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View Poll Results: Cracking Graded Cards To Re-Sell Ok??
Yes 160 75.83%
No 51 24.17%
Voters: 211. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 04-24-2013, 07:56 AM   #76 (permalink)
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No.

Because then you will have people buying up these BGS 7.5, BGS 8 PSA 8 and cracking them, then selling them on ebay as possible gem mints..
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Old 04-24-2013, 08:21 AM   #77 (permalink)
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Paul, you havent responded yet.

Did you ever come up with fees for your consignment business?

Also, how did your Antwan Jamison RARE ERROR Autographics sell?
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Old 04-24-2013, 08:26 AM   #78 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OMG View Post
I would let the seller know know the condition of the card when it was graded.

I've seen guys break some jordan 7.5 autos and resell them as mint and thats just wrong imo
but what if the person buying doesn't care about grading. I know tons of people who think it is a scam.

If i buy a card and like it I could care less if it was previously a bgs7.
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Old 04-24-2013, 08:49 AM   #79 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by xavieronly1 View Post
True business practice: disclose any material information. If the information would change the buyer's decision, then it must disclosed.
Thank you. I intended to edit my post and add that word. I appreciate you helping fill in the blank that I omitted.

Yes, any material piece of information that would affect a buyer's decision should be disclosed.
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Old 04-24-2013, 09:35 AM   #80 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by paul06901 View Post
I don't follow? They determine a card is altered due to measurements and scale when compared to 100% legit versions.


Grading is entirely subjective, and that's why this thread is pointless to try to say that it's "wrong" to crack out a graded card and sell.


If you were selling a card that was graded a BGS 2 and cracked out ... wouldn't the buyer be upset if the damage was not noted?!



That's why this thread is so pointless, everything is subjective!
You don't follow because it shows your position is wrong.

When Beckett deems a card altered they have no clue 100% whether it is altered or not. It is there subjective opinion. Just like a grade.

This is proven by the fact that they have not been consistent in both cases. This the situation is the same.
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Old 04-24-2013, 10:20 AM   #81 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by groundsupport View Post
No.

Because then you will have people buying up these BGS 7.5, BGS 8 PSA 8 and cracking them, then selling them on ebay as possible gem mints..
This already happens.

I once had a card graded BGS 10 and listed it on ebay. It got a best offer of $85. I decided to bust it out of the case and sold it for $125 a month later.

The market is messed up.
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Old 04-24-2013, 10:21 AM   #82 (permalink)
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I find it amazing that penny actually said- yea, if 100 people think it's okay and only 1 doesn't shouldn't you respect that one?

I mean, is this real life?

In the past- yes I have purchased graded cards, busted them out and then sold them. If that is seen as shady or a scammer then so be it, but don't try to force your views on everyone else. Because we don't see it that way.
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Old 04-24-2013, 10:30 AM   #83 (permalink)
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I find it amazing that penny actually said- yea, if 100 people think it's okay and only 1 doesn't shouldn't you respect that one?

I mean, is this real life?

In the past- yes I have purchased graded cards, busted them out and then sold them. If that is seen as shady or a scammer then so be it, but don't try to force your views on everyone else. Because we don't see it that way.
The concensus doesn't equate to correct. The current firearm legislation in Washington cites some 90% American approval (I want to see the actual study), while the changes attempted are protected by the Constitution.

A majority simply proves to me that our hobby lacks proper ethical and moral judgement. As I've mentioned before, the automotive resale business has the 'lemon law' to protect buyers in this very situation. Our hobby lacks a legal doctrine, so the majority feel that failure to disclose is immaterial.

I disagree. I will continue to sell with the highest level of transparency. I always provide front and back scans. I always list any damage that I see and I would (I will not bust a case for resale) always disclose material information that I know and the buyer (would consider material) would not know.
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Last edited by fullmetal; 04-24-2013 at 10:38 AM. Reason: grammar
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Old 04-24-2013, 10:33 AM   #84 (permalink)
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fullmetal- this is the way I see it.

If I have something, and keep it any number of days before selling it to you. Let's say I just keep it in my home the whole time. Or I send it for grading, it comes back graded whatever- and I bust it out and sell it to you. Or I buy it graded off eBay, bust it out and sell it to you. What truly matters here is that when YOU receive the card, you will inspect it. You will decide if it is acceptable or not, correct?
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Old 04-24-2013, 10:33 AM   #85 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ManInTheMirror View Post
I find it amazing that penny actually said- yea, if 100 people think it's okay and only 1 doesn't shouldn't you respect that one?

I mean, is this real life?

In the past- yes I have purchased graded cards, busted them out and then sold them. If that is seen as shady or a scammer then so be it, but don't try to force your views on everyone else. Because we don't see it that way.
I have no issues with you doing this so as long as a buyer has every right to return item for full refund when they arent satisfied with the condition of the card.

If I buy a card and have it RCR'd and it doesnt come back a 9.5, I should be able to return it for a full refund!!
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Old 04-24-2013, 10:44 AM   #86 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ManInTheMirror View Post
fullmetal- this is the way I see it.

If I have something, and keep it any number of days before selling it to you. Let's say I just keep it in my home the whole time. Or I send it for grading, it comes back graded whatever- and I bust it out and sell it to you. Or I buy it graded off eBay, bust it out and sell it to you. What truly matters here is that when YOU receive the card, you will inspect it. You will decide if it is acceptable or not, correct?
If you are personally aware of a professional opinion on the item then you should disclose. That is my belief.

If you wipe a fingerprint from a card surface and sell I don't see the need to disclose. That information is immaterial to me. Each person has a different opinion of what matters, but I can say with certainty that I would want to know if the seller knows the outcome of a professional opinion.

I might still want the card, but it could provide me a better understanding of the item, allow me to make a more informed offer and also save me from submitting for grading.

I won't debase the opinion of others on this topic. I can simply state what I agree with, what I disagree with and what I will continue to do for my potential customers. I think in the long run my decision will prove advantageous for me.
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Old 04-24-2013, 10:46 AM   #87 (permalink)
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Our hobby lacks a legal doctrine, so the majority feel that failure to disclose is immaterial.
Yeah, that pretty much is the way this hobby is going. In most transaction, it is not a big money purchase. No law would be written just to protect this industry/hobby (other than those rules related to general selling/buying). Here, people think as long as I don't get caught, it is "fine" to do.

Years ago, people who did this would not go to public forum to argue. Today, people would come here to say "so what? what are you going to do about it? Are you going to call police?" and list tons of examples to support their "rightful" doing.
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Old 04-24-2013, 10:49 AM   #88 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by fullmetal View Post
If you are personally aware of a professional opinion on the item then you should disclose. That is my belief.
I understand that is how you feel, and I agree to an extent. But the fact that GRADER A on DAY X would grade this card an 8 and the same guy on another day would give it a 9.5 ehhhhh it doesn't really mean so much to me. So I guess I'm saying I don't quite respect their "personal" opinion for gold.
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Old 04-24-2013, 10:55 AM   #89 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ManInTheMirror View Post
I understand that is how you feel, and I agree to an extent. But the fact that GRADER A on DAY X would grade this card an 8 and the same guy on another day would give it a 9.5 ehhhhh it doesn't really mean so much to me. So I guess I'm saying I don't quite respect their "personal" opinion for gold.
That is why I used the phrase 'professional opinion.' Many professionals are trained in their area and have an expertise level higher than the normal Joe or Bob, but their expertise isn't definitive.

A professional plumber fixes a leak and most can agree if he did or did not fix the problem.

A professional publisher elects to not publish a book because of low quality or lack of perceived marketability. Not everyone will agree with that professional's action.

I understand your point.
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Old 04-24-2013, 10:58 AM   #90 (permalink)
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So if I crack and resub a card graded bgs 9 and get a 9.5, should I disclose it was previously a 9? Curious what others think on that.

Personally, as long as you don't describe condition as better than what the card was graded, I don't see the harm. If it was graded an 8 and you state card is nm/mt, what's the problem? Buyer will judge for themselves if your description was accurate for their purposes.
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Old 04-24-2013, 10:58 AM   #91 (permalink)
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Will a card really grade an 8 one day and a 9.5 the next?

Doubtful.
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:00 AM   #92 (permalink)
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So if I crack and resub a card graded bgs 9 and get a 9.5, should I disclose it was previously a 9? Curious what others think on that.

Personally, as long as you don't describe condition as better than what the card was graded, I don't see the harm. If it was graded an 8 and you state card is nm/mt, what's the problem? Buyer will judge for themselves if your description was accurate for their purposes.
How many people list a card as nm/mt or better on eBay. When you but a raw card on eBay listed as that do you truly believe it is a bgs 8?
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:02 AM   #93 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by murrke03 View Post
Will a card really grade an 8 one day and a 9.5 the next?

Doubtful.
It was an exaggerated point.

fullmetal you are a pleasure to converse with.
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:03 AM   #94 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by murrke03 View Post
Will a card really grade an 8 one day and a 9.5 the next?

Doubtful.
I had a psa 8 that got a bgs 9.5 the next week. It happens. And no, I didn't doctor it or even clean a smudge.
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:03 AM   #95 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by murrke03 View Post
How many people list a card as nm/mt or better on eBay. When you but a raw card on eBay listed as that do you truly believe it is a bgs 8?
I don't expect it to be mint/gem mint, that's for sure.

Too many folks expect all the raw cards they buy to be gem mint...that's not realistic.
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:04 AM   #96 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by murrke03 View Post
How many people list a card as nm/mt or better on eBay. When you but a raw card on eBay listed as that do you truly believe it is a bgs 8?
Even the term "nm/mt" has no clear definition. One can even get away that Beckett is using nm/mt to refer as BGS 8. I say "nm/mt" is anything but perfect mint, so even a BGS 1 is "near" mint.
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:07 AM   #97 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ManInTheMirror View Post
I understand that is how you feel, and I agree to an extent. But the fact that GRADER A on DAY X would grade this card an 8 and the same guy on another day would give it a 9.5 ehhhhh it doesn't really mean so much to me. So I guess I'm saying I don't quite respect their "personal" opinion for gold.
I think a 1.5 bump in grade or greater would only apply to vintage as different grading companies deduct for different things and PSA has qualifiers. I think you would be hard pressed to find a modern card that got bumped from a 8 to a 9.5. Grading is subjective, but they are the experts when all is said and done.
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:07 AM   #98 (permalink)
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When you have full disclosure of items listed with conditions, it saves you the seller the time and headaches from returns, problems, dissatisfactions and customer loyalty. It saves the buyer the time and headaches as well.

The more accurate you are about your item, the less likely you open the door for a return, refund, confusion and misleading information.

Isnt that the point of selling?
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:07 AM   #99 (permalink)
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I don't expect it to be mint/gem mint, that's for sure.
Well that's not what I asked.
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:12 AM   #100 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Orangejello727 View Post
When you have full disclosure of items listed with conditions, it saves you the seller the time and headaches from returns, problems, dissatisfactions and customer loyalty. It saves the buyer the time and headaches as well.

The more accurate you are about your item, the less likely you open the door for a return, refund, confusion and misleading information.

Isnt that the point of selling?
I don't know why more people don't get this concept. You're one of the few people that is actually honest about condition.
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