3432730]You missed my point though. My point is, Francoma is a lousy manager when he doesn't have a $150million all star lineup and that will be proven in 2013 by the Indians.

The teams you mentioned have good managers, not just guys that can handle the personalities of a $175million payroll.[/QUOTE]

Still wanna know why hes lousy, anything to back it up? Except for his days in Philly when they were not talented and against the best team of the 90s.

He was only good in Boston due to $$, but sucks.

Please explain why he is not good. Love to hear this

HadWayTooMuch 10-06-2012 10:46 PM

[QUOTE=IamRalpho;3433028]Still wanna know why hes lousy, anything to back it up? Except for his days in Philly when they were not talented and against the best team of the 90s.

He was only good in Boston due to $$, but sucks.

Please explain why he is not good. Love to hear this[/QUOTE]

I thought I did, multiple times.

He had mediocre teams in the 90s with the Phillies and he blew. He knew nothing about strategy. If he rested his #2 batter, the replacement hit #2. If it was the #7 batter, the replacement batted #7, etc. Look up Kevin Sefcik, the guy batted from 1-8 depending on which batter Francoma was resting that day.

He came to Boston with an All Star lineup with 2nd highest payroll in baseball. Somehow, with that 2nd highest payroll, he became a managerial genius. Interesting. I give him credit for managing personalities, but not managing games. When all you have to do is keep your all stars in check (what he didn't do in 2011), your $175million payroll team can win.

When you have a $50million payroll but are a talent manager, you can take teams like Oakland and Tampa to the playoffs. When you have no managerial skills, you finish with 70some wins every year you manage.

We'll see in 2013 who is right, won't we? It'll be me.

IamRalpho 10-06-2012 10:55 PM

[QUOTE=HadWayTooMuch;3433157]I thought I did, multiple times.

He had mediocre teams in the 90s with the Phillies and he blew. He knew nothing about strategy. If he rested his #2 batter, the replacement hit #2. If it was the #7 batter, the replacement batted #7, etc. Look up Kevin Sefcik, the guy batted from 1-8 depending on which batter Francoma was resting that day.

He came to Boston with an All Star lineup with 2nd highest payroll in baseball. Somehow, with that 2nd highest payroll, he became a managerial genius. Interesting. I give him credit for managing personalities, but not managing games. When all you have to do is keep your all stars in check (what he didn't do in 2011), your $175million payroll team can win.

When you have a $50million payroll but are a talent manager, you can take teams like Oakland and Tampa to the playoffs. When you have no managerial skills, you finish with 70some wins every year you manage.

We'll see in 2013 who is right, won't we? It'll be me.[/QUOTE]

Ha, ok. Well the Indians are going to suck in 2013, so what does that prove about Francona? Seriously penalizing a guy for 1) His first managerial experience and 2) 15 years ago! and not to mention TOTALLY downplaying what he did in Boston because of his payroll but managers of the Tigers, Phillies, and other teams with massive payrolls too arent mentioned.

I dunno where the hate for Francona comes from, unless you are a Phillies fan taht still holds a grudge from AWFUL teams from 97-00 that werent Franconas fault, other than that he is very well respected and has proven to be a good manager.

I just dont get the hate

HadWayTooMuch 10-06-2012 11:10 PM

[QUOTE=IamRalpho;3433213]Ha, ok. Well the Indians are going to suck in 2013, so what does that prove about Francona? Seriously penalizing a guy for 1) His first managerial experience and 2) 15 years ago! and not to mention TOTALLY downplaying what he did in Boston because of his payroll but managers of the Tigers, Phillies, and other teams with massive payrolls too arent mentioned.

I dunno where the hate for Francona comes from, unless you are a Phillies fan taht still holds a grudge from AWFUL teams from 97-00 that werent Franconas fault, other than that he is very well respected and has proven to be a good manager.

I just dont get the hate[/QUOTE]

Charlie Manuel is no better of a manager than Francoma. He can manage personalities with the best of them but is an idiot when it comes to strategy.

Joe Torre failed at every stop until he took over a team full of stars. Some call him a HOFer, I call him lucky.

Jim Leyland is a great manager and proved that in Pittsburgh.

Bobby Valentine couldn't manage a Denny's these days...

MVPete 10-06-2012 11:18 PM

[QUOTE=HadWayTooMuch;3433287]Charlie Manuel is no better of a manager than Francoma. He can manage personalities with the best of them but is an idiot when it comes to strategy.

Joe Torre failed at every stop until he took over a team full of stars. Some call him a HOFer, I call him lucky.

Jim Leyland is a great manager and proved that in Pittsburgh.

Bobby Valentine couldn't manage a Denny's these days...[/QUOTE]

Joe Torre didn't take over a team full of stars.

Jim Leyland hasn't adapted to the new style of managing and it shows.

Tugarpj 10-06-2012 11:21 PM

Good for Cleveland! Great pickup. I wanted him for Detroit.

RedSoxFan28 10-06-2012 11:26 PM

[QUOTE=HadWayTooMuch;3432730]You missed my point though. My point is, Francoma is a lousy manager when he doesn't have a $150million all star lineup and that will be proven in 2013 by the Indians.

The teams you mentioned have good managers, not just guys that can handle the personalities of a $175million payroll.[/QUOTE]

*Francona ;) Francona will do just fine.

RedSoxFan28 10-06-2012 11:34 PM

[QUOTE=JTWcards;3432760]Notice you didn't mention Red Sox payroll. The Yankees aren't the only one who has(had) 100+ million pay roll. The guys they pay the most don't do diddle (Arod). They're better off with a lower payroll...[/QUOTE]

Only 5/10 teams with a $100 Million+ payroll made the playoffs this year. There are 4 other teams in the same boat as the Red Sox so singling out the Red Sox isn't saying much. I also never said the Yankees were the only team with a $100 Million plus payroll.


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