Exquisite Investments

[BoJackCards]

Does anybody see exquisite stuff going down ever?

[WillC]

In a word, no.

Not the good stuff, anyway.

[chrismiller81]

Is this real life?

[vc15jrich23]

Sports cards in general are a bad investment.

[yankeesfan24]

Originally Posted by BoJackCards

Does anybody see exquisite stuff going down ever?

There is no safe investment in the card market. The NBA could dissolve in 2 years and 10 years from now people would not even know who Durant was. (very hypothetical, but just proving a point that anything can happen). What if it came out that MJ used PED's during his career. Would his card values still be the same? In short, no.

[fullmetal]

Definitely.

in 20-30 years I doubt anyone will care.

[paul06901]

Originally Posted by vc15jrich23

Sports cards in general are a bad investment.

I agree.

I honestly think that the hobby itself has been in such a downward spiral, I don't see it ever fully getting back to the way it was 5 years ago. New sets will intrigue and spark interest, but unless you have BIG HIGHEND and crazy buyers (like we did see with Nat) then the market will continue to be stale.

The hobby is simply fully with flippers, investors and everyone just trying to make money. That will cause prices to drop lower and lower. Plus with overproduction already driving prices downward, I can't see any investments worthwhile in the sportscard industry.

Now there are TONS of scammers, people manipulating the system, deceit and unfriendliness in the hobby. Kid's can barely afford to collect anymore with Panini only putting out $100 boxes. I remember being able to bust Fleer boxes for $30-40 each, Upper Deck boxes for $50-75 each...now Panini garbage is minimum $100/box for JUNK! And look at the quality of the past few year's releases from Panini & Upper Deck ... CRAP!

People have lost the true spirit of the hobby. I look at breaks on youtube or on the break section here ... as soon as someone pulls a nice hit they want to know "HOW MUCH CAN I SELL THIS FOR? WHAT'S THIS WORTH?" Not "WOW WHAT A GREAT PULL, THIS WILL BE IN MY COLLECTION NOW BECAUSE IT'S PERSONAL TO ME!" ... All we hear when people break product and don't get a $800 card is "THIS PRODUCT SUCKS, I COULDN'T *MAKE MY MONEY BACK!*!" ... Everyone is looking at sportscards as a money maker, as a business ... and not as a hobby. And this isn't related to people who are doing it as a business because they *NEED* to ... it's people recklessly spending THOUSANDS each month on box breaks looking to hit the BEST card in the product simply to resell and make a profit.



The only spark we've REALLY seen in the hobby recently was when Nat went on his buying spree and caused inserts to go through the roof. Once he stopped, they've already settled back down. I don't know if we can count on another MULTI millionaire buying cards with no regard to shilling or astronomical prices being paid.

We see sparks with a set like Prizm, but it's all hype. Even most of the people on here who have any are simply buying them to grade and flip ... not actually *COLLECTING* them ... so they'll eventually dump them and hope for profit, and move on to the next set to hype and flip.



The hobby has changed so drastically over the past 5 years ... mostly for the worse. There are more scams than ever. No UD license. Panini products are watered down, overproduced and overpriced. MANY of the BIG collectors of the past 10 years have bailed on the hobby since everything has gotten so ridiculous. I've personally known MANY collectors over the years, who simply don't collect anymore. We don't see many people entering in the hobby solely to collect the cards. I can name about 5 people on Blowout who just simply popped up and started to post a lot recently with ton's of breaks and big card 'pickups' and they're right back on eBay to be sold for a profit, or graded and then back on ebay to flip.

Everything that's happened over the past 5 years has been simply a recipe for disaster.

It won't get better any time soon either...

[tristan20]

Paul speaketh the truth

Everything has a shelf life, you can chose to ride the wave or pass.

As with anything, its all about timing.

You buy at the right time and you sell at the right time, the question is, when is the right time?

[Kingofkings1281]

Originally Posted by paul06901

I agree.

I honestly think that the hobby itself has been in such a downward spiral, I don't see it ever fully getting back to the way it was 5 years ago. New sets will intrigue and spark interest, but unless you have BIG HIGHEND and crazy buyers (like we did see with Nat) then the market will continue to be stale.

The hobby is simply fully with flippers, investors and everyone just trying to make money. That will cause prices to drop lower and lower. Plus with overproduction already driving prices downward, I can't see any investments worthwhile in the sportscard industry.

Now there are TONS of scammers, people manipulating the system, deceit and unfriendliness in the hobby. Kid's can barely afford to collect anymore with Panini only putting out $100 boxes. I remember being able to bust Fleer boxes for $30-40 each, Upper Deck boxes for $50-75 each...now Panini garbage is minimum $100/box for JUNK! And look at the quality of the past few year's releases from Panini & Upper Deck ... CRAP!

People have lost the true spirit of the hobby. I look at breaks on youtube or on the break section here ... as soon as someone pulls a nice hit they want to know "HOW MUCH CAN I SELL THIS FOR? WHAT'S THIS WORTH?" Not "WOW WHAT A GREAT PULL, THIS WILL BE IN MY COLLECTION NOW BECAUSE IT'S PERSONAL TO ME!" ... All we hear when people break product and don't get a $800 card is "THIS PRODUCT SUCKS, I COULDN'T *MAKE MY MONEY BACK!*!" ... Everyone is looking at sportscards as a money maker, as a business ... and not as a hobby. And this isn't related to people who are doing it as a business because they *NEED* to ... it's people recklessly spending THOUSANDS each month on box breaks looking to hit the BEST card in the product simply to resell and make a profit.



The only spark we've REALLY seen in the hobby recently was when Nat went on his buying spree and caused inserts to go through the roof. Once he stopped, they've already settled back down. I don't know if we can count on another MULTI millionaire buying cards with no regard to shilling or astronomical prices being paid.

We see sparks with a set like Prizm, but it's all hype. Even most of the people on here who have any are simply buying them to grade and flip ... not actually *COLLECTING* them ... so they'll eventually dump them and hope for profit, and move on to the next set to hype and flip.



The hobby has changed so drastically over the past 5 years ... mostly for the worse. There are more scams than ever. No UD license. Panini products are watered down, overproduced and overpriced. MANY of the BIG collectors of the past 10 years have bailed on the hobby since everything has gotten so ridiculous. I've personally known MANY collectors over the years, who simply don't collect anymore. We don't see many people entering in the hobby solely to collect the cards. I can name about 5 people on Blowout who just simply popped up and started to post a lot recently with ton's of breaks and big card 'pickups' and they're right back on eBay to be sold for a profit, or graded and then back on ebay to flip.

Everything that's happened over the past 5 years has been simply a recipe for disaster.

It won't get better any time soon either...

Sadly, I agree for the most part. I'm one of the few "collectors" left, and I kind of hate how this hobby has changed in the last few years. It's become more of a business rather than a hobby to enjoy.

[thecomebacker]

Originally Posted by BoJackCards

Does anybody see exquisite stuff going down ever?

Price are already down a bit from last year's Peak. Could be correction from the spike last couple years. who knows?

[tristan20]

Originally Posted by thecomebacker

Price are already down a bit from last year's Peak. Could be correction from the spike last couple years. who knows?

Alot of the pumpers and manipulators have gone

[BoJackCards]

I just think the new stuff is junk. It all looks the same. Spent $100 on a box and lucky to get $40 back. Jerseys are over done. I like that prizm inserts are selling well. I'm tired of jerseys and autos getting all the love.

[BLawson87]

I agree with everything that has been said.. My only question is who is out there paying these big prices if it's nothing but flippers? Flippers paying a big price thinking they can get an even bigger price later?

[Wings]

Stick with guys like Jordan, Lebron, and Kobe if you want investments...

[tristan20]

Originally Posted by BLawson87

I agree with everything that has been said.. My only question is who is out there paying these big prices if it's nothing but flippers? Flippers paying a big price thinking they can get an even bigger price later?

High risk high reward

But I do know some crazy collectors that pay high for cards only to sell them back at 1/2 or even 1/3. Card laundering lol

[BLawson87]

Originally Posted by tristan20

High risk high reward

But I do know some crazy collectors that pay high for cards only to sell them back at 1/2 or even 1/3. Card laundering lol

Haha I hear ya. This is how I look at cards: I buy cards I like and want to keep, but I have a mindset of I'm always willing to part with pretty much anything I have if it blows up and becomes worth a lot more than what I originally paid for it. Example: I have 2 Tim Tebow rookie autos I bought within the past couple months. I love the guy and will more than likely keep at least one of them, but in the event we ever had another Tebow mania and I could then sell one or both for double of what I paid for it, you better believe it's gone! I guess I'm a collector with a flipper's mentality lol I dunno. I'm not in it strictly to make money but if anything I've collected becomes worth enough to where making some money is possible, then I'm probably going to move it. I have a few cards I will probably never ever sell, but I don't fall too much in love with them because I'm always willing to part with something if it means a profit.

[thecomebacker]

Originally Posted by tristan20

Alot of the pumpers and manipulators have gone

Right on! Still a few left, but much much better than last year.

[dasiegel]

I think a lot of pure collectors are missing something, one of the things that makes this hobby so great is how many ways you can collect. I've said this in other threads but I am half flipper half collector. I have a weakness for busting wax, which I think is a main stay of this hobby undoubtedly... taking the risk on a box or pack with the hope that you pull something awesome.

In 09 I busted a box of 07 Co-signers fball in Central Jersey. I didn't even collect fball but the price was too good, I pulled a 1/1 printing plate auto of Namath/Elway. I told the owner and he said some real, true, grade A talk, "There are very few things in this world, especially with all this technology that is a genuine surprise, but when you bust a pack of cards, you truly never know what will be in it."

But some people hate busting wax. They like supercollecting a player, or a team, or a category. I think we as collectors have to be more tolerant. It doesn't suck that some people are out there flipping cards, its just a newer part of the hobby. Anyone who doesn't like that can bypass it and collect, bust wax, sell lots, trade or anything else.

I also disagree with cards being a bad investment. I would agree that they are a very uncertain long term investment. But short term meaning 1 day to 3 years is fun and can be profitable if you are careful. Plus if you are a sports fan it give you players to root for in games that otherwise wouldn't matter because their play obviously relates to the card value.

[BLawson87]

Originally Posted by dasiegel

I think a lot of pure collectors are missing something, one of the things that makes this hobby so great is how many ways you can collect. I've said this in other threads but I am half flipper half collector. I have a weakness for busting wax, which I think is a main stay of this hobby undoubtedly... taking the risk on a box or pack with the hope that you pull something awesome.

In 09 I busted a box of 07 Co-signers fball in Central Jersey. I didn't even collect fball but the price was too good, I pulled a 1/1 printing plate auto of Namath/Elway. I told the owner and he said some real, true, grade A talk, "There are very few things in this world, especially with all this technology that is a genuine surprise, but when you bust a pack of cards, you truly never know what will be in it."

But some people hate busting wax. They like supercollecting a player, or a team, or a category. I think we as collectors have to be more tolerant. It doesn't suck that some people are out there flipping cards, its just a newer part of the hobby. Anyone who doesn't like that can bypass it and collect, bust wax, sell lots, trade or anything else.

I also disagree with cards being a bad investment. I would agree that they are a very uncertain long term investment. But short term meaning 1 day to 3 years is fun and can be profitable if you are careful. Plus if you are a sports fan it give you players to root for in games that otherwise wouldn't matter because their play obviously relates to the card value.

Exactly. It's kinda like playing fantasy sports, just with cards as your team lol. Also it's kinda like a mini stock market. I'm the same way you are, part collector, part flipper. I think cards can be an investment.. No investment is really guaranteed.. You could invest in the real stock market and lose everything it's just a matter of making smart moves and also getting a little lucky sometimes. I think certain cards, like Jordan Bulls autos, are solid choices for longer term investments.

[dmogull]

Originally Posted by yankeesfan24

There is no safe investment in the card market. The NBA could dissolve in 2 years and 10 years from now people would not even know who Durant was. (very hypothetical, but just proving a point that anything can happen). What if it came out that MJ used PED's during his career. Would his card values still be the same? In short, no.

MJ is one of the only people where I may actually say no, they wouldn't go down....they may stagnate a bit, but eventually keep going up when the storm has passed. He was caught in a multitude of scandals and bad press during/after his playing career and his cards never dipped...only went higher, lol.