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Old 11-07-2012, 01:36 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Here is my question;

When has there ever been a brand or product that guaranteed at least an equal secondary market return on a box or case?

What I believe gets lost in all the complaining on what the MRSP of products are and should be, is that it's a gamble no matter what is charged.

Think about. We buy a box or case of unknown cards for $X amount. Because its unknown what cards we will pull, then it's on the consumer to make the decision whether or not it's "worth it" to buy at the listing price.

We would all love to pay less for what we want, but card companies don't force collectors to buy their boxes or cases. We can still collect cards, players, sets, etc by purchasing or trading for singles.
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Old 11-07-2012, 01:46 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by imapippenfan View Post
Here is my question;

When has there ever been a brand or product that guaranteed at least an equal secondary market return on a box or case?

What I believe gets lost in all the complaining on what the MRSP of products are and should be, is that it's a gamble no matter what is charged.

Think about. We buy a box or case of unknown cards for $X amount. Because its unknown what cards we will pull, then it's on the consumer to make the decision whether or not it's "worth it" to buy at the listing price.

We would all love to pay less for what we want, but card companies don't force collectors to buy their boxes or cases. We can still collect cards, players, sets, etc by purchasing or trading for singles.

Well said!
I totally agree!
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Old 11-07-2012, 01:47 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by tristan20 View Post
Exquisite's retail price is way lower than the ridiculous prices online. It still is way better value than any panini product.
Not!......
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Old 11-07-2012, 01:57 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Back on topic, in exquisite you still have the chase of pulling a 12 booklet or the cut 1/1s which would sell for much more than the price of a case.

With Threads and Prestige you know before you even break the seal, its burnt money lol
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:29 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Back on topic, in exquisite you still have the chase of pulling a 12 booklet or the cut 1/1s which would sell for much more than the price of a case.

With Threads and Prestige you know before you even break the seal, its burnt money lol
Really???...Nobody has gotten any of those yet....And thousand of dollars have been spent on cases!...Maybe UD didnt even put those in the cases...Prolly gonna back door them like they have done before!...
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:40 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Really???...Nobody has gotten any of those yet....And thousand of dollars have been spent on cases!...Maybe UD didnt even put those in the cases...Prolly gonna back door them like they have done before!...
At least there is some kind of incentive
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:45 PM   #32 (permalink)
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At least there is some kind of incentive
Yeah right!.......Dont get me wrong I love Exquisite..Its my favorite set...But this years Exquisite blows and is a ripoff..
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Old 11-07-2012, 03:06 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Yeah right!.......Dont get me wrong I love Exquisite..Its my favorite set...But this years Exquisite blows and is a ripoff..
I 100% Agree with your statement.

I know this has been beathen to death but at the very least Topps needs to get back into the NBA licensing game.

Topps Chrome was generally a $70-$80 product that had so much more value than anything Panini puts out.
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Old 11-07-2012, 03:09 PM   #34 (permalink)
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I 100% Agree with your statement.

I know this has been beathen to death but at the very least Topps needs to get back into the NBA licensing game.

Topps Chrome was generally a $70-$80 product that had so much more value than anything Panini puts out.
People would build a set with refractor rather than a set with bronze, silver or gold parallel.
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Old 11-07-2012, 03:38 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Because everyone knows that these products are the low end of the product line. Easy to produce and get out quick then spend more time on the "newish" products and higher end stuff

Threads and prestige have barely changed over the years so if you break it looking for a HUGE hit then its all your fault for not knowing the product your opening
Spot on with this post imo.

The only disadvantage is...in Football there are exclusive contracts; you can get vets, rookies, HOFs in any product you open (if they are in the product of course) from any company.

UD however has a stranglehold on a few top names (vets and HOF) which makes it harder for them to have value.

Yet they do decide to charge the same amount despite this.

So there is fault to be had on a few sides, not just Panini.
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Old 11-07-2012, 03:45 PM   #36 (permalink)
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I 100% Agree with your statement.

I know this has been beathen to death but at the very least Topps needs to get back into the NBA licensing game.

Topps Chrome was generally a $70-$80 product that had so much more value than anything Panini puts out.
I agree with the Chrome, especailly on case breaks. Panini is trying to fill the void of Chrome with respect to the technology. Now to be fair, if Prizm was a $70-80 box (initially) it would be a more fair comparison. How many products does Panini make under $70 box? Hoops at roughly $68. Topps would have a low end in the $50s and $60s that could still yield 1/1s and mulit-signed autos if you were lucky.
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Old 11-07-2012, 04:42 PM   #37 (permalink)
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seems like i bought 97-98 chrome when new for around $100, and that was around 15 years ago.....
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Old 11-07-2012, 05:45 PM   #38 (permalink)
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I'd be very interested to know exactly how they come to acquire their jerseys that they use for their cards, and at what prices they are getting them.

The extreme low number of Logoman cards being put into products tells me that they are too cheap to pay good money for game used jerseys.

I don't see why there couldn't be logoman cards issued in the Timeless Treasures release after the past 2 years had them. To me, it says that they are cutting corners and trying to save money.
I think he NBA deals with 1 or 2 companys to sell there game-used for them and that company keeps %10-%20

The NBA Cares program also gets a lot of the jerseys to auction off for charitys.

I'd Imagine NBA allocates a certain amount to Panini at a certain price but even if it's 5 jerseys a year of each player, Panini does need to buy throught he after-market. This is espicially true with Baseball... And Hockey/Football to a degree due to not having an "exclusive" contract.

For example, Upper deck is not allowed to use NBA jerseys in there products anymore, hence 11-12 exquisite being %100 autographs.

You also have the NBA playing 82 games a year while the NFL only plays 16, this fact also goes into pricing.

With all of that said, Here is some current prices. IF the NBA does not give Panini ANY jerseys per there contract. This is what they would have to pay for certain players, There is only 2 logomans on ach jersey. 1 True logoman and 1 Laundry Tag Logoman.

So to make 2 Kobe Bryant 1/1 Logomans They are spending ATLEAST $6000 for Full Jersey from a non-significent game where he had a "sub-par" stat line as they dont care what game it came from.

Re-sellers charge $8000-8500 for his sub-par or normal stat line games againts any team besides Heat, OKC, Celtics, ect....

So for $6000 at the lowest, they can make about 1200 GU jersey cards, 400 patch cards, 5 pieces of tags which includes one 1/1 tag logoman and then they are left with the holy-grail 1/1 true logoman....

In there eyes, Each logoman probably costs them $300, Of course these numbers on how many jersey/patches they could make is probably way off, but just an example. I'm sure they add all of that up though.

Here are some other players GU jersey costs- Panini probably gets huge discounts for the amount of $ they spend so take these prices and discount %15-%30 on CURRENT Players. Retired HOF Players start going way up obviously due to no supply. Great 10-20 year investments IMO

Micheal Jordan- $40,000+
Larry Bird- $18000-$30000
Magic Johnson- $15000-$40000
Dwyane Wade- $6000
Chris Bosh- $3750
Blake Griffin $6000
Metta World Peace-$2000
Pau Gasol- $2750
Carlos Boozer-$1500
Derrick Rose- $7500
Joakim Noah- $1750
Kevin Durant- $6000
Russell Westbrook- $2750
Eric Gordan- $1750
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Old 11-07-2012, 05:55 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by imapippenfan View Post
Here is my question;

When has there ever been a brand or product that guaranteed at least an equal secondary market return on a box or case?

What I believe gets lost in all the complaining on what the MRSP of products are and should be, is that it's a gamble no matter what is charged.

Think about. We buy a box or case of unknown cards for $X amount. Because its unknown what cards we will pull, then it's on the consumer to make the decision whether or not it's "worth it" to buy at the listing price.

We would all love to pay less for what we want, but card companies don't force collectors to buy their boxes or cases. We can still collect cards, players, sets, etc by purchasing or trading for singles.
Oh I agree: I'm not talking about the per Box Value, just the Products as whole really - I just don't think Panini is working hard enough ...

A simple "Red Wood" auto rookie Parallel #ed to 5 would add so much value to a Box/Case break of threads and make it more fun ...

Panini would have ZERO additional costs to do this - They would just have to change the background color !

For Prestige, a Sick-Design Autograph set inserted every case or 2 or 3 would be awesome as well: If they keep these low-#ed, it wouldn't be that costly to make either
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