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Old 10-11-2012, 01:32 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by mainerunr View Post
Just curious, did you ever file the claim with the PD? If you did and included the number on the card and proof that you had owned the card, while it sucks for the buyer, you would be entitled to your card back and they would get no compensation for it (unless they could get it back from the seller) as it is illegal to receive stolen property knowingly or not.
umm...i think your logic may be skewed, while purchasing stolen property might be illegal, in no way shape or form can a buyer be held legally responsible for purchasing an item they would have absolutely no way of knowing is stolen.....now the buyer might be forced by police to hand the item(s) back to the original owner, but not charged with any crime.
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Old 10-11-2012, 01:36 PM   #27 (permalink)
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umm...i think your logic may be skewed, while purchasing stolen property might be illegal, in no way shape or form can a buyer be held legally responsible for purchasing an item they would have absolutely no way of knowing is stolen.....now the buyer might be forced by police to hand the item(s) back to the original owner, but not charged with any crime.
Not sure about your logic...the buyer would be responsible for returning the stolen item. As it was never the sellers to sell in the first place. It's no different from purchasing a stolen car or a pawn shop buying stolen property. The Police have the right to seize the stolen property and return it to its rightful owner. The buyer loses every time unless they can recoup their money from the seller.
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Old 10-11-2012, 01:54 PM   #28 (permalink)
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umm...i think your logic may be skewed, while purchasing stolen property might be illegal, in no way shape or form can a buyer be held legally responsible for purchasing an item they would have absolutely no way of knowing is stolen.....now the buyer might be forced by police to hand the item(s) back to the original owner, but not charged with any crime.
Regardless (and I never said the buyer would be charged however, yes, they can be charged with receiving stolen property, usually they are not unless there are circumstances indicating that they should have or could have known the item was stolen), if the appropriate information is in the hands of the police, the OP should be able to get his card back. Sucks for the buyer to be sure unless he can recoup from the seller...actually, it sucks even then because obviously he would rather have the card than the money.
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Old 10-11-2012, 01:58 PM   #29 (permalink)
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OP good luck to you. I uncovered that scumbag's fraud months ago... I'm glad to hear someone might get their item back.. hopefully Grey knows enough people at paypal/eBay to get that POS in the handcuffs he deserves.
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Old 10-11-2012, 02:00 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Thanks guys. I never filed a police report because honestly I thought there was no point. If Brian needs me to or something, I'd be happy to. I certainly have enough evidence.
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Old 10-11-2012, 02:12 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Not sure about your logic...the buyer would be responsible for returning the stolen item. As it was never the sellers to sell in the first place. It's no different from purchasing a stolen car or a pawn shop buying stolen property. The Police have the right to seize the stolen property and return it to its rightful owner. The buyer loses every time unless they can recoup their money from the seller.
if you re-read my post, my last sentence says the exact thing you just stated.
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Old 10-11-2012, 02:17 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Regardless (and I never said the buyer would be charged however, yes, they can be charged with receiving stolen property, usually they are not unless there are circumstances indicating that they should have or could have known the item was stolen), if the appropriate information is in the hands of the police, the OP should be able to get his card back. Sucks for the buyer to be sure unless he can recoup from the seller...actually, it sucks even then because obviously he would rather have the card than the money.
AKA-they are only charged if it is proven they buyer knowingly purchased stolen property....which is exactly what I just said.

Also, if the buyer of these stolen cards used paypal and the police do indeed seize the cards from the buyer to return to the original owner (OP), then the buyer should be able to file a claim with paypal and telling them the situation that they purchased stolen cards then they should be able to get their money back.
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Old 10-11-2012, 02:17 PM   #33 (permalink)
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if you re-read my post, my last sentence says the exact thing you just stated.
Ahh yes, just saw that. I just re-iterated what mainerunr said. So I guess I'm confused how his logic was wrong.
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Old 10-11-2012, 02:19 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Thanks guys. I never filed a police report because honestly I thought there was no point. If Brian needs me to or something, I'd be happy to. I certainly have enough evidence.
I would say it might be worth it if Brian would like to get his money back...again, assuming he used paypal, he might need the police report as proof of theft.
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Old 10-11-2012, 02:19 PM   #35 (permalink)
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AKA-they are only charged if it is proven they buyer knowingly purchased stolen property....which is exactly what I just said.

Also, if the buyer of these stolen cards used paypal and the police do indeed seize the cards from the buyer to return to the original owner (OP), then the buyer should be able to file a claim with paypal and telling them the situation that they purchased stolen cards then they should be able to get their money back.
So then how was his logic skewed???
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Old 10-11-2012, 02:21 PM   #36 (permalink)
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So then how was his logic skewed???
he stated:

Quote:
as it is illegal to receive stolen property knowingly or not.
suggesting that even if the buyer didnt know the property was stolen, it is still illegal and they could still be charged with a crime.
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Old 10-11-2012, 02:22 PM   #37 (permalink)
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All over a 150.00 baseball card...lol.
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Old 10-11-2012, 02:24 PM   #38 (permalink)
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he stated:



suggesting that even if the buyer didnt know the property was stolen, it is still illegal and they could still be charged with a crime.

That's because it is illegal...He didn't say they WOULD be charged. Just that it is illegal to receive stolen property...
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Old 10-11-2012, 02:38 PM   #39 (permalink)
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That's because it is illegal...He didn't say they WOULD be charged. Just that it is illegal to receive stolen property...
i understand what he is saying, but to say that it is even possible for someone to be charged with a crime based on having no way of knowing the property was stole, whether they would actually be charged or not, is wrong. That is all I am saying.

This is the Ohio law, I know states are different but I am sure they are similar:

Lawriter - ORC - 2913.51 Receiving stolen property.

key statement-"knowing or having reasonable cause"


basically, based on what mainerunr has suggested, is that since Brian purchased a stolen card on ebay he COULD (not that he would) be charged with a crime just by receiving the stolen property even though he had no way of knowing it was stolen.....that is how he stated it, but that would not be the law.

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Old 10-11-2012, 02:42 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Hope this has a happy ending. Cheers.
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Old 10-11-2012, 08:12 PM   #41 (permalink)
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I hope it works for you bossman, its nice to see the good come out of people for once and be honest even though they may be on the wrong end of the deal...
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Old 10-11-2012, 08:33 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Good luck!
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Old 10-11-2012, 08:36 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Thanks guys. I never filed a police report because honestly I thought there was no point. If Brian needs me to or something, I'd be happy to. I certainly have enough evidence.
Ill be honest if the cops wouldnt do squat over $3,500 deal i had and got taken for back in 05 im pretty sure $150 they would tell u to kick rocks espcially after almost two months... some cops are useless..
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Old 10-12-2012, 02:38 PM   #44 (permalink)
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funny. he got this graded and got a BGS 5.5 as well
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Old 10-12-2012, 03:15 PM   #45 (permalink)
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https://www.facebook.com/mrraymondmin?fref=ts This is the guys facebook
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Old 10-12-2012, 05:36 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Just got off the phone with Brian, he was very courteous and anxious to help me out. Given the lack of a police report, etc. it would be difficult for him to get his money back through Paypal for the card, which is out at BGS now anyway. Instead, Brian has offered to send me $150 SV (the amount the Strasburg sold for) in Leaf merchandise which I can either keep or sell to in some way recoup the cost of the stolen Strasburg. I gratefully accepted his offer, and I'll be sure to post a mailday when the stuff comes in next week.

While it doesn't get my card back, at least I feel I was compensated for it, and it won't sting as much to see it turn up in Rookie Retro next year! I wish there was something to be done about him, but apparently having thousands of dollars in Paypal claims won against you in a 1 month period doesn't mean eBay will stop you from selling. Unbelievable.

Again, thanks to Brian and Leaf for making a crappy situation better!
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Old 10-12-2012, 05:47 PM   #47 (permalink)
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Just got off the phone with Brian, he was very courteous and anxious to help me out. Given the lack of a police report, etc. it would be difficult for him to get his money back through Paypal for the card, which is out at BGS now anyway. Instead, Brian has offered to send me $150 SV (the amount the Strasburg sold for) in Leaf merchandise which I can either keep or sell to in some way recoup the cost of the stolen Strasburg. I gratefully accepted his offer, and I'll be sure to post a mailday when the stuff comes in next week.

While it doesn't get my card back, at least I feel I was compensated for it, and it won't sting as much to see it turn up in Rookie Retro next year! I wish there was something to be done about Raymond Min, but apparently having thousands of dollars in Paypal claims won against you in a 1 month period doesn't mean eBay will stop you from selling. Unbelievable.

Again, thanks to Brian and Leaf for making a crappy situation better!
Wow. That is very generous of Brian, that's a good business move on his end. I couldn't imagine any other company doing that!
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Old 10-12-2012, 05:51 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Wow. That is very generous of Brian, that's a good business move on his end. I couldn't imagine any other company doing that!
Word!!!!!!
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Old 10-12-2012, 05:56 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Great job by Brian to be a standup and classy guy!....actually makes me want to go out and buy some leaf now lol.....if only i had money
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Old 10-12-2012, 06:30 PM   #50 (permalink)
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Very classy move by Brian.
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