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Old 08-01-2010, 01:47 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default I Guess I'll be keeping my Contenders Set.....

It's moron sellers like this guy that ruin any type of value in the hobby.....

2009/10 PANINI CONTENDERS COMPLETE RC AUTO SET TYREKE - eBay (item 180536310852 end time Jul-26-10 18:00:12 PDT)
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Old 08-01-2010, 01:58 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Why do you think that auction/seller devalues the market? Can you provide some detail so I understand where you are coming from. Thanks.
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Old 08-01-2010, 02:04 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Why do you think that auction/seller devalues the market? Can you provide some detail so I understand where you are coming from. Thanks.
Probably cause if the seller just sold each card by itself he would have gotten the $306 from just the Tyreke, Griffin, Curry, and Jennings alone
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Old 08-01-2010, 09:50 AM   #4 (permalink)
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that completed listing will now be a lowballer's armory during negotiations
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Old 08-01-2010, 10:36 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Probably cause if the seller just sold each card by itself he would have gotten the $306 from just the Tyreke, Griffin, Curry, and Jennings alone
If you take the recent sell value of those cards individually it's probably more so in the $265 range.....considering (for whatever reason) sets tend to go for under the total individual resale value the $306 price should not be all that surprising.
There are some more decent cards and some SP's - but also a lot of $1-3 type auto's.


That being said - I would have thought it would go for a bit more. And I really don't see how in any possible way someone could blame the seller.....he's probably pissed too. All he did was put his cards/set up for auction on the open market.
I mean no one bid when he had it up for $399. If you need cash or want to sell - at a certain point you usually just let it run on auction and hope for the best.

Not that anyone's to "blame".....but why would it be any seller's fault that buyer's are paying pennies on the dollar for basketball cards this year?
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Old 08-01-2010, 10:38 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by The Madbacker View Post
It's moron sellers like this guy that ruin any type of value in the hobby.....

2009/10 PANINI CONTENDERS COMPLETE RC AUTO SET TYREKE - eBay (item 180536310852 end time Jul-26-10 18:00:12 PDT)
Actually, this is what makes the hobby. I personally enjoy benefitting from these folks that must move product for immediate cash. Morons huh...might want to check the mirror guy. Just because you spent probably 750 putting your set together when it first came out. Instead of waiting and putting the set together for considerably less. Tyreke's line graph in the set is like the stock market from march '99 to March '09......LOL - mirror
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Old 08-01-2010, 10:48 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by The Madbacker View Post
It's moron sellers like this guy that ruin any type of value in the hobby.....

2009/10 PANINI CONTENDERS COMPLETE RC AUTO SET TYREKE - eBay (item 180536310852 end time Jul-26-10 18:00:12 PDT)
You're calling someone a moron for what their auction ends for ? Why didn't you buy it then and flip it yourself since it seems you think its worth so much more ?

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If you take the recent sell value of those cards individually it's probably more so in the $265 range.....considering (for whatever reason) sets tend to go for under the total individual resale value the $306 price should not be all that surprising.
There are some more decent cards and some SP's - but also a lot of $1-3 type auto's.


That being said - I would have thought it would go for a bit more. And I really don't see how in any possible way someone could blame the seller.....he's probably pissed too. All he did was put his cards/set up for auction on the open market.
I mean no one bid when he had it up for $399. If you need cash or want to sell - at a certain point you usually just let it run on auction and hope for the best.

Not that anyone's to "blame".....but why would it be any seller's fault that buyer's are paying pennies on the dollar for basketball cards this year?
Exactly right. If nobody bid at $399. then what does that tell you about the current market for that set ? Guess the guy really needed some funds so he relisted auction style and let the bidders decide what the current value is on that set.
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Old 08-01-2010, 10:56 AM   #8 (permalink)
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It all comes down to there is no nba games playing right now. If he would of waited till the season starts it would of gone for more. I never understand people selling stuff in the off season. Now is the time to dump baseball then next month Football and then Basketball. Way to early to be selling Basketball right now unless it's the 2010-2011 class.
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:00 AM   #9 (permalink)
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If everyone keeps prices up then buyers will have no choice but to pay the asking price, it's the "Burbank Sportscards" method of selling.

All it takes is one dip to lower his prices and devalue items for every other seller.

I realize that most of you are vultures, picking at carcasses for what you want and considering saving $1.00 a GREAT SUCCESS but it kills the retail aspect of the business.

It's the flea market mentality that drives me nuts. If I want something I just buy it with little hesitation as to the price. It's you commoners that haggle over $2 that make me crazy.

Everybody is so cheap nowadays.
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:05 AM   #10 (permalink)
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If everyone keeps prices up then buyers will have no choice but to pay the asking price, it's the "Burbank Sportscards" method of selling.

All it takes is one dip to lower his prices and devalue items for every other seller.

I realize that most of you are vultures, picking at carcasses for what you want and considering saving $1.00 a GREAT SUCCESS but it kills the retail aspect of the business.

It's the flea market mentality that drives me nuts. If I want something I just buy it with little hesitation as to the price. It's you commoners that haggle over $2 that make me crazy.

Everybody is so cheap nowadays.
And here is the reason for the drama....

09/10 Contenders SET 1-150 Tyreke Evans Auto ALL SP RCs - eBay (item 380254610795 end time Jul-29-10 09:17:14 PDT)
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:07 AM   #11 (permalink)
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If everyone keeps prices up then buyers will have no choice but to pay the asking price.

All it takes is one dip to lower his prices and devalue items for every other seller.

It's the flea market mentality that drives me nuts.
I agree with all of this ^^^.
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:18 AM   #12 (permalink)
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If everyone keeps prices up then buyers will have no choice but to pay the asking price, it's the "Burbank Sportscards" method of selling.

All it takes is one dip to lower his prices and devalue items for every other seller.

I realize that most of you are vultures, picking at carcasses for what you want and considering saving $1.00 a GREAT SUCCESS but it kills the retail aspect of the business.

It's the flea market mentality that drives me nuts. If I want something I just buy it with little hesitation as to the price. It's you commoners that haggle over $2 that make me crazy.

Everybody is so cheap nowadays.
LMAO you say this tongue in cheek I hope as you of all people should not be posting this based on your buying history.
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:19 AM   #13 (permalink)
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I agree with all of this ^^^.
Items are worth what people are willing to pay. The guy obviously had a fixed price on the item and NOBODY wanted it. People like to move or turn inventory so why blame the guy for listing auction style.

While I get the OP hates "commoners", but people who list things at 3x or more over market value on eBay arent perfect either. Not sure why you feel ANYONE would want that set for $850. Trying to take someone to the cleaners on a basketball set is worse than someone selling it and letting the market decide the price isnt it?
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:29 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Items are worth what people are willing to pay.
Your comment is only half true. The other half is:

Items are worth what people are willing to sell them for.

And to further comment on that selling price and the winning bidder...How do we know he won it for what "he was willing to pay"?

I have brought this up before. Just because an auction ends at a certain amount does not mean that's all the winning bidder was willing to pay. I will guess that in 95% of all auctions, the winning bidder actually bid more than what the item sold for. Therefore, according to your post above, cards in all of these auctions are worth more than the final sales price.

Just recently, I have bid on a few auctions where I place bids in excess of $500. Each of those auctions I won for under $200. Now, are those cards only worth less than $200, or are they worth at least $500, "what I was willing to pay"?
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:35 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Your comment is only half true. The other half is:

Items are worth what people are willing to sell them for.

And to further comment on that selling price and the winning bidder...How do we know he won it for what "he was willing to pay"?

I have brought this up before. Just because an auction ends at a certain amount does not mean that's all the winning bidder was willing to pay. I will guess that in 95% of all auctions, the winning bidder actually bid more than what the item sold for. Therefore, according to your post above, cards in all of these auctions are worth more than the final sales price.

Just recently, I have bid on a few auctions where I place bids in excess of $500. Each of those auctions I won for under $200. Now, are those cards only worth less than $200, or are they worth at least $500, "what I was willing to pay"?


hmmmmm, i would have to say less than $200 seeing as you were the only person willing to pay more than $500, hence you winning the auctions for only $200!!! does that make sense to you????
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:35 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Your comment is only half true. The other half is:

Items are worth what people are willing to sell them for.

And to further comment on that selling price and the winning bidder...How do we know he won it for what "he was willing to pay"?

I have brought this up before. Just because an auction ends at a certain amount does not mean that's all the winning bidder was willing to pay. I will guess that in 95% of all auctions, the winning bidder actually bid more than what the item sold for. Therefore, according to your post above, cards in all of these auctions are worth more than the final sales price.

Just recently, I have bid on a few auctions where I place bids in excess of $500. Each of those auctions I won for under $200. Now, are those cards only worth less than $200, or are they worth at least $500, "what I was willing to pay"?
Pretty simple answer. To YOU they were worth $500. but to the rest of the buying public at that time they were only worth less than $200. If something sells for $200. then it's sell value at that time is $200.
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:37 AM   #17 (permalink)
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hmmmmm, i would have to say less than $200 seeing as you were the only person willing to pay more than $500, hence you winning the auctions for only $200!!! does that make sense to you????
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Pretty simple answer. To YOU they were worth $500. but to the rest of the buying public at that time they were only worth less than $200. If something sells for $200. then it's sell value at that time is $200.
Okay...so does the definition need to change then? Perhaps something like this:

An item is only worth what someone else is willing to pay as long as another someone else is willing to pay that same amount or only "slightly" less?

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Old 08-01-2010, 11:41 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Okay...so does the definition need to change then? Perhaps something like this:

An item is only worth what someone else is willing to pay as long as another someone else is willing to pay that same amount or only "slightly" less?

Nope no change needed. I'm pretty comfortable with my reply of it is what it is at time of sale but you can spin it however you'd like if it makes you feel right about the matter.
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:56 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Nope no change needed. I'm pretty comfortable with my reply of it is what it is at time of sale but you can spin it however you'd like if it makes you feel right about the matter.
LOL...Care to attempt to define the "value of a card"? I'd love to see your version of the definition.
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:56 AM   #20 (permalink)
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I pulled a 2/2 Darren Collison die-cut out of 09/10 Elite back in March. It was a sweet card, not auto'd, but very low S/N, and I had the card S/N'd to his jersey number.

Someone on this forum wanted to buy it and asked for a price. I came up with $400 - based on what I knew about the market, which was nothing, I collected years ago when Beckett numbers meant something and was new back to the hobby. I did some looking on Ebay completed sales, and the $400 was higher than everything else, but I thought what the heck, the buyer can counter my offer. The buyer never responded to the $400 offer.

So I posted the card on Ebay a couple of weeks later, $0.99 7 day auction ending Sunday night. This is during the NBA season, fairly soon after Collison's name was starting to be mentioned in Rookie of the Year talk. Perfect time to sell!

Lots of people were watching the auction, it had 75-80 views, 15-20 watchers, and it was gaining momentum into the final day of the auction. I even told relatives to watch the item, it should sell pretty good. Bidding was very active in the last few minutes of the auction, going back and forth between 3-4 buyers, bumping up the final auction price to a grand total of.....

$24.61.

$24.61 is what that Collison card was worth on that day to the 10's of many buyers that were watching the auction. My $400 number was a complete fabrication in my own mind and not based in reality. I learned a lot about the current basketball card market that day.
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:59 AM   #21 (permalink)
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If something sells for $200. then it's sell value at that time is $200.
So here's a question for you:

If the same card that sold at auction for $200 would have been placed in a BIN setting instead for $500, and someone bought it for $500, what's the card worth?

I can absolutely prove that there are recent cards that sold for less than I was willing to bid. A LOT less. So I don't believe your comment above regarding "sell value" is accurate. I think your comment above is more a definition of a seller not knowing what his cards are worth.
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Old 08-01-2010, 12:08 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Huge difference in reality and perception. You can think what you wish to sell is worth $500. but if nobody is paying more than $200. then guess what ?

Using common sense and your numbers here is reality. The fact that ONE person is willing to pay $500 for something that the rest of the buying public will only pay $200 does not make the item worth $500. if everyone else is getting theirs at $200. It just makes the guy paying $500. look stupid for paying $500. for something he can buy at $200.
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Old 08-01-2010, 12:12 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Huge difference in reality and perception. You can think what you wish to sell is worth $500. but if nobody is paying more than $200. then guess what ?

Using common sense and your numbers here is reality. The fact that ONE person is willing to pay $500 for something that the rest of the buying public will only pay $200 does not make the item worth $500. if everyone else is getting theirs at $200. It just makes the guy paying $500. look stupid for paying $500. for something he can buy at $200.
What if the "rest of the buying public" is not involved?

So what if only two people bid on that card? Me at $500 and the other guy at $200. The auction started at 99cents. Is the card worth $200 because 2 people were willing to pay that much? Does it only take two people to determine the card's worth since you're saying 1 is not enough? Had I not seen the auction, and it sold for 99cents, would that same card only be worth 99cents?
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Old 08-01-2010, 12:22 PM   #24 (permalink)
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What if the "rest of the buying public" is not involved?

So what if only two people bid on that card? Me at $500 and the other guy at $200. The auction started at 99cents. Is the card worth $200 because 2 people were willing to pay that much? Does it only take two people to determine the card's worth since you're saying 1 is not enough? Had I not seen the auction, and it sold for 99cents, would that same card only be worth 99cents?
What ifs do not factor in to reality or my previous post.
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Old 08-01-2010, 12:22 PM   #25 (permalink)
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What if the "rest of the buying public" is not involved?

So what if only two people bid on that card? Me at $500 and the other guy at $200. The auction started at 99cents. Is the card worth $200 because 2 people were willing to pay that much? Does it only take two people to determine the card's worth since you're saying 1 is not enough? Had I not seen the auction, and it sold for 99cents, would that same card only be worth 99cents?
If there were only 2 people bidding on the card, it is probably a pretty crappy card to start with. 99.9% of the time cards sell for what they are really worth within the card collecting community (true market value) and yes occasionally there is an exception to the rule when a card sells for considerably more or less than the realized market value but again key word there is EXCEPTION.
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