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Old 02-13-2012, 09:34 PM   #376 (permalink)
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I'd hate to keep busting low risk/low reward product all year just to bankroll for TTT. Don't get me wrong, I love TTT, but I think it'd be a bit boring to keep doing prospecting/set building products all year just to save up for a master case in Aug/Sep. I'd like to see us mix in a few bigger hit products along the way like Archives, Museum or Tribute just for a change. If we get to TTT's release and fall short on cash for a master case, then we could do an extra funds break. Maybe a Bowman and an Archives case in May?
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Old 02-13-2012, 10:28 PM   #377 (permalink)
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I'd hate to keep busting low risk/low reward product all year just to bankroll for TTT. Don't get me wrong, I love TTT, but I think it'd be a bit boring to keep doing prospecting/set building products all year just to save up for a master case in Aug/Sep. I'd like to see us mix in a few bigger hit products along the way like Archives, Museum or Tribute just for a change. If we get to TTT's release and fall short on cash for a master case, then we could do an extra funds break. Maybe a Bowman and an Archives case in May?
I suggest that we Technically skip a month by not breaking anything in April (Tribute is the best Product hands down for the month. However not wise for a club because many will get the short end of the stick...unless the Yankee's owner wants to share, LOL) .... pay due for April or double up in May and break

1 case of Bowman (beginning of the Month)
1 case Archives (end of Month)

I am not feeling Museum. I would rather wait for another weak product release month and break Museum
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Old 02-13-2012, 11:34 PM   #378 (permalink)
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Keep throwing the ideas out.

The only problem I have (and this is nothing against Mike) is bankrolling too much money. I was part of a football break where this led to problems.

I personally don't like skipping months, but that will be up to the group.

Right now we have approximately $900 in bankroll. Figure the team auctions essentially pay for shipping and fees (estimate)

$900 rollover (plus whatever the codes sell for) + monthly fees for Mar/April/May (22*45*3)= $2970 (estimate)

So $3870- $850(Heritage/March)= $3020 to be spent for April/May (estimate).

$3020 - $815 (Bowman Jumbo/May) = $2205 for April/rollover

I also have heard from a people with interest in teams that haven't committed yet, so these numbers may grow.

Last edited by gergs1134; 02-14-2012 at 05:49 AM. Reason: math at 0300
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Old 02-14-2012, 05:46 AM   #379 (permalink)
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Also, mgugs has said he will be out of the country for the middle portion of March. We won't be able to bust the Heritage until he returns late March or an alternate is arranged.
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Old 02-14-2012, 08:25 AM   #380 (permalink)
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Yeah I will be in Italy from 3/14-3/24

Technically I do not leave until 6pm on 3/14 but there is no way Id have time to bust, sort, package, ship in between 1pm and 3pm when the car picks us up.

Basically our options are [1] break something else, [2] break Heritage at the end of the month or [3] hope that someone like Houdini, Pat, etc would be willing to handle this club for March's break. My only minor issue with #3 is that I don't want to send a gift payment of $850 - $900 to someone so that they can order and ship, just because it may set off a flag from paypal.

Also, I am with gergs on not banking too much $$$. Between this club, the Bowman club, and my own personal stuff that all filters through one paypal account, its already time consuming to make sure I have all rollover balances straight, etc. However .... personally Id be all for opening multiple Bowman cases come May

Then again, I would also like to do some high end product as well, so I guess in the end, I am not very helpful
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Old 02-14-2012, 08:27 AM   #381 (permalink)
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to solve the bank roll issue.. I think we should do 2 cases of Bowman or Archive (not both). 2 cases of either March/April/May Product. If we case figure out what to break for March-May, then we can vote on what Month/Product to break multi-cases of ??? your thoughts (anyone)..... finding a product for April is our issue

March- Hertiage (already agreed)?
April- ?
May-Bowman ?
June-Archive ?

I am not expert on the movement of product prices after release. If we have enough money in the bank (rollover) to at least pre-order Archive in May but break in June. That might save us a few pennies and also solve the dilemma of chosing to break Bowman over Archive in May
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Old 02-14-2012, 08:32 AM   #382 (permalink)
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Yeah I will be in Italy from 3/14-3/24


Basically our options are [1] break something else, [2] break Heritage at the end of the month or [3] hope that someone like Houdini, Pat, etc would be willing to handle this club for March's break.....
I can wait until the end of the month to break Heritage. I pick option [2]
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Old 02-14-2012, 09:02 AM   #383 (permalink)
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I'm fine with waiting until after Mike gets back from his trip to break Heritage.

I'm against breaking multiple cases of Bowman in May(if it is voted as the product we are breaking) for the same reason people are railing against doing Tribute in April. If Bowman wins as the product that is fine but it needs to remain at 1 case from group funds.
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Old 02-14-2012, 11:32 AM   #384 (permalink)
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since I missed out can I get the Reds backup ?
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Old 02-14-2012, 12:37 PM   #385 (permalink)
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I would think that it's a good idea to break things that have "hits" from most of the MLB teams so there is interest in filling all the team slots in the breaks.

Going with Heritage, Tribute, Museum might be great for the Braves/Yanks/Dodgers/Sox/Cubs/Giants/Cards owners, but where's the incentive for someone who has the Marlins, Rockies, Astros, Royals, Brewers? Those teams don't have big hits in products that have hits of players from the 50s/60s.

So I don't mind a couple cases through the year that are oriented towards older teams, it's not fair to them to bust cases that have nothing but Rockies, Marlins, Nationals prospect autos.

But there needs to be a balance. I raked on the Finest case (Royals), got jack squadouche on the 2012 case, and expect to get jack squadouche on the Heritage case. But don't expect someone to keep paying monthly when you only bust stuff 25% of the time that benefits them. It needs to be close to 50%.

My $.02. Most Bowman products are fair to everyone. Tribute/Museum and Heritage, not so much. And I can go back through the votes and comments and tell you exactly who has the "older" teams. Just keep it balanced.
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Old 02-14-2012, 12:42 PM   #386 (permalink)
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I'm fine with waiting until after Mike gets back from his trip to break Heritage.

I'm against breaking multiple cases of Bowman in May(if it is voted as the product we are breaking) for the same reason people are railing against doing Tribute in April. If Bowman wins as the product that is fine but it needs to remain at 1 case from group funds.
so what do you propose as a possible solution to prevent a huge bank (rollover) issue before we get to TTT at the end of the Year 2012.........

We can add a box or 2 of 2011 TTT for breaks in March and April ????
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Old 02-14-2012, 12:46 PM   #387 (permalink)
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I would think that it's a good idea to break things that have "hits" from most of the MLB teams so there is interest in filling all the team slots in the breaks.

Going with Heritage, Tribute, Museum might be great for the Braves/Yanks/Dodgers/Sox/Cubs/Giants/Cards owners, but where's the incentive for someone who has the Marlins, Rockies, Astros, Royals, Brewers? Those teams don't have big hits in products that have hits of players from the 50s/60s.

So I don't mind a couple cases through the year that are oriented towards older teams, it's not fair to them to bust cases that have nothing but Rockies, Marlins, Nationals prospect autos.

But there needs to be a balance. I raked on the Finest case (Royals), got jack squadouche on the 2012 case, and expect to get jack squadouche on the Heritage case. But don't expect someone to keep paying monthly when you only bust stuff 25% of the time that benefits them. It needs to be close to 50%.

My $.02. Most Bowman products are fair to everyone. Tribute/Museum and Heritage, not so much. And I can go back through the votes and comments and tell you exactly who has the "older" teams. Just keep it balanced.
what would you break for April that's fair to most teams ??
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Old 02-14-2012, 06:54 PM   #388 (permalink)
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what would you break for April that's fair to most teams ??
Bowman/BC seems to be the most fair product to all teams. Of any year really. I voted for 2010 BC case for March and there aren't even any Royals autos that I know of. It would have been a cheap case so you could pile up $$$ for 2x Bowman cases in May. Which, again, looks to be a fair product for all involved.

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1. Products will be proposed and chosen by members.

* Products can come from previous years.
* High End products will be included when the budget permits.
* Over time breaks need to cover the entire spectrum from prospects products to HOF driven products.
I think when Bowman is released, a club should be getting 2 cases minimum. And a TTT master case towards the end of the year. Everything else should be haggled about in between.
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Old 02-14-2012, 09:02 PM   #389 (permalink)
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Got the topps wrappers today.

Thanks!
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Old 02-14-2012, 10:18 PM   #390 (permalink)
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Looking over the checklist for 2010 Bowman Chrome...that might be the best break for the club...I vote 2010 Bowman Chrome for April
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Old 02-14-2012, 10:57 PM   #391 (permalink)
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I was hoping people would come to more of a consensus on what we should do. Not everyone is going to be happy every month unfortunately (I know I wasn't thrilled with Topps Series 1, but that's life), however it was stated at the beginning that we would do all ranges of product. Eventually we need to do a high end break (will probably do 2 during the course of the year).

Just for everyones information, a master case of TTT ran us about $3250 last year. Pretty difficult for us to do this and still break something each month. So that can pretty much be thrown out the window.

A lot of people (myself included) are against doing half cases or individual boxes.

So here are our options (2012 Heritage is already set for March and 2012 Bowman is already set for May) there wasn't an official poll for Bowman, but if you go back in the thread, a large number of people indicated they wanted 2012 Bowman for May. I will post a poll if need be, but think we can just do it here if we get enough input:

1) High end master case in April (Tribute or Museum Collection)

2) Continue as is, break Heritage in March, nothing in April and 1 case of 2012 Bowman/ 1 case of 2012 Archives in May (2012 Bowman will be the constant, the other case can be interchangeable). This means high end product in June or July.

3) Do a half case of Tribute/Museum Collection with club funds and those that wish to add funds can do so in April. (This would mean only 2012 Bowman for May)
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Old 02-14-2012, 11:10 PM   #392 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by BigSeph View Post
I would think that it's a good idea to break things that have "hits" from most of the MLB teams so there is interest in filling all the team slots in the breaks.

Going with Heritage, Tribute, Museum might be great for the Braves/Yanks/Dodgers/Sox/Cubs/Giants/Cards owners, but where's the incentive for someone who has the Marlins, Rockies, Astros, Royals, Brewers? Those teams don't have big hits in products that have hits of players from the 50s/60s.

So I don't mind a couple cases through the year that are oriented towards older teams, it's not fair to them to bust cases that have nothing but Rockies, Marlins, Nationals prospect autos.

But there needs to be a balance. I raked on the Finest case (Royals), got jack squadouche on the 2012 case, and expect to get jack squadouche on the Heritage case. But don't expect someone to keep paying monthly when you only bust stuff 25% of the time that benefits them. It needs to be close to 50%.

My $.02. Most Bowman products are fair to everyone. Tribute/Museum and Heritage, not so much. And I can go back through the votes and comments and tell you exactly who has the "older" teams. Just keep it balanced.
It can't be 50/50, just due to the shear cost of the high end cases. We will probably be able to do 2 high end cases over the course of the year. The rest of the time it will be $600-1000 cases. Just the limitations of the club.
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Old 02-14-2012, 11:11 PM   #393 (permalink)
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My vote is for #3.
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Old 02-15-2012, 11:07 AM   #394 (permalink)
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It can't be 50/50, just due to the shear cost of the high end cases. We will probably be able to do 2 high end cases over the course of the year. The rest of the time it will be $600-1000 cases. Just the limitations of the club.
What's the incentive for someone with the Marlins/Rockies/Nationals to participate in a club that breaks Museum or Archives that has about zero hits for them? Same with Heritage. I could buy team slots in case breaks when Bowman is released and do better than donating money to Yankees fans in this club for Museum Collection.

I think you're missing my point. If the club doesn't do 2 high-ends (or more) during the early season, you can double up on Bowman cases in May and get a master case of TTT towards the end of the year. And both of those products are overwhelmingly fair to everyone.

If you guys want to break Topps Archives all year long that's fine. Just don't expect someone with the Royals/Rockies/Marlins to stick around and pay dues all year when you're busting Heritage and Archives and Museum Collection.

And I would think that the more people you get to pay monthly dues (for "newer" teams), the more likely it is that you can bust a master case of TTT at the end of the year.

Just stating my opinion, not trying to tick anyone off. You can be "old team" oriented and have a small club that can't pay for a master case of TTT, or you can be "old and new team" oriented and fair to everyone and have a larger club that can get a master case of TTT every year.

How many of those "1963" coins from Heritage are going to go to a Rockies or Marlins owner? None.
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Old 02-15-2012, 02:43 PM   #395 (permalink)
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I actually agree with him... Not sure why his option wasn't on the list to be voted on. I want to bust product that has chances for hits (Auto/Relics) for a majority of teams not just a few.

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What's the incentive for someone with the Marlins/Rockies/Nationals to participate in a club that breaks Museum or Archives that has about zero hits for them? Same with Heritage. I could buy team slots in case breaks when Bowman is released and do better than donating money to Yankees fans in this club for Museum Collection.

I think you're missing my point. If the club doesn't do 2 high-ends (or more) during the early season, you can double up on Bowman cases in May and get a master case of TTT towards the end of the year. And both of those products are overwhelmingly fair to everyone.

If you guys want to break Topps Archives all year long that's fine. Just don't expect someone with the Royals/Rockies/Marlins to stick around and pay dues all year when you're busting Heritage and Archives and Museum Collection.

And I would think that the more people you get to pay monthly dues (for "newer" teams), the more likely it is that you can bust a master case of TTT at the end of the year.

Just stating my opinion, not trying to tick anyone off. You can be "old team" oriented and have a small club that can't pay for a master case of TTT, or you can be "old and new team" oriented and fair to everyone and have a larger club that can get a master case of TTT every year.

How many of those "1963" coins from Heritage are going to go to a Rockies or Marlins owner? None.
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Old 02-15-2012, 03:18 PM   #396 (permalink)
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I actually agree with him... Not sure why his option wasn't on the list to be voted on. I want to bust product that has chances for hits (Auto/Relics) for a majority of teams not just a few.
LOL, you guys are quick to blast a product(2012 Tribute) as not having hits of every team but I just did a spread sheet that shows as it stands now(and the checklist isn't even complete), 28 teams have autograph possibilities and the 2 teams that don't are unclaimed.

We are breaking a case of Jumbo 2012 Bowman in May so I'm not sure why he keeps acting like we aren't breaking it. We will probably do a case of 2012 Bowman Chrome and a case of 2012 Bwman Draft as long as the checklist doesn't suck. Same thing with 2012 Bowman Platinum. So coupled with Finest that is already 5 months of Rookie/Prospect based products. Not sure what this dude is getting so hyped about. I guarantee everyone got a stack of cards from Topps Series 1.

Why should we not bust something in April so we can double up on a product that he wants in May?
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Old 02-15-2012, 04:31 PM   #397 (permalink)
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LOL, you guys are quick to blast a product(2012 Tribute) as not having hits of every team but I just did a spread sheet that shows as it stands now(and the checklist isn't even complete), 28 teams have autograph possibilities and the 2 teams that don't are unclaimed.

We are breaking a case of Jumbo 2012 Bowman in May so I'm not sure why he keeps acting like we aren't breaking it. We will probably do a case of 2012 Bowman Chrome and a case of 2012 Bwman Draft as long as the checklist doesn't suck. Same thing with 2012 Bowman Platinum. So coupled with Finest that is already 5 months of Rookie/Prospect based products. Not sure what this dude is getting so hyped about. I guarantee everyone got a stack of cards from Topps Series 1.

Why should we not bust something in April so we can double up on a product that he wants in May?
Don't cherrypick too hard with the Tribute auto checklist.

2012 Topps Tribute Baseball
Tribute To The Stars Autographs
Odds: Extra Hit - Serial Numbered #/24 - 1/1 Parallel
Jose Bautista
Hanley Ramirez
Buster Posey
Bob Gibson
Matt Kemp
Ryne Sandberg
Stan Musial
Miguel Cabrera
Mike Schmidt
Reggie Jackson

2012 Topps Tribute Baseball
World Series Swatches
Serial Numbered #/99
Al Kaline
Andy Pettitte
Cal Ripken Jr.
Frank Robinson
Hank Aaron
Joe DiMaggio
Johnny Bench
Lou Gehrig
Luis Aparicio
Mickey Mantle
Mike Schmidt
Nolan Ryan
Paul Molitor
Paul O'Neil
Red Schoendiest
Reggie Jackson
Roger Maris
Stan Musial
Willie Mays


2012 Topps Tribute Baseball
Championship Material
Serial Numbered #/99
Albert Pujols
Alex Rodriguez
Buster Posey
CC Sabathia
Chase Utley
Chipper Jones
Cole Hamels
David Ortiz
Derek Jeter
Jacoby Ellsbury
Josh Beckett
Kevin Youkilis
Mariano Rivera
Mark Teiixeira

Miguel Cabrera
Paul Konerko
Robinson Cano
Ryan Howard
Tim Lincecum

2012 Topps Tribute Baseball
Retired Remnants
Serial Numbered #/99
Al Kaline
Andy Pettitte
Cal Ripken Jr.
Don Mattingly
Frank Robinson
Hank Aaron
Joe DiMaggio
Johnny Bench
Luis Aparicio
Mickey Mantle
Mike Schmidt
Nolan Ryan
Paul O'Neil
Red Schoendiest
Reggie Jackson
Roger Maris
Ryne Sandberg
Stan Musial
Willie Mays
Willie McCovey

2012 Topps Tribute Baseball
Debut Digits
Serial Numbered #/99
Al Kaline
Bob Gibson
Chipper Jones
David Ortiz
Don Mattingly
Hank Aaron
Joe DiMaggio
Mickey Mantle
Roy Halladay
Ryne Sandberg
Willie Mays

How may Royals or Rockies or Marlins on these lists? 1?

It's not about what I want, if I wanted I'd just drop the club altogether so you old dogs can keep busting Yankee and Red Sox oriented product all year long. That's fine.

My point was, if you want to be fair to all involved, you can't break but maybe one case of this "old team" oriented stuff per year. What makes you think I want to pay my hard earned cash for you to bust stuff with Yankees all over it, while the checklists have ONE Royal among every insert list- a Hosmer 2nd year auto?

lol
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Old 02-15-2012, 04:46 PM   #398 (permalink)
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Why should we not bust something in April so we can double up on a product that he wants in May?
I suggested not busting in April to bust Archive and Bowman in May. Release date conflict was the only reason I suggested skipping April. to be fair to ALL
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Old 02-15-2012, 05:00 PM   #399 (permalink)
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Honest, to end the Tribute debate. we should vote/poll on to ever break tribute. if the Majority is NO. however wants to in the club can pool our money together and buy a separate (from club) case Tribute

2012 Topps Tribute Baseball Hobby 8 Box Case: $2250

10 slots, $225 ea., 3 teams
15 slots, $150 ea., 2 teams

Still less then buying your own box

Don't let Tribute hinder progress !!!
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Old 02-15-2012, 05:53 PM   #400 (permalink)
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My point was, if you want to be fair to all involved, you can't break but maybe one case of this "old team" oriented stuff per year. What makes you think I want to pay my hard earned cash for you to bust stuff with Yankees all over it, while the checklists have ONE Royal among every insert list- a Hosmer 2nd year auto?

lol
So do I get to say the same thing if we break 2011 Draft with no Yankee autos. Hell, 2012 Bowman may not have anything but a Montero 3rd year auto in it and I'm fine with us breaking a case of it. What makes you think I want to spend my money so you can get Bubba Starling and Eric Hosmer and whatever other high draft pick the Royals get this year when there are no Yankee "hits" in the product. You are so stuck on Bowman products. If you wanted to join a Bowman group you should of joined the Bowman group Mike is running.
I posted this previously. I see us breaking 4 to 5 Bowman products by the end of the year as it stands which is fine. like Bowman products, break a bunch myself. We broke Finest(rookie oriented), and I'm sure 2012 Topps Chrome will get serious consideration. So that's over half the products for the year geared for the "new" teams right there.

OH, and I didn't vote for Heritage in March, I voted for Bowman Chrome.
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