Fransisco Liriano to Pirates 2 yrs 14 million

asw37 · 12-21-2012, 12:28 PM

opinions of the deal?

weavere · 12-21-2012, 12:48 PM

I like it. It is definitely an upgrade for the pitching staff and the price tag isn't that big. Certainly this could turn out to be a bust, but I think overall it strengthens the rotation. I would have liked to see them go get a bat instead, but still an improvement.

Srt42004n · 12-21-2012, 01:03 PM

Everytime I see Pitt signing pitching I see Cole/Tallison stock dropping...I guess its good to develope them but will have to wait and see if Liriano stays healthy

ediii33 · 12-21-2012, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Srt42004n

Everytime I see Pitt signing pitching I see Cole/Tallison stock dropping...I guess its good to develope them but will have to wait and see if Liriano stays healthy

Cole/Tallison stock should not be very high. The Pirates have been the death penalty for pitchers.

pskell02 · 12-21-2012, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Srt42004n

Everytime I see Pitt signing pitching I see Cole/Tallison stock dropping...

Completely wrong. You have to fill out the rotation until the guys are ready. AJ will be gone next year and Wandy might be as well. McDonald is a huge question mark and Locke/McPherson are still unproven. When Cole and Taillon are ready, they will have a spot in the rotation.

guru · 12-21-2012, 02:33 PM

I thought the Pirates needed hitters not pitchers?

Ryan T. · 12-21-2012, 02:52 PM

Not thrilled with that for the value of my collection. I will enjoy seeing him pitch in the NL though.

Tugarpj · 12-21-2012, 03:12 PM

Love Pittsburgh and hope this gives them a bit more staying power this year.

mattyice2984 · 12-21-2012, 03:42 PM

After watching Liriano pitch his entire career in Minnesota, I cant figure out why the Pirates, or any team would sign him as a starter. I think he is no longer viable as a starter. He sucks now- there's really no other way to put it.

albjohn3 · 12-21-2012, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Srt42004n

Everytime I see Pitt signing pitching I see Cole/Tallison stock dropping...I guess its good to develope them but will have to wait and see if Liriano stays healthy

Staying healthy not as important as Frankie staying confident throughout season. Mental health just as important for him.

Ryan T. · 12-21-2012, 04:00 PM

I'm not going argue he's had a rough couple seasons since 2010, but anyone with his strikeout rate is going to be given many chances.

If he gets his walks under control (like he did in 2010) he's a very good to great pitcher.

Even with his current abhorrent walk rate, his xFIP still indicates he should be about a league average pitcher with a little better luck and a non-Twins defense behind him.

weavere · 12-21-2012, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattyice2984

After watching Liriano pitch his entire career in Minnesota, I cant figure out why the Pirates, or any team would sign him as a starter. I think he is no longer viable as a starter. He sucks now- there's really no other way to put it.

You could have said a similar thing about A.J. Burnett last year and that turned out alright. Also, pitching in the NL is much different than pitching in the AL.

mattyice2984 · 12-21-2012, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weavere

You could have said a similar thing about A.J. Burnett last year and that turned out alright. Also, pitching in the NL is much different than pitching in the AL.

I'm not buying Burnett either. As for pitching in the NL, yeah that could be an argument, but his ERA has to be concerning. He hasn't had an ERA below five in a couple years (just like Burnett until last year-I'll give you props for making a strong counterargument, because both seemed to be on similar trajectories). It will only be a matter of time before Liriano stinks there too.

I know this sounds like sour grapes being a Twins fan, and I wish the Pirates the best of luck with Liriano next year (I hope he does well and I will always root for him), but I think his career might be almost done. One bad outing and his confidence will be gone. The Twins almost sent him down to the minors last year, but I don't think they did because of his name.

Ryan T. · 12-21-2012, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattyice2984

I'm not buying Burnett either. As for pitching in the NL, yeah that could be an argument, but his ERA has to be concerning. He hasn't had an ERA below five in a couple years (just like Burnett until last year-I'll give you props for making a strong counterargument, because both seemed to be on similar trajectories). It will only be a matter of time before Liriano stinks there too.

I know this sounds like sour grapes being a Twins fan, and I wish the Pirates the best of luck with Liriano next year (I hope he does well and I will always root for him), but I think his career might be almost done. One bad outing and his confidence will be gone. The Twins almost sent him down to the minors last year, but I don't think they did because of his name.

The Twins did their absolute best to break Liriano, so getting out of town is probably the best thing for him.

Between the DFAs, trips to the bullpen, etc.

mattyice2984 · 12-21-2012, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryan T.

The Twins did their absolute best to break Liriano, so getting out of town is probably the best thing for him.

Between the DFAs, trips to the bullpen, etc.

There was a reason why they did that - he wasn't good. So you're saying Liriano wasn't to blame for his own performance? Come on.

weavere · 12-21-2012, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattyice2984

I'm not buying Burnett either. As for pitching in the NL, yeah that could be an argument, but his ERA has to be concerning. He hasn't had an ERA below five in a couple years (just like Burnett until last year-I'll give you props for making a strong counterargument, because both seemed to be on similar trajectories). It will only be a matter of time before Liriano stinks there too.

I know this sounds like sour grapes being a Twins fan, and I wish the Pirates the best of luck with Liriano next year (I hope he does well and I will always root for him), but I think his career might be almost done. One bad outing and his confidence will be gone. The Twins almost sent him down to the minors last year, but I don't think they did because of his name.

Yeah I agree that confidence is a huge issue with him. Hopefully he finds that confidence so the Pirates aren't paying 7 mil/year for a minor league pitcher. I gotta believe that it's worth a shot though.

Ryan T. · 12-21-2012, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattyice2984

There was a reason why they did that - he wasn't good. So you're saying Liriano wasn't to blame for his own performance? Come on.

I'm not saying his performance was good, but the Twins didn't do him any favors whatsoever. I think that could have contributed to some of his struggles.

mattyice2984 · 12-21-2012, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryan T.

I'm not saying his performance was good, but the Twins didn't do him any favors whatsoever. I think that could have contributed to some of his struggles.

I think they tried pretty hard to get him to where he was before, but it's a tough thing to do when he simply wasn't the same pitcher.

gopherfan · 12-21-2012, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weavere

I like it. It is definitely an upgrade for the pitching staff and the price tag isn't that big.

God I wish I was a below average pitcher.

dthimesch · 12-21-2012, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattyice2984

After watching Liriano pitch his entire career in Minnesota, I cant figure out why the Pirates, or any team would sign him as a starter. I think he is no longer viable as a starter. He sucks now- there's really no other way to put it.

Winner!!!

He will show Pittsburgh that he sucks as well.

Kosmo Kards · 12-22-2012, 06:03 AM

I hope Liriano can figure it out, I really like the guy. Two years is about all he's going to get though.

gergs1134 · 12-22-2012, 07:48 AM

Good luck Pittsburgh. He is difficult to watch. So much potential, but the results just aren't there. He'll show a flash of brilliance in one start and then break your faith the next 4 or 5.

stumpfreeman · 12-22-2012, 08:41 AM

Thank goodness the didn't end up back with the Twins. I heard that we had an offer on the table for him at one point. He is a nightmare to watch when he self destructs. I really do hope he succeeds though, I was always rooting for him.

solt0131 · 12-22-2012, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gergs1134

Good luck Pittsburgh. He is difficult to watch. So much potential, but the results just aren't there. He'll show a flash of brilliance in one start and then break your faith the next 4 or 5.

Can't be worse than what we experience with James McDonald. I'll take Liriano all day.

asw37 · 12-22-2012, 11:37 AM

from reports, contract is actually 12.75 million

12-21-2012, 12:28 PM	#1 (permalink)
asw37 Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 621	Fransisco Liriano to Pirates 2 yrs 14 million opinions of the deal? __________________ always looking to trade or sell... everything is availible http://s1295.beta.photobucket.com/user/asw37_cards/library/

12-21-2012, 12:48 PM	#2 (permalink)
weavere Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Cincinnati Posts: 361 11_bige_11 weavere15	I like it. It is definitely an upgrade for the pitching staff and the price tag isn't that big. Certainly this could turn out to be a bust, but I think overall it strengthens the rotation. I would have liked to see them go get a bat instead, but still an improvement. __________________ http://s1167.beta.photobucket.com/user/weavere15/library/?

12-21-2012, 01:03 PM	#3 (permalink)
Srt42004n Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 10,695 I_Hate_Ebay	Everytime I see Pitt signing pitching I see Cole/Tallison stock dropping...I guess its good to develope them but will have to wait and see if Liriano stays healthy __________________ $ Saved for 2013 Bowman: $.00

12-21-2012, 02:33 PM	#6 (permalink)
guru Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Central, KY Posts: 13,959 $guru$ guru	I thought the Pirates needed hitters not pitchers? __________________ Follow me on Twitter - @ebayguruEric Now Collecting: Ken Griffey Jr. & Laila Ali

12-21-2012, 02:52 PM	#7 (permalink)
Ryan T. Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Rochester, NY Posts: 1,007	Not thrilled with that for the value of my collection. I will enjoy seeing him pitch in the NL though. __________________ Always buying high-end Francisco Liriano.

12-21-2012, 03:12 PM	#8 (permalink)
Tugarpj Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Detroit....well close enough Posts: 2,063	Love Pittsburgh and hope this gives them a bit more staying power this year.

12-21-2012, 03:42 PM	#9 (permalink)
mattyice2984 Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Northern Minnesota Posts: 162	After watching Liriano pitch his entire career in Minnesota, I cant figure out why the Pirates, or any team would sign him as a starter. I think he is no longer viable as a starter. He sucks now- there's really no other way to put it. __________________ Photo bucket: http://s1066.photobucket.com/albums/u420/mattyice2984/

12-21-2012, 04:00 PM	#11 (permalink)
Ryan T. Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Rochester, NY Posts: 1,007	I'm not going argue he's had a rough couple seasons since 2010, but anyone with his strikeout rate is going to be given many chances. If he gets his walks under control (like he did in 2010) he's a very good to great pitcher. Even with his current abhorrent walk rate, his xFIP still indicates he should be about a league average pitcher with a little better luck and a non-Twins defense behind him. __________________ Always buying high-end Francisco Liriano.

12-22-2012, 06:03 AM	#21 (permalink)
Kosmo Kards Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Passed out in the Circus Liquor parking lot!!!! Posts: 1,737 kardcollector87	I hope Liriano can figure it out, I really like the guy. Two years is about all he's going to get though.

12-22-2012, 07:48 AM	#22 (permalink)
gergs1134 Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Minnesota Posts: 1,721 gergs	Good luck Pittsburgh. He is difficult to watch. So much potential, but the results just aren't there. He'll show a flash of brilliance in one start and then break your faith the next 4 or 5.

12-22-2012, 08:41 AM	#23 (permalink)
stumpfreeman Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,640 cantankorous	Thank goodness the didn't end up back with the Twins. I heard that we had an offer on the table for him at one point. He is a nightmare to watch when he self destructs. I really do hope he succeeds though, I was always rooting for him. __________________ Check out my photobucket by clicking on my homepage in the drop down list under my username. Looking for any Twins cards I don't have, and Mickey Mantle refractors that I don't have. I will trade for bait, on occasion. 2011 Topps Chrome auto set completed!!

12-22-2012, 11:37 AM	#25 (permalink)
asw37 Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 621	from reports, contract is actually 12.75 million __________________ always looking to trade or sell... everything is availible http://s1295.beta.photobucket.com/user/asw37_cards/library/

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