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Old 11-30-2012, 11:09 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default itrader feedback opinion

I listed some stuff in the Buy/sell/trade section for sale and a person indicated to me they wanted a card and we had an agreed upon price. A few days went by and I inquired as to when he was going pay and he has never responded. It has been 8 days since we agreed upon price and 3 days since I inquired about payment. I sent him a message stating that since I have had no response, the card will be re-listed. I am a little newer in selling on here and this is the first instance I have had like this, so I don't want to make any rash decisions.

My question is, at what point (if at all) would you give him feedback on itrader and would you give him negative or neutral?

Any opinions are appreciated.
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:10 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jasoncardmonger View Post
I listed some stuff in the Buy/sell/trade section for sale and a person indicated to me they wanted a card and we had an agreed upon price. A few days went by and I inquired as to when he was going pay and he has never responded. It has been 8 days since we agreed upon price and 3 days since I inquired about payment. I sent him a message stating that since I have had no response, the card will be re-listed. I am a little newer in selling on here and this is the first instance I have had like this, so I don't want to make any rash decisions.

My question is, at what point (if at all) would you give him feedback on itrader and would you give him negative or neutral?

Any opinions are appreciated.
Let it go.
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:12 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Non paying buyer, neggy
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:12 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Let it go.
I kind of agree, but lately, I have had so many members inquire about cards, agree on a price, only to have them not pay, and not respond. I wish I wouldn't have wasted my time holding the cards for them for a week+, when an Itrader warning would have told me to not bother dealing with them.

I'm not all for dropping negative feedback on everyone, but if we keep "letting it go" they will keep on doing it.
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:13 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Let it go.
Don't get me wrong, I am not mad at all, just more of when is it appropriate to leave negative or neutral itrader feedback.
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:21 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Institute a 24-48 hold policy. Honestly, selling/buying on this website makes me feel generally uneasy. Blowout can't provide any protection for us, so we're pretty much left relying on a few "user reviews," would could have been left by two scammer buddies in the first place. And no offense to the honest homeys, but the sports card industry is infested with quick buck douchebags.

While I totally understand the theory of this buy/sell/trade forum is great, there are far too many flaws. Yeah, paying ebay sucks, but I'd rather pay a couple bucks extra than be out a big chunk of cash because I'm not protected here.
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Old 11-30-2012, 12:01 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Yeah, paying ebay sucks, but I'd rather pay a couple bucks extra than be out a big chunk of cash because I'm not protected here.
what?? theres no difference between here or ebay as far as protection. you pay with paypal youre protected. how are you potentially out a big chunk of cash?
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Old 11-30-2012, 12:03 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by JohnRyno View Post
Institute a 24-48 hold policy. Honestly, selling/buying on this website makes me feel generally uneasy. Blowout can't provide any protection for us, so we're pretty much left relying on a few "user reviews," would could have been left by two scammer buddies in the first place. And no offense to the honest homeys, but the sports card industry is infested with quick buck douchebags.

While I totally understand the theory of this buy/sell/trade forum is great, there are far too many flaws. Yeah, paying ebay sucks, but I'd rather pay a couple bucks extra than be out a big chunk of cash because I'm not protected here.
You have been a member here for less then 30 days... how uneasy could you feel...
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Old 11-30-2012, 12:10 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I usually put in my post that you have 24 hours to pay as I have had a lot of people want something and not pay. I don't hound them for the payment. If you don't pay within the time frame, I put it back up for sale and add the person to my ignore list.
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Old 11-30-2012, 12:11 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I usually put in my post that you have 24 hours to pay as I have had a lot of people want something and not pay. I don't hound them for the payment. If you don't pay within the time frame, I put it back up for sale and add the person to my ignore list.
but again, this doesn't warn any other sellers about bad buyers. That's my only issue with it.
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Old 11-30-2012, 12:36 PM   #11 (permalink)
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You have been a member here for less then 30 days... how uneasy could you feel...
on a scale from 1-10?
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Old 11-30-2012, 12:37 PM   #12 (permalink)
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what?? theres no difference between here or ebay as far as protection. you pay with paypal youre protected. how are you potentially out a big chunk of cash?
buying a card and not receiving it.
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Old 11-30-2012, 12:39 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Between this type of action, and sellers holding onto cards for 2 weeks before shipping, I've done less and less through BO lately.

The problem as I see it, is there is no "UNIVERSAL" way to do things. Everyone is asking opinions from everyone on what they should or shouldn't do. People on this site can't even agree to "WHEN IS A DEAL A DEAL".

IMHO, here's how I see it:

AS A SELLER, a deal is set once a price is agreed upon and paypal info has been sent. As an example:

Verufian: $20 dlvd lmk
Member: I'll take it
Verufian: XXXX@XXX.com

THAT IS A DEAL. To me, that's the same as hitting BIN on eBay. The problem is, the collective don't agree on this. Some say a deal is only a deal once money is exchanged. Why I disagree with this, is once they say I'LL TAKE IT, I'm updating my thread to show the card as sold, thus removing all options for a secondary buyer.

If they don't pay, drop a negative for backing out of the deal, and keep all records of conversations for a retaliatory negative (since most of the time it will come, without consequence). At least you will get it removed, but I wish it wouldn't stop there.

As a buyer, the same rule applies.

Member: $20 dlvd lmk
Verufian: I'll take it
Member: XXXX@XXX.com

FOR GOD'S SAKE, pay immediately unless you have worked it out ahead of time. IE:

Member: $20 dlvd lmk
Verufian: I get paid tomorrow, is there anyway I can pay you for this first thing in the morning? Please LMK. If not, I understand
Member: No problem. XXXX@XXX.com

If this situation happens, PAY THEM WHEN YOU SAY YOU WILL. Don't leave them hanging. Card values change all the time, so you holding out payment longer and longer COULD be costing yourself or them money. If overnight, the card prices plummet on eBay, HAVE SOME INTEGRITY and pay the man for the deal agreed upon.

That being said, SELLERS need to ship out within a reasonable amount of time, and even this can't be agreed upon as far as "Reasonable amount of time". To me, I shouldn't be waiting longer than 5 days to have it in the mail. Assuming someone works 60 hours a week, and can only ship on weekends, if I buy it on a Monday, it shouldn't take more than 5 days (Saturday) to ship. There is no reason why it should take 2 weeks to get in the mail to me.

But again, because of these differences of opinions, it ties the mods hands as far as holding people accountable. Even without a trade manager, we should as a collective come up with a "THIS IS HOW YOU DO BUSINESS" guideline that all are held to. Sticky it. Use this for basis on feedback.

In the end of this long winded reply, do what you feel comfortable with. Assuming paypal info was exchanged, I'd personally leave this guy a negative itrader with "Never completed deal, never responded to multiple PM's" Feedback. If the deal was made in a thread, quote all of his replies to prevent editing. If the deal was made in PM's, keep all PM's. You will need these if/when retaliatory negative feedback will be given to you (SMH).
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Old 11-30-2012, 12:52 PM   #14 (permalink)
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buying a card and not receiving it.
then you get your money back thru paypal. what else you got?
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Old 11-30-2012, 01:26 PM   #15 (permalink)
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then you get your money back thru paypal. what else you got?
Yeah...I'm may be a noob on this forum but I've sold musical equipment for almost ten years elsewhere and paypal is so heavily weighed toward the buyer it's scary.

It's VERY easy to get your money if back when you're the buyer, in fact I think sellers have far more risk in general. Granted it takes awhile but paypal really does protect buyers.
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Old 11-30-2012, 01:32 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Verufian View Post
Between this type of action, and sellers holding onto cards for 2 weeks before shipping, I've done less and less through BO lately.

The problem as I see it, is there is no "UNIVERSAL" way to do things. Everyone is asking opinions from everyone on what they should or shouldn't do. People on this site can't even agree to "WHEN IS A DEAL A DEAL".

IMHO, here's how I see it:

AS A SELLER, a deal is set once a price is agreed upon and paypal info has been sent. As an example:

Verufian: $20 dlvd lmk
Member: I'll take it
Verufian: XXXX@XXX.com

THAT IS A DEAL. To me, that's the same as hitting BIN on eBay. The problem is, the collective don't agree on this. Some say a deal is only a deal once money is exchanged. Why I disagree with this, is once they say I'LL TAKE IT, I'm updating my thread to show the card as sold, thus removing all options for a secondary buyer.

If they don't pay, drop a negative for backing out of the deal, and keep all records of conversations for a retaliatory negative (since most of the time it will come, without consequence). At least you will get it removed, but I wish it wouldn't stop there.

As a buyer, the same rule applies.

Member: $20 dlvd lmk
Verufian: I'll take it
Member: XXXX@XXX.com

FOR GOD'S SAKE, pay immediately unless you have worked it out ahead of time. IE:

Member: $20 dlvd lmk
Verufian: I get paid tomorrow, is there anyway I can pay you for this first thing in the morning? Please LMK. If not, I understand
Member: No problem. XXXX@XXX.com

If this situation happens, PAY THEM WHEN YOU SAY YOU WILL. Don't leave them hanging. Card values change all the time, so you holding out payment longer and longer COULD be costing yourself or them money. If overnight, the card prices plummet on eBay, HAVE SOME INTEGRITY and pay the man for the deal agreed upon.

That being said, SELLERS need to ship out within a reasonable amount of time, and even this can't be agreed upon as far as "Reasonable amount of time". To me, I shouldn't be waiting longer than 5 days to have it in the mail. Assuming someone works 60 hours a week, and can only ship on weekends, if I buy it on a Monday, it shouldn't take more than 5 days (Saturday) to ship. There is no reason why it should take 2 weeks to get in the mail to me.

But again, because of these differences of opinions, it ties the mods hands as far as holding people accountable. Even without a trade manager, we should as a collective come up with a "THIS IS HOW YOU DO BUSINESS" guideline that all are held to. Sticky it. Use this for basis on feedback.

In the end of this long winded reply, do what you feel comfortable with. Assuming paypal info was exchanged, I'd personally leave this guy a negative itrader with "Never completed deal, never responded to multiple PM's" Feedback. If the deal was made in a thread, quote all of his replies to prevent editing. If the deal was made in PM's, keep all PM's. You will need these if/when retaliatory negative feedback will be given to you (SMH).
Can we sticky this post??? I think I'm going to print it out and tape it to my wall.
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Old 11-30-2012, 01:41 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I'd leave neutral feedback. Save negatives for transactions gone wrong, not transactions that didn't go
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Old 11-30-2012, 02:15 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by tennelson55 View Post
Non paying buyer, neggy
Go away.......Any comments about the race of the buyers or sellers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnRyno View Post
Institute a 24-48 hold policy. Honestly, selling/buying on this website makes me feel generally uneasy. Blowout can't provide any protection for us, so we're pretty much left relying on a few "user reviews," would could have been left by two scammer buddies in the first place. And no offense to the honest homeys, but the sports card industry is infested with quick buck douchebags.

While I totally understand the theory of this buy/sell/trade forum is great, there are far too many flaws. Yeah, paying ebay sucks, but I'd rather pay a couple bucks extra than be out a big chunk of cash because I'm not protected here.
You can leave too. Show me any forum that offers any protection....You pay via paypal and you are covered if you follow a simple rule or 2. If you are not comfortable trading then don't. Nowhere do you get "protection" for trades.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verufian View Post
IMHO, here's how I see it:

AS A SELLER, a deal is set once a price is agreed upon and paypal info has been sent. As an example:

Verufian: $20 dlvd lmk
Member: I'll take it
Verufian: XXXX@XXX.com

THAT IS A DEAL.
Sorry that is not a deal. It is a deal when payment has been made.

I would never deal with someone who left a negative if someone didn't pay.

Neutral? Informing others in the member section? No problems with that.

As a buyer I once had a guy offer me a price. I accepted and asked for paypal. (10 PM) I went to be at 11PM with no communication from seller.

I get back on at 6PM the next night I had the PM with the Paypal address and 4 MORE PM's complaining that I did not pay yet.

I took that as a sign of an unstable seller and backed out of the deal. I deserve a negative because seller is some nutjob?
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Old 11-30-2012, 02:23 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Sorry that is not a deal. It is a deal when payment has been made.

I would never deal with someone who left a negative if someone didn't pay.

Neutral? Informing others in the member section? No problems with that.

As a buyer I once had a guy offer me a price. I accepted and asked for paypal. (10 PM) I went to be at 11PM with no communication from seller.

I get back on at 6PM the next night I had the PM with the Paypal address and 4 MORE PM's complaining that I did not pay yet.

I took that as a sign of an unstable seller and backed out of the deal. I deserve a negative because seller is some nutjob?
Not at all. But that isn't what I posted. I'm saying, if you asked for his paypal at 10PM, and received it at 10:01PM, and didn't pay, that's where my issue is.

If you ask for paypal, and the Seller doesn't send it until the next day, it's a different scenario.

And I can agree with you as well, if you actually do leave a neutral. Leave SOMETHING. But everyone is so scared of getting retaliatory feedback, they opt to leave nothing, and that doesn't help anyone.
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Old 11-30-2012, 04:44 PM   #20 (permalink)
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then you get your money back thru paypal. what else you got?
Fake/damaged cards, busted case breaks, shipping fees, not sending your end of the trade on a high end deal. Take a minute to search "scam," or "bad buyer/seller" on this site. There are hundreds of people that have been burned and banned.

Another poster mentioned that are no "Universal Rules" governing this site. He's absolutely correct, which is why I feel uneasy about making deals on this website.

Why are you picking a fight with me? The OP asked for opinions. I didn't solicit yours. I haven't impugned this website, or challenged anyone individually/personally, I gave MY opinion, which he asked for.
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Old 11-30-2012, 04:48 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jlzinck View Post
Go away.......Any comments about the race of the buyers or sellers?

You can leave too. Show me any forum that offers any protection....You pay via paypal and you are covered if you follow a simple rule or 2. If you are not comfortable trading then don't. Nowhere do you get "protection" for trades.

Sorry that is not a deal. It is a deal when payment has been made.

I would never deal with someone who left a negative if someone didn't pay.

Neutral? Informing others in the member section? No problems with that.

As a buyer I once had a guy offer me a price. I accepted and asked for paypal. (10 PM) I went to be at 11PM with no communication from seller.

I get back on at 6PM the next night I had the PM with the Paypal address and 4 MORE PM's complaining that I did not pay yet.

I took that as a sign of an unstable seller and backed out of the deal. I deserve a negative because seller is some nutjob?
So you want to kick me out of this forum for posting my opinion, that the OP asked for in the first place? I didn't suggest using another forum. My comparison was to Ebay, where a governing body exists, as does an accepted format for making transactions.

These arguments are fantastic- the defense is basically,"you're wrong because I say so!"
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Old 11-30-2012, 05:15 PM   #22 (permalink)
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So you want to kick me out of this forum for posting my opinion, that the OP asked for in the first place? I didn't suggest using another forum. My comparison was to Ebay, where a governing body exists, as does an accepted format for making transactions.

These arguments are fantastic- the defense is basically,"you're wrong because I say so!"
No I want you to leace on your own.

You whine about the site though you have been here less than Kin Karsashians wedding. People are going to scam eveywhere even Ebay.

They charge for their service this place does not. You are just as covered here as you are on Ebay.

So if you don't like it then leave
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Old 11-30-2012, 05:39 PM   #23 (permalink)
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No I want you to leace on your own.

You whine about the site though you have been here less than Kin Karsashians wedding. People are going to scam eveywhere even Ebay.

They charge for their service this place does not. You are just as covered here as you are on Ebay.

So if you don't like it then leave
I don't think you have recognized the irony in all of this. You are "whining" more than anyone.
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Old 12-01-2012, 12:15 AM   #24 (permalink)
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I would like to thank everyone for taking the time in giving me their opinion. I do agree that some sort of standard of practice should be somewhere on here to give better guidelines on how things should be handled so everyone knows upfront what is expected of them from both a buyer and a seller side. I realize there can be no universal rules to cover everything, but at least laying out expectations should make things go a lot smoother.

For those that think the deal is not complete until the payment is made and maybe I am old school thinking when it comes to this stuff, but if I give someone my word it is a commitment that I will honor or at least contact the seller and see if there is some agreement we can work out if I am unable to honor it. I believe that the material things you have can be taken away from you, but your morals, ethics, and integrity are things you have to give away. As far as I am concerned, if you give me a commitment and dont follow through in some way, you just gave away your integrity as a buyer to me and you are not someone I will trust or work with again. Maybe that is harsh, but if I can not rely upon your word, then what can I reply upon?

If this post makes some of you not want to do business with me, I understand and I am ok with that. If that is the case, it probably means I dont want to do business with you anyways. But I know if I give you my word, it will be honored.

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