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Old 12-21-2012, 01:28 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Fransisco Liriano to Pirates 2 yrs 14 million

opinions of the deal?
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Old 12-21-2012, 01:48 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I like it. It is definitely an upgrade for the pitching staff and the price tag isn't that big. Certainly this could turn out to be a bust, but I think overall it strengthens the rotation. I would have liked to see them go get a bat instead, but still an improvement.
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Old 12-21-2012, 02:03 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Everytime I see Pitt signing pitching I see Cole/Tallison stock dropping...I guess its good to develope them but will have to wait and see if Liriano stays healthy
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Old 12-21-2012, 02:27 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Everytime I see Pitt signing pitching I see Cole/Tallison stock dropping...I guess its good to develope them but will have to wait and see if Liriano stays healthy

Cole/Tallison stock should not be very high. The Pirates have been the death penalty for pitchers.
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Old 12-21-2012, 03:27 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Everytime I see Pitt signing pitching I see Cole/Tallison stock dropping...
Completely wrong. You have to fill out the rotation until the guys are ready. AJ will be gone next year and Wandy might be as well. McDonald is a huge question mark and Locke/McPherson are still unproven. When Cole and Taillon are ready, they will have a spot in the rotation.
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Old 12-21-2012, 03:33 PM   #6 (permalink)
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I thought the Pirates needed hitters not pitchers?
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Old 12-21-2012, 03:52 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Not thrilled with that for the value of my collection. I will enjoy seeing him pitch in the NL though.
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:12 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Love Pittsburgh and hope this gives them a bit more staying power this year.
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:42 PM   #9 (permalink)
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After watching Liriano pitch his entire career in Minnesota, I cant figure out why the Pirates, or any team would sign him as a starter. I think he is no longer viable as a starter. He sucks now- there's really no other way to put it.
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:52 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Everytime I see Pitt signing pitching I see Cole/Tallison stock dropping...I guess its good to develope them but will have to wait and see if Liriano stays healthy
Staying healthy not as important as Frankie staying confident throughout season. Mental health just as important for him.
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Old 12-21-2012, 05:00 PM   #11 (permalink)
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I'm not going argue he's had a rough couple seasons since 2010, but anyone with his strikeout rate is going to be given many chances.

If he gets his walks under control (like he did in 2010) he's a very good to great pitcher.

Even with his current abhorrent walk rate, his xFIP still indicates he should be about a league average pitcher with a little better luck and a non-Twins defense behind him.
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Old 12-21-2012, 05:01 PM   #12 (permalink)
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After watching Liriano pitch his entire career in Minnesota, I cant figure out why the Pirates, or any team would sign him as a starter. I think he is no longer viable as a starter. He sucks now- there's really no other way to put it.
You could have said a similar thing about A.J. Burnett last year and that turned out alright. Also, pitching in the NL is much different than pitching in the AL.
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Old 12-21-2012, 05:24 PM   #13 (permalink)
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You could have said a similar thing about A.J. Burnett last year and that turned out alright. Also, pitching in the NL is much different than pitching in the AL.
I'm not buying Burnett either. As for pitching in the NL, yeah that could be an argument, but his ERA has to be concerning. He hasn't had an ERA below five in a couple years (just like Burnett until last year-I'll give you props for making a strong counterargument, because both seemed to be on similar trajectories). It will only be a matter of time before Liriano stinks there too.

I know this sounds like sour grapes being a Twins fan, and I wish the Pirates the best of luck with Liriano next year (I hope he does well and I will always root for him), but I think his career might be almost done. One bad outing and his confidence will be gone. The Twins almost sent him down to the minors last year, but I don't think they did because of his name.
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Old 12-21-2012, 05:28 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I'm not buying Burnett either. As for pitching in the NL, yeah that could be an argument, but his ERA has to be concerning. He hasn't had an ERA below five in a couple years (just like Burnett until last year-I'll give you props for making a strong counterargument, because both seemed to be on similar trajectories). It will only be a matter of time before Liriano stinks there too.

I know this sounds like sour grapes being a Twins fan, and I wish the Pirates the best of luck with Liriano next year (I hope he does well and I will always root for him), but I think his career might be almost done. One bad outing and his confidence will be gone. The Twins almost sent him down to the minors last year, but I don't think they did because of his name.
The Twins did their absolute best to break Liriano, so getting out of town is probably the best thing for him.

Between the DFAs, trips to the bullpen, etc.
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Old 12-21-2012, 05:42 PM   #15 (permalink)
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The Twins did their absolute best to break Liriano, so getting out of town is probably the best thing for him.

Between the DFAs, trips to the bullpen, etc.
There was a reason why they did that - he wasn't good. So you're saying Liriano wasn't to blame for his own performance? Come on.
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Old 12-21-2012, 05:44 PM   #16 (permalink)
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I'm not buying Burnett either. As for pitching in the NL, yeah that could be an argument, but his ERA has to be concerning. He hasn't had an ERA below five in a couple years (just like Burnett until last year-I'll give you props for making a strong counterargument, because both seemed to be on similar trajectories). It will only be a matter of time before Liriano stinks there too.

I know this sounds like sour grapes being a Twins fan, and I wish the Pirates the best of luck with Liriano next year (I hope he does well and I will always root for him), but I think his career might be almost done. One bad outing and his confidence will be gone. The Twins almost sent him down to the minors last year, but I don't think they did because of his name.
Yeah I agree that confidence is a huge issue with him. Hopefully he finds that confidence so the Pirates aren't paying 7 mil/year for a minor league pitcher. I gotta believe that it's worth a shot though.
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Old 12-21-2012, 05:55 PM   #17 (permalink)
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There was a reason why they did that - he wasn't good. So you're saying Liriano wasn't to blame for his own performance? Come on.
I'm not saying his performance was good, but the Twins didn't do him any favors whatsoever. I think that could have contributed to some of his struggles.
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Old 12-21-2012, 05:59 PM   #18 (permalink)
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I'm not saying his performance was good, but the Twins didn't do him any favors whatsoever. I think that could have contributed to some of his struggles.
I think they tried pretty hard to get him to where he was before, but it's a tough thing to do when he simply wasn't the same pitcher.
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:46 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I like it. It is definitely an upgrade for the pitching staff and the price tag isn't that big.
God I wish I was a below average pitcher.
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Old 12-21-2012, 09:09 PM   #20 (permalink)
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After watching Liriano pitch his entire career in Minnesota, I cant figure out why the Pirates, or any team would sign him as a starter. I think he is no longer viable as a starter. He sucks now- there's really no other way to put it.
Winner!!!

He will show Pittsburgh that he sucks as well.
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Old 12-22-2012, 07:03 AM   #21 (permalink)
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I hope Liriano can figure it out, I really like the guy. Two years is about all he's going to get though.
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Old 12-22-2012, 08:48 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Good luck Pittsburgh. He is difficult to watch. So much potential, but the results just aren't there. He'll show a flash of brilliance in one start and then break your faith the next 4 or 5.
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Old 12-22-2012, 09:41 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Thank goodness the didn't end up back with the Twins. I heard that we had an offer on the table for him at one point. He is a nightmare to watch when he self destructs. I really do hope he succeeds though, I was always rooting for him.
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Old 12-22-2012, 10:07 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Good luck Pittsburgh. He is difficult to watch. So much potential, but the results just aren't there. He'll show a flash of brilliance in one start and then break your faith the next 4 or 5.
Can't be worse than what we experience with James McDonald. I'll take Liriano all day.
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Old 12-22-2012, 12:37 PM   #25 (permalink)
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from reports, contract is actually 12.75 million
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