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Old 01-16-2012, 02:44 PM   #101 (permalink)
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Gio you got your eyes set out for nut-huggers? Want to borrow a pair? No-homo
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:44 PM   #102 (permalink)
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I usually dont take part in Jordan-shill type threads but here is what smells fishy to me.

You buy your "dream card" for $10,655, the turn around and put a $12500 Buy It Now on it. Now even if you sell it at the buy it now price, thats about $500 in fees ($100 ebay and $400ish in paypal fee), along with $40ish in shipping.

I know it would be about $1000+ profit if my math is right, but that seems dumb to invest that much in your "dream card" then flip it right away. If you say this is a hobby and spent 10k on card, I would think it would take more then the initial 1.4k to make you sell it in such a short period of time.

Aside from outselling the other one listed because of subgrades.

Again, Im not one to get in on the MJ insert craze, shilling, etc since this is mainly a hobby for me and even if I had the coin to spend 10k on a card, I would like to think I could put it to better use then a piece of cardboard (that isnt auto or gu, but thats beside the point). However just doesnt seem to be that much made initially for it being your "dream card"
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:45 PM   #103 (permalink)
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Thank you. This is more reasonable. Explaining to me without such hostility or skepticism.



This was explained earlier in this thread. The buyer explained to me he didn't even see this card until a month ago, and how he completely missed the auction by kobes_for_sale. At that point, I had a BIN listing at $15,250.00 dollars already. He emailed me and offered $13k and that's where things started. I kept telling him that even though it was a great offer, I wanted to hold onto the card. Then he kept upping his offer to get me to part with it. Ended up parting for $18.25k. It's as simple as that.

Just know... if there were ANY shady activity going on, why would I purposely come in this forum and post it? Why? How would I benefit from any of this? How would I possibly be able to fake everything? Why would I put my positive reputation I built with alllll those card buys/sells in the past, on the line and risk it being tainted with something shady? It's common sense folks. It's NOT fake.

Bullcrap. Take a look at the buyers feedback. He has been buying womans purses and MJ high end cards for the past 3 months religously. Are you going to tell me he never came across your MJ auction all while bidding and winning MJ cards?
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:46 PM   #104 (permalink)
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You made your own mess. You sold a card for 18K and 7k profit. Then you came in here and pimped it out. What was the purpose? In one sentence you call yourself a true MJ collector and swine on how this was your dream card. But it took a bit more cash and 4 weeks to pawn off your dreams! I dont know if Im the one lost here or not. Any reason why you had to let everyone know that you sold your dream card? lol

Im not jealous. I can fully admit that I have many things going on in my life between houses and mortgage that I cant throw weight like $20k around for cards. There are bigger and better things in this world that are far more imporant than for me to be jealous of turning a $7k profit lol. Am I envyous of being able to do this? For sure I am. But Im also envyous of Paul and Nismo for their crazy flips. What can you do? But you dont seem nismo come around post "look at this flip", "look how much money I made" at every turn he makes out like a bandit. It just leaves a sour taste in peoples mouths.

When i sold my first home and made $160K off of it, I didnt come running to tell you the cash I made. I didnt need to post about it. So how can I be jealous at $7k profit?

Never once did I call the auction rigged. I didnt call it shilled. Hell I didnt do anything but say Good sale and question why anyone would spend $18k when they can clearly save themselves $2k by picking up another that was up for sale. Is that not a legit question.

Its you that told us that a "Friend" bought your card. Someone you know and talk to. You started your own skeptisism and now are looking for a scapegoat to get yourself out of .

My horrible attitude is towards people like you. I burst bubbles of those who pat themselves on the back like you have done here by pimping your auction and letting everyone know "look I made a dollar" attitude. Thats why you hate me. You hate me because I dont jump on the band wagon and congradulate you and act like you are some sort of big shot that I should pay respect to. Thats why you dont like my attitude. Because you cant buy my respect with money or big cards lol.

Again you go on about getting laid. Maybe its your dysfuction that you are taking out on me. There are big sales made on ebay every day. You dont see people posting about all them....especially not when its their own lol. What type of outcome were you expecting by patting yourself on the back of a great sale lol? You knew exactly what type of attention you would get if you were smart enough to understand. Obviously you arent. So the only thing you heard on other forums is that people like me would verbally spank you with typed up words on a screen. Dont hate me for it. You had it coming!

So YOU need to relax and chill out about your sale of a card to your "Friend". You felt the need to post and pimp. Now you are want to blame me for your shortcomings
good god. So many wrong things here.

No one cares if you bought a house and flipped it to make $160k profit. We're in a CARD forum so I posted news about a recent huge CARD sale I had. And NO, I didn't sell it to a "FRIEND." I started speaking to him once he wanted to buy my card and threw me an offer. Don't you usually do that? People who want to buy high end cards, I like to speak to them first no? Maybe a few times to get the deal done?

You think I made a fake sale, and came here to boast it. Really? You can't for just one second take a step back and realize that I sold a card, and I simply posted the awesome sale I just had? What's SOOO crazy and shady about that bro? Don't people usually post their excitement of recent pickups or sales? Isn't that normal? Oh wait... but because its a Jordan sale that was another record... you're gonna automatically think I'm shady and that its BS.

That's why YOU need to relax and first see what the truth is before labeling someone.
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:46 PM   #105 (permalink)
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You made your own mess. You sold a card for 18K and 7k profit. Then you came in here and pimped it out. What was the purpose? In one sentence you call yourself a true MJ collector and swine on how this was your dream card. But it took a bit more cash and 4 weeks to pawn off your dreams! I dont know if Im the one lost here or not. Any reason why you had to let everyone know that you sold your dream card? lol

Im not jealous. I can fully admit that I have many things going on in my life between houses and mortgage that I cant throw weight like $20k around for cards. There are bigger and better things in this world that are far more imporant than for me to be jealous of turning a $7k profit lol. Am I envyous of being able to do this? For sure I am. But Im also envyous of Paul and Nismo for their crazy flips. What can you do? But you dont seem nismo come around post "look at this flip", "look how much money I made" at every turn he makes out like a bandit. It just leaves a sour taste in peoples mouths.

When i sold my first home and made $160K off of it, I didnt come running to tell you the cash I made. I didnt need to post about it. So how can I be jealous at $7k profit?

Never once did I call the auction rigged. I didnt call it shilled. Hell I didnt do anything but say Good sale and question why anyone would spend $18k when they can clearly save themselves $2k by picking up another that was up for sale. Is that not a legit question.

Its you that told us that a "Friend" bought your card. Someone you know and talk to. You started your own skeptisism and now are looking for a scapegoat to get yourself out of .

My horrible attitude is towards people like you. I burst bubbles of those who pat themselves on the back like you have done here by pimping your auction and letting everyone know "look I made a dollar" attitude. Thats why you hate me. You hate me because I dont jump on the band wagon and congradulate you and act like you are some sort of big shot that I should pay respect to. Thats why you dont like my attitude. Because you cant buy my respect with money or big cards lol.

Again you go on about getting laid. Maybe its your dysfuction that you are taking out on me. There are big sales made on ebay every day. You dont see people posting about all them....especially not when its their own lol. What type of outcome were you expecting by patting yourself on the back of a great sale lol? You knew exactly what type of attention you would get if you were smart enough to understand. Obviously you arent. So the only thing you heard on other forums is that people like me would verbally spank you with typed up words on a screen. Dont hate me for it. You had it coming!

So YOU need to relax and chill out about your sale of a card to your "Friend". You felt the need to post and pimp. Now you are want to blame me for your shortcomings


Maybe the card wasn't shilled. Maybe it was. Maybe he is legit, maybe he isn't.


But why would anyone turn down the initial offer of 4-5k profit at like 15-16k he was offered a few times? Why would he 'hold out' ? There's no reason for this card to go $18k.

And yes I make flips every so often, but I don't brag about them. I wouldn't mind if he bought a Lebron Exquisite last week for 5k and sold for 8k. But this jordan BS is too messed up right now for anything to seem legit.


If it's a 'collection' then you don't have your whole 'collection' listed for sale on eBay every single day. You also don't 'hold out for more profit' when you're already looking at a 4-5k 'profit'. And lastly why buy a card for 10.6k then relist for 12k ?! the profit margin is so tiny it seems pointless ... Why wouldnt someone hit the BIN at that point if it was worth 5k more?


So you're telling me that someone who would spend $18k on a basketball card doesn't check eBay at least once per week for that coveted 18k card? THAT doesn't make sense!!!!
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:48 PM   #106 (permalink)
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not only that, but look at your feedback, on the feedback link where you bought from kobe it's linked like a cancelled transaction.... the link when you click it to the item doesn't work.

if your selling the card to yourself or amongst friends it would really mean nothing to have positive feedback. or a paypal transaction. it would just be a transfer of numbers from one account to another.

doesn't really make sense for cards to sell at this volume when the popularity just isn't visibly there, your telling people who sell cards... and none of it makes sense.
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:50 PM   #107 (permalink)
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Bullcrap. Take a look at the buyers feedback. He has been buying womans purses and MJ high end cards for the past 3 months religously. Are you going to tell me he never came across your MJ auction all while bidding and winning MJ cards?
Hey bro. That's what he told me. You're callin everything BS and I don't ever see you admitting that this whole thing might really be legit with complete honesty behind it. Again, even if God came to you directly and told you the truth, it seems you wouldn't budge.

So I could show you proof after proof. You can talk to kobes_for_sale, Nat Turner or even the buyer. And when you piece all the puzzles together and find out that what I've been saying was completely true... I still don't think you'd come and acknowledge that you were wrong and too quick to judge.

So what's the point? This will never end. You're gonna call BS on everything anyways.
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:52 PM   #108 (permalink)
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Hey bro. That's what he told me. You're callin everything BS and I don't ever see you admitting that this whole thing might really be legit with complete honesty behind it. Again, even if God came to you directly and told you the truth, it seems you wouldn't budge.

So I could show you proof after proof. You can talk to kobes_for_sale, Nat Turner or even the buyer. And when you piece all the puzzles together and find out that what I've been saying was completely true... I still don't think you'd come and acknowledge that you were wrong and too quick to judge.

So what's the point? This will never end. You're gonna call BS on everything anyways.



I can tell you one quick way to end all this once and for all, post the delivery confirmation number and show it moves from A to B........ one quick number, and done deal, nobody ever doubts you again...... I bet you can't do it.....
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:52 PM   #109 (permalink)
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not only that, but look at your feedback, on the feedback link where you bought from kobe it's linked like a cancelled transaction.... the link when you click it to the item doesn't work.

if your selling the card to yourself or amongst friends it would really mean nothing to have positive feedback. or a paypal transaction. it would just be a transfer of numbers from one account to another.

doesn't really make sense for cards to sell at this volume when the popularity just isn't visibly there, your telling people who sell cards... and none of it makes sense.
I sent kobes_for_sale a Paypal gift payment because he wanted to save on eBay fees. I agreed and paid him then he cancelled the eBay transaction. Go ahead and ask him. He'll tell you exactly the same thing.
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:53 PM   #110 (permalink)
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Rare23air83? have u stopped collecting jordans now? i just clicked on yr ebay link and saw some amazing jordans for sale and then looked at all the ones u had sold :-( if those were in my PC i wouldnt be selling!
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:54 PM   #111 (permalink)
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I can tell you one quick way to end all this once and for all, post the delivery confirmation number and show it moves from A to B........ one quick number, and done deal, nobody ever doubts you again...... I bet you can't do it.....
Yes! That, and the PAYPAL screenshot for the payment with dates...

I promise you I will not say another word, period end of story!!! Even an apology.
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:55 PM   #112 (permalink)
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I'm getting bored of the Jordan insert collector witch hunt. Give the guy a break. There is very little - if any - evidence that he has done anything wrong or suspicious. The eBay and PayPal fees on an $18,000 sale would be huge, so I doubt it's something he'd do unless it was a legitimate sale. Then again, despite my attempts to keep up-to-date with the Jordan craze, I don't have time to get my head around the conspiracy theories. Maybe I'm too naive.

Meanwhile, I have the chance to buy a box of 10,000 loose 1990s cards from a collector in London who died recently (he was a fireman - I'm not sure how he died exactly). I'm hoping to find a Jordan insert or two in the box...

Imagine how amazing that would be?!
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:55 PM   #113 (permalink)
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Rareair- If you could please find time to answer my post.

(Im headed to basketball practice now and really hope its still up when I get back)
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:55 PM   #114 (permalink)
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good god. So many wrong things here.

No one cares if you bought a house and flipped it to make $160k profit. We're in a CARD forum so I posted news about a recent huge CARD sale I had. And NO, I didn't sell it to a "FRIEND." I started speaking to him once he wanted to buy my card and threw me an offer. Don't you usually do that? People who want to buy high end cards, I like to speak to them first no? Maybe a few times to get the deal done?

You think I made a fake sale, and came here to boast it. Really? You can't for just one second take a step back and realize that I sold a card, and I simply posted the awesome sale I just had? What's SOOO crazy and shady about that bro? Don't people usually post their excitement of recent pickups or sales? Isn't that normal? Oh wait... but because its a Jordan sale that was another record... you're gonna automatically think I'm shady and that its BS.

That's why YOU need to relax and first see what the truth is before labeling someone.

Do us all a favor and go pimp your auctions over at HK. Take hychangs advice and dont let the door hit you on the way out!
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:57 PM   #115 (permalink)
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Bullcrap. Take a look at the buyers feedback. He has been buying womans purses and MJ high end cards for the past 3 months religously. Are you going to tell me he never came across your MJ auction all while bidding and winning MJ cards?
Yeah that does seem a little fishy, I mean high end Jordan auctions stick out on Ebay like a sore thumb, hard to see this guy missing that BIN at 12k a few weeks ago. Also the fact that the other guy with the Jordan 9.5 had a BIN set for a few K less than what Rare's sold for last night, and now his price has on his BIN has expectedly rose to 18.5K.

1997-98 Michael Jordan Finest Embossed Gold Refractor #'d 71/74 BGS 9.5 | eBay

I bet it will sit there at 18.5K forever and never sell though, because this guy obviously isn't part of the circle, but I also bet miraculously Nat's BGS 9 will end up taking down around 13-15K.
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:57 PM   #116 (permalink)
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I can tell you one quick way to end all this once and for all, post the delivery confirmation number and show it moves from A to B........ one quick number, and done deal, nobody ever doubts you again...... I bet you can't do it.....
You could mail a 1992 Upper Deck Juan Gonzalez base card and put a DC# on it and attach it to the transaction, doesn't mean the card related to the auction itself actually moves from point A to point B
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:58 PM   #117 (permalink)
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I sent kobes_for_sale a Paypal gift payment because he wanted to save on eBay fees. I agreed and paid him then he cancelled the eBay transaction. Go ahead and ask him. He'll tell you exactly the same thing.
You sent a paypal GIFT payment for that much money? You must be incredibly trustworthy.
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:58 PM   #118 (permalink)
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good god. So many wrong things here.

No one cares if you bought a house and flipped it to make $160k profit. We're in a CARD forum so I posted news about a recent huge CARD sale I had. And NO, I didn't sell it to a "FRIEND." I started speaking to him once he wanted to buy my card and threw me an offer. Don't you usually do that? People who want to buy high end cards, I like to speak to them first no? Maybe a few times to get the deal done?

You think I made a fake sale, and came here to boast it. Really? You can't for just one second take a step back and realize that I sold a card, and I simply posted the awesome sale I just had? What's SOOO crazy and shady about that bro? Don't people usually post their excitement of recent pickups or sales? Isn't that normal? Oh wait... but because its a Jordan sale that was another record... you're gonna automatically think I'm shady and that its BS.

That's why YOU need to relax and first see what the truth is before labeling someone.
I dont think you made a fake sale. I think you made a sale to your "friend" in order to post a NEW RECORD HIGH so that the median on this card can be set. Thats what you did. Its pretty obvious. Sir Lannir bought the PMG red for 12k to set a NEW RECORD HIGH on that card as well.

I dont think there is anything shady about the sale. I just think that the same few people setting NEW RECORD HIGHS over and over and over again creates doubters. Thats the short and sweet of it.
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:58 PM   #119 (permalink)
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The gold refractors were indeed series 2, trying to lighten the mood. One thing I do not have anything against is someone making money. Anything can be your dream card but for the right offer anyone should sell anything in there PC. Lets take this to a smaller level that most can relate to you buy a card for $120 and someone is willing to pay $180 then take it its profit. Some people will not because the card is more important to them but some people like to make a profit and no shame in that. A card is worth what someone is willing to pay and if that is 18k and you can buy it for 12k I see a good business model. It is sad that some auctions as not legit but I think its a smaller percentage that is talked about on these forums. But when there is this much money involved you will be bad apples but I think this is a honest sell. It takes money to make money!
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Old 01-16-2012, 03:01 PM   #120 (permalink)
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Yeah that does seem a little fishy, I mean high end Jordan auctions stick out on Ebay like a sore thumb, hard to see this guy missing that BIN at 12k a few weeks ago. Also the fact that the other guy with the Jordan 9.5 had a BIN set for a few K less than what Rare's sold for last night, and now his price has on his BIN has expectedly rose to 18.5K.

1997-98 Michael Jordan Finest Embossed Gold Refractor #'d 71/74 BGS 9.5 | eBay

I bet it will sit there at 18.5K forever and never sell though, because this guy obviously isn't part of the circle, but I also bet miraculously Nat's BGS 9 will end up taking down around 13-15K.


His BIN magically rises and he states "they just keep going up!"
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Old 01-16-2012, 03:01 PM   #121 (permalink)
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I sent kobes_for_sale a Paypal gift payment because he wanted to save on eBay fees. I agreed and paid him then he cancelled the eBay transaction. Go ahead and ask him. He'll tell you exactly the same thing.
That is BS right there. That would get you and Kobe in boiling hot water with Paypal and Ebay instantly. Believe me they would look into something like that and the Ebay detectives would put 2+2 together real quick. No way you send a 10k Paypal gift and don't set of every red flag Paypal has in their computer system. Lord knows everyone in this forum has had the hammer dropped on them by ebay and paypal for far far far less.
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Old 01-16-2012, 03:01 PM   #122 (permalink)
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Hey bro. That's what he told me. You're callin everything BS and I don't ever see you admitting that this whole thing might really be legit with complete honesty behind it. Again, even if God came to you directly and told you the truth, it seems you wouldn't budge.

So I could show you proof after proof. You can talk to kobes_for_sale, Nat Turner or even the buyer. And when you piece all the puzzles together and find out that what I've been saying was completely true... I still don't think you'd come and acknowledge that you were wrong and too quick to judge.

So what's the point? This will never end. You're gonna call BS on everything anyways.
I called nothing into question except the buyers motive. Infact that has nothing to do with you at all. I believe you sold the card for 18k. Lets get that out of the way.

Im questioning the logic behind the buyer. At 12k no. At 15K no. But at $18k yes. LOL. I dont know, you see absolutely nothing wrong with this logic? Making it even more questionable is the fact that this buyer also set the new record price for a MJ PMG Red months back.

Take Sir Lannir and Natsturner out of the buying game. Look at all the high end MJs sold over $15k and tell me who bought them?
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Old 01-16-2012, 03:02 PM   #123 (permalink)
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I can tell you one quick way to end all this once and for all, post the delivery confirmation number and show it moves from A to B........ one quick number, and done deal, nobody ever doubts you again...... I bet you can't do it.....
Of course I could. Why couldn't I? Because you think this whole thing was fake right? Still don't believe right?

Again, I have the money so even if every single person on earth didn't believe it, it STILL wouldn't phase me or make a difference in my life. I made the sale and I have the money.

But it's more than that now. It's getting quite personal. I'm upset that all the hard and honest work I've done in the past, people who don't even KNOW me are trying to tarnish it because I posted a big Jordan sale on a forum. WTF? Why wouldn't I defend myself?

If it takes a DC number for people to check, I can EASILY do that. But what after that? People would say "Oh well, it could easily be anything in that package, not necessarily that Jordan card."

It's like seriously folks. Everything I've said in this thread is all true. If you think I was gloating my sale or what not... fine. I don't care. People boast their new pickups and sales all the time on forums. But don't judge me and try to tarnish my reputation that I've built so hard on with honesty and legit sales... without even knowing the truth. Just because in the past there were people that did shady business... doesn't mean it's right to jump on everyone's back that sell high end Jordan cards.

You can talk to all the buyers and sellers and try to come up with anything shady you think I might or might not have done. I challenge you. Go ahead and try to find something. But good luck because everything I've done was with honesty and trust.


And of course I'm gonna be defensive. Look at all these hostile words from members that were way too quick to judge. I'm not gonna be a fool and let them tarnish my name when they don't know anything. That's just wrong.
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Old 01-16-2012, 03:04 PM   #124 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Rare23air83 View Post
Of course I could. Why couldn't I? Because you think this whole thing was fake right? Still don't believe right?

Again, I have the money so even if every single person on earth didn't believe it, it STILL wouldn't phase me or make a difference in my life. I made the sale and I have the money.

But it's more than that now. It's getting quite personal. I'm upset that all the hard and honest work I've done in the past, people who don't even KNOW me are trying to tarnish it because I posted a big Jordan sale on a forum. WTF? Why wouldn't I defend myself?

If it takes a DC number for people to check, I can EASILY do that. But what after that? People would say "Oh well, it could easily be anything in that package, not necessarily that Jordan card."

It's like seriously folks. Everything I've said in this thread is all true. If you think I was gloating my sale or what not... fine. I don't care. People boast their new pickups and sales all the time on forums. But don't judge me and try to tarnish my reputation that I've built so hard on with honesty and legit sales... without even knowing the truth. Just because in the past there were people that did shady business... doesn't mean it's right to jump on everyone's back that sell high end Jordan cards.

You can talk to all the buyers and sellers and try to come up with anything shady you think I might or might not have done. I challenge you. Go ahead and try to find something. But good luck because everything I've done was with honesty and trust.


And of course I'm gonna be defensive. Look at all these hostile words from members that were way too quick to judge. I'm not gonna be a fool and let them tarnish my name when they don't know anything. That's just wrong.
Again, you sent over 10 grand paypal GIFT???? Maybe you meant goods.
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Old 01-16-2012, 03:06 PM   #125 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by wesnilevirus View Post
Again, you sent over 10 grand paypal GIFT???? Maybe you meant goods.
At the end of the day, people can decide for themselves about whether or not there is market manipulation of these Jordans. But I think we can all agree that it is a bad idea to send 10 grand paypal gift At least I hope we can agree to this...
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