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Old 01-09-2013, 05:26 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Ya, he has just one year left now. I think it's funny how people are blaming the presence of the steroid era guys for him not getting in this time. Multiple writers apparently mailed in blank ballots, but I believe that is because they didn't think anyone deserved getting in this year- including Morris. They could have and probably would have made that one vote if they wanted him elected to the hall.
hopefully next year. It would be tough with some of the guys getting added next yar and the existing guys
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:27 PM   #27 (permalink)
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not picking a fight, im just curious how come not piazza too? catchers in the 90s, no one came close. catchers over the years...he's top 5 easy if not higher
Although Piazza wasn't implicated I know a guy that played with the Mets then and have read online that he had horrendous bacne for a large part of his career... and that comes from oil based steroids like Deca. So unless he ate a lot of fried chicken I'd say he could be implicated also. Regardless he always killed the Astros with double after double. The guy was a beast. I say put him in just for his offensive numbers as a catcher. Who cares about his poor throwing arm or speed on the bases. He put up big numbers while catching 9 innings behind the dish game after game. Thats hard work and hard on the knees.
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:29 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Although Piazza wasn't implicated I know a guy that played with the Mets then and have read online that he had horrendous bacne for a large part of his career... and that comes from oil based steroids like Deca. So unless he ate a lot of fried chicken I'd say he could be implicated also. Regardless he always killed the Astros with double after double. The guy was a beast. I say put him in just for his offensive numbers as a catcher. Who cares about his poor throwing arm or speed on the bases. He put up big numbers while catching 9 innings behind the dish game after game. Thats hard work and hard on the knees.
Anything is possible but come on. Some guy in the Mets lockerroom says he has zits on his back so let's keep him out of the HOF?

If he hasn't been implicated, as far as we know, he's clean. We can't make assumptions like that, it's just not fair.
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:32 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Although Piazza wasn't implicated I know a guy that played with the Mets then and have read online that he had horrendous bacne for a large part of his career... and that comes from oil based steroids like Deca. So unless he ate a lot of fried chicken I'd say he could be implicated also. Regardless he always killed the Astros with double after double. The guy was a beast. I say put him in just for his offensive numbers as a catcher. Who cares about his poor throwing arm or speed on the bases. He put up big numbers while catching 9 innings behind the dish game after game. Thats hard work and hard on the knees.

damn I was hoping to get into the hall of fame too. Guess my bad acne is going to cost me once again. Damn you pimples!!!
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:38 PM   #30 (permalink)
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-I don't really consider the voting relevant anymore. I give the Hall its historical and nostalgic due, as well as recognition for what it means for the players. When considering how it's actually voted on, though...meh.

If the voters truly think themselves the gatekeepers to the promised land (Veteran's Committee aside) then it is intellectually dishonest and hypocritical to have both personal vendettas and voting standards regarding steroids and NOT call for people being removed from the Hall for those and other transgressions. Or at least consider their other activities.

To expect more is likely a fool's errand, though. Hell, one of the Founding Fathers of the Hall kicked a man out of baseball for life for 'cheating'. His transgression? Hitting .375 in a World Series, being exonerated of all criminal charges of gambling/bribery, and not screwing up in the field. Apparently, he purposefully did not hit .400 through the Series to 'throw' the games. So there's a history of ineptitude from the start.

Personally, i consider spousal abuse, infidelity, drunk driving, nose-picking, racism/bigotry, illegal solicitation and enjoyment of prostitutes, etc to be more worrisome than PEDs. Right now the Hall is full-up on those, as well as MVPs. To talk about the 'integrity' of the game and focus on only one aspect, not the others, is disappointing.

And this whole 'not on first ballot but later' nonsense needs to go, to. Illogical to think someone deserves to be in but you don't vote for them to hold whatever microsecond of power your life affords you. They're in or they're out. Quit acting like a child who's getting back at someone for taking away their toy at naptime and do your job.

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Old 01-09-2013, 05:39 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Im actually glad no one got in, although I believe Biggio should get in, I do believe he is not a first ballot hall of famer. I think they got it right this year.
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Old 01-09-2013, 06:34 PM   #32 (permalink)
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LOL at anyone who just assumes that Biggio didn't take PEDs simply because he's small and didn't hit a lot of HRs.
Based on that logic, no one should ever be voted in again.
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Old 01-09-2013, 06:55 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Based on that logic, no one should ever be voted in again.
Only if you believe that only non-PED users should be allowed into the Hall.

It is intellectually dishonest to base your voting decision on whether or not you THINK someone might have used PEDs, because you have no way of knowing who did and didn't use unless someone failed a test or admitted to use.

Plain and simple, Biggio got as many votes as he did because he had a hell of a career, he is small, and he didn't hit home runs. Others like Bagwell and Piazza, who both should have been first ballot guys, were punished for suspected juicing because of the size of their bodies and their power numbers. He was not.

And how the hell did Klesko not get a single vote?
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:01 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Didnt Hank Aaron and a lot of great ballplayers take amphetamines? That is considered a PED. If Aaron did it why not let Bonds and Clemens in if the Supposedly did take steroids.
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:10 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Didnt Hank Aaron and a lot of great ballplayers take amphetamines? That is considered a PED. If Aaron did it why not let Bonds and Clemens in if the Supposedly did take steroids.
Yes, he did and amphetamines weren't banned at the time. I don't believe steroids were banned yet either when Bonds was using them
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:11 PM   #36 (permalink)
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mike piazza should have made it.........only piazza. nobody thinks biggio took steroids?
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:12 PM   #37 (permalink)
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HOF has been a joke for many years now. Its a great museum, thats it. I have my own hall of fame, could care less what the BWAA db's think. Doubt anyone of them played ball beyond high school. They hated bonds before he took hgh because he didnt give interviews, and once everything went down it gave them reason not to vote for him.

As for Biggio. He will be a HOFer next year but I don't consider him a lock HOF in my mind. All I picture him doing is leaning over the plate and getting hit by pitches. Everyone thought he was tough for doing so, but he always had the armor on his elbow which he leaned over the plate/didn't back off an inside pitch, it would just hit it and he wouldnt feel a thing.
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:14 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Biggio took PEDs. I know it, but I can't prove it.
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:22 PM   #39 (permalink)
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The HOF voters are ridiculous about the whole first ballot thing. Biggio is a HOF'er, no debate about that but some voters don't want him to be a "first ballot HOF'er" just like Roberto Alomar in his first HOF ballot.
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:23 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Do you all think that Biggio is better than Larkin?
Biggio-better hitter
Larkin-better defender
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:33 PM   #41 (permalink)
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This is a bunch of horse crap! How can you not have any HOFers elected this year? F' the douchebag writers.
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:33 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Biggio, Piazza, Clemens, and Bonds should have gotten in. Smith should already be in. I agraa with OP that the voters are absolutely clueless.
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:35 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Biggio-better hitter
Larkin-better defender
I think Biggio was just as good as Larkin defensively. I still don't believe Larkin should have gotten in anyhow. Biggio should have gotten in today though.
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:37 PM   #44 (permalink)
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mike piazza should have made it.........only piazza. nobody thinks biggio took steroids?
I agree that Piazza should have gotten in. I do however believe he is just as likely to have been a PED user. I think all these guys probably used, who cares though?
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:37 PM   #45 (permalink)
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My feelings on the whole vote via the writters is the following.

They felt none of these players are first ballot worthy.

Hell it took Joe DiMaggio 3 ballots to get into the hall.
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:41 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Biggio-better hitter
Larkin-better defender


nope, Larkin .295 lifetime hitter while Biggio's career just .281. Their power numbers were very even
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:44 PM   #47 (permalink)
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My feelings on the whole vote via the writters is the following.

They felt none of these players are first ballot worthy.

Hell it took Joe DiMaggio 3 ballots to get into the hall.
Yep. First ballot is holy ground for the voters. Biggio and Piazza are sure to get in eventually (I hope) but neither of them fall under the category of first ballot entrance.

On a side note, Anyone wonder why Clemens got more votes than Bonds? Is Bonds really just that big of a jerk that someone could justify Clemens and not Bonds?
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:51 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Didnt Hank Aaron and a lot of great ballplayers take amphetamines? That is considered a PED. If Aaron did it why not let Bonds and Clemens in if the Supposedly did take steroids.
Amphetamine is a stimulant that is used to treat attention deficit disorder. It's like the NFL players using adderall. It is a physiological drug, not a physical drug. Steroids are a PED, but not all PEDs are steroids
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:52 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Amphetamine is a stimulant that is used to treat attention deficit disorder. It's like the NFL players using adderall. It is a physiological drug, not a physical drug. Steroids are a PED, but not all PEDs are steroids
Correct, amphetamines (Adderall, Dexedrine, Desoxyn) are not considered performance enhancing drugs
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Old 01-09-2013, 09:27 PM   #50 (permalink)
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This is a bunch of horse crap! How can you not have any HOFers elected this year? F' the douchebag writers.
And now Singleton banned for marijuana use... upper or downer? Remember Daryl Kile when he was found had a joint on his nightstand. I know a lot of people that smoke pot and eventually just get tired of it. With steroids though you can't just get tired of it if you do it to long or you end up having to do testosterone replacement therapy. If you didn't know now they are advertising test therapy and deodorant and creams all over the tv for men in their 30's and 40's... does this make it ok for the men of men...professional athletes to use it? I think the baseball writers have put too much of this testosterone deodorant all over their face cause Biggio should have been a instant Hall of Famer. Yes first ballot. Every writer and talking head has agreed to it that Biggio is a no doubt Hall of Famer with his 3,000 hits and playing 3 positions. If anything the BWAA should have done like they did when they blackballed Bonds after he broke the record and at minimum elected Jack Morris and Lee Smith...2 very deserving candidates of their own era.
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