whoever won this Durant/Westbrook Patch does know it is fake and worthless right!?!

[LeonfromNC]

KEVIN DURANT / RUSSELL WESTBROOK THUNDER 2 CARD JERSEY PATCH SET 1/1 OOAK CUSTOM | eBay

looks like I'm in the wrong profession... if I can make fake patch cards all day and sell them for this amount, I'd quit may day job, lol.

[tristan20]

He does do a much better job than Panini

[Bulls1]

Originally Posted by LeonfromNC

KEVIN DURANT / RUSSELL WESTBROOK THUNDER 2 CARD JERSEY PATCH SET 1/1 OOAK CUSTOM | eBay

looks like I'm in the wrong profession... if I can make fake patch cards all day and sell them for this amount, I'd quit may day job, lol.

It says custom card in the title so obviously it's not a real card

[joe31]

Originally Posted by tristan20

He does do a much better job than Panini

+1. those cards are sick. Panini should hire him.

[paul06901]

I usually hate on custom cards, because the ebay listings are usually titled to entice naive bidders. And I know everyone says 'buyer beware!', but that's BS. It's basically a plot to scam when you title the cards as such.

But in this guy's case, those designs are awesome and the cards themselves look great!

[LeonfromNC]

But my question is, would any of you really pay $70 for this?

[gamboooler]

I'm surprised with how many he sells, that he hasn't received a cease and desist letter yet. People seem to like his cards, though.

[Orangejello727]

There is no way any company that could afford to make patches like that. Its a lose lose situation for any card company to go that route.

#1 Do you know how many jerseys you would need from both players to create such cards? Relay that to how much the cost of the product would be and you will soon realize that its not the route anyone wants to go to. By the time you do figures, the price point for a pack will be over $1k. At that rate, people will complain that they arent getting any value back out of cracking product to flip.

#2 The only way to make such a card work is to fill it with manufactured pieces. We all know how people feel about manufactured pieces. I personally dont care whether they were game used or ripped off a logo that never was worn. Its all the same. 90% of GU cards since the early 00s have all been "event worn" ... pretty much stating that they player took the jersey put it on for like 5 seconds and took it off. Or did what footbally players do and take like 20 jerseys and put them all on at once for a few seconds.

You cant win!

[paul06901]

Originally Posted by Orangejello727

There is no way any company that could afford to make patches like that. Its a lose lose situation for any card company to go that route.

#1 Do you know how many jerseys you would need from both players to create such cards? Relay that to how much the cost of the product would be and you will soon realize that its not the route anyone wants to go to. By the time you do figures, the price point for a pack will be over $1k. At that rate, people will complain that they arent getting any value back out of cracking product to flip.

#2 The only way to make such a card work is to fill it with manufactured pieces. We all know how people feel about manufactured pieces. I personally dont care whether they were game used or ripped off a logo that never was worn. Its all the same. 90% of GU cards since the early 00s have all been "event worn" ... pretty much stating that they player took the jersey put it on for like 5 seconds and took it off. Or did what footbally players do and take like 20 jerseys and put them all on at once for a few seconds.

You cant win!

Hence the reason why sports card collecting is so lame in the first place!!!

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by LeonfromNC

But my question is, would any of you really pay $70 for this?

I'm not surprised someone would. For one, it's far from "worthless." Some people care more about how a card looks than whether its patches are game used. While I doubt the buyer could get $70 for it in the future, it is a nice piece to some people and could make a nice centerpiece for many collectors.

Some people like customs, others don't. I personally think they're cool and was willing to pay this guy some coin for a custom of the guy I PC but I think it's far down on his priority list since I PC a backup haha.

[joe31]

Wow, he is making some serious coin off these. I searched his sold items and he is consistently selling these type of cards for high amounts.

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by LeonfromNC

If I can make fake patch cards all day and sell them for this amount, I'd quit may day job, lol.

Also, I LOVE when people say the above. If you really can create customs at this level or better, than yes, you are probably in the wrong profession. But I highly doubt you have that ability.

Edit: Some backstory for why this irks me (and no offense to you LeonfromNC haha) - my fiance makes modern day cross stitch pieces - old school designs with rap lyrics and movie quotes in them. They take a long time to make so some of the bigger pieces cost decent coin. At every craft show, someone will invariably walk by and say "Ugh that's what she's charging? I could make that myself."

My fiance now sells kits just for those kind of people, which basically cost just materials, so that they CAN make it themselves. And you know what? The complainers aren't the ones who buy the kits. They just want to complain lol.

So in other words...it's real easy to say "Damn he makes a lot of money selling these fakes."
I look at it more as "Wow people pay him a decent amount of money for these well crafted custom pieces he designs and builds from scratch."

[crazymj]

I think people are forgetting that the patch from panini are "game used" or at least event worn, where as these are just from random jersey or cloth and might even be from cheap chinese knockoff jerseys that cost like $10. So I think its a little unfair to say these are so much sicker than panini.

Its like comparing a dual auto of michael jordan and kobe thats made with very bad design from panini versus just an awesome custom made jordan/kobe auto card by me with fake on card jordan and kobe autos.

[paul06901]

Originally Posted by SpastikMooss

Also, I LOVE when people say the above. If you really can create customs at this level or better, than yes, you are probably in the wrong profession. But I highly doubt you have that ability.

Edit: Some backstory for why this irks me (and no offense to you LeonfromNC haha) - my fiance makes modern day cross stitch pieces - old school designs with rap lyrics and movie quotes in them. They take a long time to make so some of the bigger pieces cost decent coin. At every craft show, someone will invariably walk by and say "Ugh that's what she's charging? I could make that myself."

My fiance now sells kits just for those kind of people, which basically cost just materials, so that they CAN make it themselves. And you know what? The complainers aren't the ones who buy the kits. They just want to complain lol.

So in other words...it's real easy to say "Damn he makes a lot of money selling these fakes."
I look at it more as "Wow people pay him a decent amount of money for these well crafted custom pieces he designs and builds from scratch."

I understand what you're saying, for me, it's more the practice of selling the items. They're listed with full intent to gain keyword hits, whether or not they say they are. Of course the argument will always revert to 'well the buyer should know first!'. But fact is, these types of cards should NOT be allowed to be posted with authentic cards.

It's like posting a hand-crafted Rolex watch in the Rolex watch section of eBay, watch how fast that auction gets pulled!

That's what I don't understand here...people are capitalizing off of naive buyers ... and that is just not right.

They should have to post these in the 'art' section, or an entirely different section for custom sports memorabilia/items or something.

They clog up the searches and most are pure attempts to rip off unsuspecting or naive buyers.

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by crazymj

Its like comparing a dual auto of michael jordan and kobe thats made with very bad design from panini versus just an awesome custom made jordan/kobe auto card by me with fake on card jordan and kobe autos.

First off, NO, it is not like this. A fake auto is worth $0. It is not that person's auto. You do not collect autos just because one looks "nice." You buy autos because you want an auto of that person. With jerseys, some people buy jersey cards because they want something that looks nice, while others want an authentic piece of material worn by the person. So there is a market for both the custom stuff and the licensed stuff.

Originally Posted by crazymj

I think people are forgetting that the patch from panini are "game used" or at least event worn, where as these are just from random jersey or cloth and might even be from cheap chinese knockoff jerseys that cost like $10. So I think its a little unfair to say these are so much sicker than panini.

I don't think people are forgetting that at all. I think some people are sick of card companies throwing 40 jerseys on a player at the premiere, then cutting up those jerseys and putting them in 50-100 different products over the next 1-3 years and calling the pieces "event worn." If it's between a plain white swatch from a piece of event worn (NOT GAME WORN) jersey that was on top of 6 other jerseys and under 2 other jerseys for 1 minute vs. a logo swatch from a Chinese knockoff jersey, I'll take the chinese knockoff. Obviously game worn is king, but even then some card companies can't guarantee your player wore it (many Panini cards say this card was used in a game, note they don't say your player used it). I'd rather have a nice looking card that is honest to me about the patch being manufactured than a plain looking card that has a .001% chance of having ever been "worn" for a substantial amount of time by the guy on the card.

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by paul06901

I understand what you're saying, for me, it's more the practice of selling the items. They're listed with full intent to gain keyword hits, whether or not they say they are. Of course the argument will always revert to 'well the buyer should know first!'. But fact is, these types of cards should NOT be allowed to be posted with authentic cards.

It's like posting a hand-crafted Rolex watch in the Rolex watch section of eBay, watch how fast that auction gets pulled!

That's what I don't understand here...people are capitalizing off of naive buyers ... and that is just not right.

They should have to post these in the 'art' section, or an entirely different section for custom sports memorabilia/items or something.

They clog up the searches and most are pure attempts to rip off unsuspecting or naive buyers.

With most customs I 100% agree with you. With cyndia...his auctions say the word custom IN THE TITLE and the description has a long explanation of how his system runs. He even writes "Please read before bidding" at the top of his description in huge type to capture readers. It's not like he's out there to dupe anyone, and his 100% feedback speaks for itself. Seriously, read some of his feedback. People are crazy impressed with his work and I don't see any negs, just one weird neutral.

I do see what you mean with the "art" section comment though. Problem is very few of us would check that section to see it...AND keyword searches would still find the same stuff. I have Ebay sending me every instance of "Seneca Wallace" daily. That's mostly Seneca, but I also get books about a native american tribe by a dude named Wallace haha. But it could be a way to cut down on errors when people go to specifically a certain type of cards while also keeping it visible when people did a general search.

[crazymj]

I'd have to disagree with you on it. I would rather have a plain white swatch from a piece of jersey that was game worn from michael jordan than a sick bulls logo from a knockoff chinese jersey...its like saying i'd rather have a penny than $5000 monopoly money. But heck maybe the $5000 monopoly money is worth more to some people than a penny since it looks nicer and i don't know u can display it or something.

[hotbox]

Well at least he's being honest that it's not game used.

[paul06901]

Originally Posted by SpastikMooss

With most customs I 100% agree with you. With cyndia...his auctions say the word custom IN THE TITLE and the description has a long explanation of how his system runs. He even writes "Please read before bidding" at the top of his description in huge type to capture readers. It's not like he's out there to dupe anyone, and his 100% feedback speaks for itself. Seriously, read some of his feedback. People are crazy impressed with his work and I don't see any negs, just one weird neutral.

I do see what you mean with the "art" section comment though. Problem is very few of us would check that section to see it...AND keyword searches would still find the same stuff. I have Ebay sending me every instance of "Seneca Wallace" daily. That's mostly Seneca, but I also get books about a native american tribe by a dude named Wallace haha.

They can disclaim all they want, but they are not true, authentic card company-issued cards and therefore should be posted in a different section on eBay where the keyword manipulations will not attract naive buyers. He may not be out to dupe anyone, but he is taking advantage of the system by listing in a category that should not allow such listings. If it's his 'work' then it should be considered an art piece, and listed accordingly. They could have a section that is in the "Sportscards & memorabilia" but instead of in the subcategory of 'cards' have a different section titled 'custom art' or something of that nature. This way you could search in the main category of sportscards & memorabilia and get results if you wanted, but if you were JUST looking for cards, you wouldn't get these 'pieces of art' which should NOT be listed/considered as cards.

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by crazymj

I'd have to disagree with you on it. I would rather have a plain white swatch from a piece of jersey that was game worn from michael jordan than a sick bulls logo from a knockoff chinese jersey...its like saying i'd rather have a penny than $5000 monopoly money. But heck maybe the $5000 monopoly money is worth more to some people than a penny since it looks nicer and i don't know u can display it or something.

I didn't say game used. I said event used and worn during that event for a minute.

I would MUCH RATHER have a game used piece than a manufactured piece. We don't disagree. But I'd rather have a nice manufactured piece than an event worn piece that was one of 100 jerseys worn for a minute.

Ranking system:
Game Used by my specific player during a specific game
Game Used by my specific player
Event Worn, only piece worn (like a piece of a cleat and he only wore one pair of cleats)
Sweet Manufactured Patch
Event Worn, one of many pieces (i.e. one of 100 jerseys)
Game Used by a player (But not my player - the card doesn't say who the player was)
"This piece cannot be linked to any player, game, or season" - that one is the absolute worst

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by paul06901

They can disclaim all they want, but they are not true, authentic card company-issued cards and therefore should be posted in a different section on eBay where the keyword manipulations will not attract naive buyers. He may not be out to dupe anyone, but he is taking advantage of the system by listing in a category that should not allow such listings. If it's his 'work' then it should be considered an art piece, and listed accordingly. They could have a section that is in the "Sportscards & memorabilia" but instead of in the subcategory of 'cards' have a different section titled 'custom art' or something of that nature. This way you could search in the main category of sportscards & memorabilia and get results if you wanted, but if you were JUST looking for cards, you wouldn't get these 'pieces of art' which should NOT be listed/considered as cards.

I do like your idea, and I see what you mean. I actually agree 100% with you believe it or not...like I said I think cyndia is legit but that doesn't mean buyers won't make a purchase thinking a card is licensed. And if his cards got moved it would also move shadier custom makers who try to pass stuff off as legit and don't explain the different.

[UltimateDeron]

What's the difference between these cards and the Panini Manufactured Logomans, Upper Deck Premier Stitchings cards, or Topps Letterman Manufactured Letter cards? Those cards sell well depending on the player. I understand those cards are licensed, but you could definitely make the argument that these cards look better.

[fullmetal]

Originally Posted by UltimateDeron

What's the difference between these cards and the Panini Manufactured Logomans, Upper Deck Premier Stitchings cards, or Topps Letterman Manufactured Letter cards? Those cards sell well depending on the player. I understand those cards are licensed, but you could definitely make the argument that these cards look better.

My thoughts exactly.

[ckeer]

Just to sidetrack a little, how do you justify spending money on this:



It has no personal touch from the athlete (i.e. No Auto, No Patch, Not even a tiny Jersey), yet people are spending almost $200 on it. Was it because it is relatively short-numbered? Aesthetically pleasing? Or because beauty is subjective and every collectors have their own views on how their money should be spent on?

That card in question is really sick looking, chances are if these patches appear on any certified cards, they would be deemed as "patch fakes".

[paul06901]

My whole point is that you can compare how it looks, or what it is. But the licensing is KEY.

As I mentioned earlier, they do look awesome and I see no problem selling them. However, they don't belong being listed in the same section as licensed cards. Simply because the keyword spam clogs up searches and manipulates naive buyers into bidding/buying cards they might think are fully licensed and authentic.

Of course all of us here know what these are and how to differentiate, but for those new to the hobby, the keyword-spamming causes confusion. Yes, buyer-beware, but if eBay wants the 'BUYER PROTECTION' so badly ... they need to make changes like splitting these custom cards into their own section.