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View Poll Results: Did Braun use steroids?
No 57 32.02%
Yes 109 61.24%
Undecided 12 6.74%
Voters: 178. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-27-2013, 11:13 AM   #26 (permalink)
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-I don't think my mind has changed since this happened. The samples that tested positive, from all scientific evidence available, were not degraded or compromised. He avoided discipline by having good attorneys/representation that were able to point out problems in the procedures, not problems in the results or testing. Which i suppose is a plus for my job security. My original post below:
________________________________________________________________________
""The first sample was degraded.""

-No evidence we have currently supports this. The only evidence we have available, in public at least, is the exact opposite:

"A source said the director of the Montreal Olympic doping lab, Christiane Ayotte, testified during the hearing that it was not unusual for the balance to be different, as the equipment used in the field is not as sophisticated and accurate as the equipment in the lab. She also said she did not question the integrity of the sample and that it arrived with all seals intact.

Sources told Quinn and Fainaru-Wada the seals were totally intact and testing never reflected any degradation of the sample. Based on the World Anti-Doping Agency code, this is exactly what would have been expected to happen, and the collector took the proper action, the source said.

The source also noted that synthetic testosterone doesn't show up just because a sample sits in one place or another."


And from an independent processing lab journal:

""The sample was quickly evaluated using urinalysis, a process that employs commercial test strips and mass spectrometry to precisely calculate the subject's ratio of testosterone (T) to epitestosterone (E). Since the human ratio of T to E is generally fixed around 1 to 1, scientists use this ratio to determine if exogenous testosterone is present. In 1991, a prominent study on steroids found that a ratio of urinary T/E greater than 6 to 1 is extremely rare in the general population (0.8%). Thus, this ratio became the accepted standard utilized by the International Olympic Committee in determining a "positive" test result. Major League Baseball, however, has adopted stricter standards, considering a ratio of 4 to 1 as a "positive" test for performance enhancing drugs.

MLB's first round of testing found that Braun's testosterone was above the 4 to 1 threshold. This triggered a second test, which was conducted by the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) in Montreal. Utilizing isotope ratio mass spectrometry, a technique that measures the quantity of stable isotopes in a sample, WADA's analysis was conclusive. Braun again tested positive, "allowing the clear qualification of exogenous origin" for his body's elevated testosterone levels.

High testosterone is often caused from the use of anabolic steroids, which are prohibited in sports for a very good reason: they are extremely dangerous. Anabolic steroids cause blood pressure to skyrocket, increase levels of LDL cholesterol, trigger heart attacks and strokes even in very young people, promote liver cancer, and generate alarming psychological side effects such as irritability, rage, mania, and delusions.""


Without more information, it *appears* the ruling disregarded the science of the process and hung its hat on a singular violation of the chain of custody. This despite there being no support (again, with what we have in front of us) that such violation could possibly result in a difference in the test.

Anyone crying foul over previous steroid-accused players that doesn't similarly cry foul here is being hypocritical at best.

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Old 01-27-2013, 11:21 AM   #27 (permalink)
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I WANT to believe that he didn't, so I do.
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:35 AM   #28 (permalink)
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One thing worth keeping in mind is that news of Braun's failed test should never have leaked in the first place. Had it not leaked, and he'd won the appeal, we would never have heard of it.
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:39 AM   #29 (permalink)
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One thing worth keeping in mind is that news of Braun's failed test should never have leaked in the first place. Had it not leaked, and he'd won the appeal, we would never have heard of it.
and this means???????
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:42 AM   #30 (permalink)
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he's a future hall of famer if he keeps up his current production....and for you haters, i got two words for you, Degeneration X style in honor of the royal rumble
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:45 AM   #31 (permalink)
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and this means???????
It means we shouldn't even be discussing it as we shouldn't know anything about it. The FedEx guy wasn't the only guy to break protocol!
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:45 AM   #32 (permalink)
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This is the problem with all of this - had it all been transparent from the beginning the general public wouldn't have give a @#$%

However with so much money being exchanged they are going to keep all of this stuff tight and try to spend all different ways.

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One thing worth keeping in mind is that news of Braun's failed test should never have leaked in the first place. Had it not leaked, and he'd won the appeal, we would never have heard of it.
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:49 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Need another option - don't care if he did or not. Believing that everyone isn't cheating or responsible is ridiculous. All of those guys in the clubhouse saying they never saw anything or that it didn't happen to their knowledge makes them just as guilty - which I don't care or they are just naive and ignorant - to which I again don't care about.

Seeing a guy turn on a 98 MPH fastball and hitting it out of the park is one of the most exciting events you can witness - IMO. The fact that they are both juiced, using HGH, goat tendon implants, look like a real life Cable... that doesn't matter to me.

If I want to see guys like me hit the ball I would go watch softball at the park...

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It's been about a year, and I want to get the opinion of the forum, did he use steroids?
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:54 AM   #34 (permalink)
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It means we shouldn't even be discussing it as we shouldn't know anything about it. The FedEx guy wasn't the only guy to break protocol!
So it means he is less guilty???
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:56 AM   #35 (permalink)
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he's a future hall of famer if he keeps up his current production....and for you haters, i got two words for you, Degeneration X style in honor of the royal rumble
What are you 12 years old or something? This thread was created to see how everyone views the situation a year later and you are in here saying F the haters over and over? GTFO with that crap and let people post their opinions.
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:24 PM   #36 (permalink)
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future first ballot hofer
At least your judgement on his steroid use is consistent with your judgement on his HOF first-ballot likelihood.

He'll have to maintain his career average numbers until he's 36 just to get a whiff of the HOF, let alone be a first ballot inductee. That's 8 more years. At this point in his career, he's putting up Vladimir Guerrero type numbers. Vlad was a sure fire first-balloter at 28 too. Dick Allen had more HR at 28. Unfortunately players usually don't get voted in at 28.

Once you've been following baseball long enough, you learn not to enshrine people at the peak of their careers.
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:27 PM   #37 (permalink)
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At least your judgement on his steroid use is consistent with your judgement on his HOF first-ballot likelihood.

He'll have to maintain his career average numbers until he's 36 just to get a whiff of the HOF, let alone be a first ballot inductee. That's 8 more years. At this point in his career, he's putting up Vladimir Guerrero type numbers. Vlad was a sure fire first-balloter at 28 too. Dick Allen had more HR at 28. Unfortunately players usually don't get voted in at 28.

Once you've been following baseball long enough, you learn not to enshrine people at the peak of their careers.
Vladimir Guerrero type numbers

Leave him out of this....
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:35 PM   #38 (permalink)
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sorry for the hater talk, but if you have followed braun throughout his career, like i have being in MKE, I am very confident he will put these numbers up for another 5-6 years at least...Guy is a beast, yes i am a homer at part, but I know what I see in front of me
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:48 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Too bad Vlad will be inducted sooner rather than later, as will Braun when he hangs his cleats up!!!
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:55 PM   #40 (permalink)
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So it means he is less guilty???
No, the verdict from the appeal panel makes him less guilty.
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Old 01-27-2013, 01:13 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Too bad Vlad will be inducted sooner rather than later, as will Braun when he hangs his cleats up!!!
You are quite ignorant. Do you not understand that he is not even close to the HOF right now, and why isnt he? BECAUSE HES 28!! They dont induct players into the hall at age 28 based on what he might do, why you ask? Because of possible injury, possible decline, possible early retirement, possible(probable) steriod use. Hes not even a top 100 canidate right now because he has only been playing for 5 years!!
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Old 01-27-2013, 01:28 PM   #42 (permalink)
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That's not enough proof, for me anyway.
How much proof do you need, thats more proof than Melky, just because they weren't allowed to punish him doesn't mean they thought he was innocent.
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Old 01-27-2013, 01:34 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Wasn't it just something he was prescribed for a cold? Like prednisone of something.
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Old 01-27-2013, 01:35 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Wasn't it just something he was prescribed for a cold? Like prednisone of something.
Nope, fishiest part of it all is that he never came up with a reason.
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Old 01-27-2013, 01:41 PM   #45 (permalink)
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He tested positive for SYNTHETIC testosterone. I don't care how long your urine sits on a shelf in someone's basement, it will not magically grow synthetic testosterone. Braun was guilty as hell and he abused the system and got the result thrown out on a technicality. I have less respect for him than if he would have admitted his mistake and taken his punishment like a man. He has NO F'ing integrity!
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Old 01-27-2013, 01:43 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Maybe you should have used different options for your poll. Then you might've got the result you were looking for...

A) No, and I think OJ was innocent too
B) Yes, you'd have to be completely stupid to believe otherwise
C) Brewers fan
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:07 PM   #47 (permalink)
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I hope Braun makes it to the hall but at age 28 Mattingly's numbers were quite similar and look where he is now...or more importantly...isn't. Braun has a long way to go. I don't think this incident will have any effect down the road on his odds.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:25 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonedef2oo8 View Post
He had 3xs the normal testosterone in his system, case closed.
I believe it was 3x higher than anyone else had ever tested... that makes the test suspect.


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Originally Posted by MarshallCutler6 View Post
Everyone knows he did them, even the Brwers fans although theyll never admit it. He got off on a technicality, 3x the normal T level is not possible without the help of some PED, he will forever be a scumbag in the eyes of me.
The test protocol wasn't followed so the test was invalid. Its not a technicality, these protocols are there for a reason, and what is telling is he had not failed a test prior to this or after it and was tested 100x that season. I would err on the side of bad test.


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Am I the only one that thinks it could've been spiked?
No, anti-semetism is everywhere and I wouldn't be shocked if some redneck in the chain of custody decided to try to stick it to Braun... not accusing, just saying I wouldn't be surprised.


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Braun won't be viewed the same as those guys, and I do think Bonds and clemens should be in...just sayin, Braun is a sure fire hall of famer!!!!!
Not at 29. He needs to do a lot more. Winning a World Series would help too.


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Nope, fishiest part of it all is that he never came up with a reason.
Why would need a reason that the test came up positive if the test protocol wasn't followed?
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:27 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Everyone knows he did them, even the Brwers fans although theyll never admit it. He got off on a technicality, 3x the normal T level is not possible without the help of some PED, he will forever be a scumbag in the eyes of me.
Spoken like a typical jealous FIB. Go stare at your Sammy Sosa posters, kid.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:32 PM   #50 (permalink)
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Spoken like a typical jealous FIB. Go stare at your Sammy Sosa posters, kid.
I dont like Sammy Sosa, and what am I jealous of?
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