POLL - Blowout Cards Best Pull Contest: October 2011 (CLOSED)

[mwheeler27]

Originally Posted by houdini

I like all of these cards. I personally would not keep any of them except the Tris Speaker or the Pujols in my personal collection though.

However, I understand personal choice. I understand a public vote also.

For me, I would rather have the Banuelos. I could then sell it and buy a Tris Speaker cut, a Tris Speaker JSA auto, a Pujols Patch and/or a Pujols auto, and 1 or 2 Pacquiao White Whale autos. (I admit the value of the Banuelos can be argued. I am basing this on a $2500 offer that I passed on to the owner that was declined. I figure that is a fair medium.)

Granted, I probably could not buy a JFK - even a Sportskings JFK with a poorly butchered window. A full JSA document sits unsold on eBay at $4500 though.

It was some good detective work finding my tweet - I fully admit that. I was hiding it on twitter. To follow me on twitter and then copy and paste...

It is all in good fun. Other than the character attacks, I don't mind the give and take. You all have my full respect.

Sincere congrats to the winner and all 5 card owners. (I pulled the Banuelos, but do not own it.)

Not sure if you are insinuating that I follow you on twitter or not, but I'll go ahead and tell you right now that I do not. I just happened to find your tweet.

Furthermore, using your logic of preferring to have the Manny super in order to sell it to buy other cards, you'd come out much more ahead having the JFK and selling it. It's worth more now. It was worth more yesterday, and it's going to be worth more tomorrow. It's simply a better card, with or without the solicitation of votes.

[houdini]

Originally Posted by mwheeler27

Furthermore, using your logic of preferring to have the Manny super in order to sell it to buy other cards, you'd come out much more ahead having the JFK and selling it. It's worth more now. It was worth more yesterday, and it's going to be worth more tomorrow. It's simply a better card, with or without the solicitation of votes.

You caught me in mid-edit.

Yes, for now the JFK is probably worth more.

I think the Banuelos could surpass it in value temporarily when he gets promoted or if he does something spectacular. (I know that is conjecture.)

Do you think the JFK cut is more valuable now than a full uncut JSA document? Just honestly curious.

I promoted the vote with a club bias. Stand by that decision.

[mwheeler27]

Originally Posted by houdini

You caught me in mid-edit.

Yes, for now the JFK is probably worth more.

I think the Banuelos could surpass it in value temporarily when he gets promoted or if he does something spectacular. (I know that is conjecture.)

Do you think the JFK cut is more valuable now than a full uncut JSA document? Just honestly curious.

I promoted the vote with a club bias. Stand by that decision.

It's not the first time I caught you doing something...(since this is all in good fun).

I completely agree with you that the Manny super could one day surpass the value of the JFK "for a time being" if in fact he got hot at the right time. A LOT has to happen before that day arrives though.

To answer your question...it depends.

I know of a few JFK cut auto card sales, and they are all right around the $4000 range. I have seen documents sell for less and more than this amount. It just depends on what the document is, the condition of the signature, and the time of the sale, (being in the right place at the right time with the right buyer willing to pay big money).

Seriously, I wouldn't be so vocal if you wouldn't keep putting down the JFK card so much. Some of your comments are pretty harsh. LOL

[houdini]

I know. I have been digging at you a bit with the "butchered" and "even a Sportskings" comments. Not one word of it is truly personal though. I do hold you in high regard - no BS.

I had never pulled a superfractor before that night - so the Trumbo and Banuelos are pretty special to me.

Don't tell anyone, but these are my true feelings about the JFK: "Wow." I think the window was widened to benefit the cut (like you mentioned) - and that is commendable. Topps would have merely left the window as is and ruined the effect of the auto. (I also really like the Speaker. There I think the cut may have forced the placement.)

However, I feel that I have to support my club. I take that responsibility very seriously. The tweet you found was actually a club email that was automatically posted to twitter by aweber.

[mwheeler27]

Originally Posted by houdini

I know. I have been digging at you a bit with the "butchered" and "even a Sportskings" comments. Not one word of it is truly personal though. I do hold you in high regard - no BS.

I had never pulled a superfractor before that night - so the Trumbo and Banuelos are pretty special to me.

Don't tell anyone, but these are my true feelings about the JFK: "Wow." I think the window was widened to benefit the cut (like you mentioned) - and that is commendable. Topps would have merely left the window as is and ruined the effect of the auto. (I also really like the Speaker. There I think the cut may have forced the placement.)

However, I feel that I have to support my club. I take that responsibility very seriously. The tweet you found was actually a club email that was automatically posted to twitter by aweber.

I understand how special those cards are to you since you pulled them. However, I don't think it's right to slam other cards in order to win a contest, especially when you later admit that what you say isn't necessarily your true feelings.

I say what I mean and mean what I say. I don't ever try to damage someone or some thing on a whim simply for personal, (or group), gain when I don't really feel that way. As shocked as I was to see you attacking the JFK card, I might be even more shocked to hear you say those aren't really your true feelings, although I'm glad they aren't.

It's good to be loyal to your group. I wouldn't suggest doing so to the detriment of others though. If your group won because you shared damaging feelings that weren't necessarily true, you might have kept a "deserving" person from winning. I hope that makes sense.

All that aside, your Manny super is definitely worthy of this contest, and if it happens to win, congrats to you and your group. I hope your group continues to pull worthy cards. I enjoy seeing great hits.

All the best,

Matt

[houdini]

I didn't say that my previous statements weren't true. The word "butchered" wasn't necessary - but that doesn't mean it isn't true that the card being packaged out in that condition is a shame. "Even Sportskings" wasn't necessary - but the EXACT card from a better company would be more valuable.

Having said that, I am also awed by the card. The window is a result of good intentions. Both sides are true.

[mwheeler27]

Originally Posted by houdini

I didn't say that my previous statements weren't true. The word "butchered" wasn't necessary - but that doesn't mean it isn't true that the card being packaged out in that condition is a shame. "Even Sportskings" wasn't necessary - but the EXACT card from a better company would be more valuable.

Having said that, I am also awed by the card. The window is a result of good intentions. Both sides are true.

LOL...there you go again.

Pre-tell, if you will, what company is better than Sportkings?

Are you talking about upper deck who was found guilty of counterfeiting over a half million cards? Or Panini who inserted "game-used" Ernie Davis memorabilia, (of which wasn't possible)? Or Topps and their "seat relics" fiasco...all of which are just a few examples of "mistakes" by these companies?

I understand you're not completely informed, so I'll let you in on a little secret that's not really that big of a secret:

Some Sportkings cards outsell similar cards from other companies, and I'd be willing to bet this JFK would do so as well.

[houdini]

Originally Posted by mwheeler27

LOL...there you go again.

That is exactly what I thought when I read your other post (#30). I swear, the exact thought. haha

I am opening a lot of product now... I will be back to battle Sportskings again some day!

[mwheeler27]

Originally Posted by houdini

I will be back to battle Sportskings again some day!

And I will be waiting.

[WiggumPI]

Originally Posted by mwheeler27

Panini who inserted "game-used" Ernie Davis memorabilia, (of which wasn't possible)?

Not to really get in middle of this feud, but I do believe the Ernie Davis material is actually from his college playing days. I do recall Panini posting about the acquisition of one of his Syracuse jerseys.

[mwheeler27]

Originally Posted by WiggumPI

Not to really get in middle of this feud, but I do believe the Ernie Davis material is actually from his college playing days. I do recall Panini posting about the acquisition of one of his Syracuse jerseys.

It's okay. You should always feel free to say what's on your mind as long as you're following the rules.

Here's the back of one of the cards I'm talking about:



Obviously Ernie Davis did not wear a Syracuse jersey in "an official NFL game".

This is why stuff like this needs to get posted repeatedly...Either people forget, or they didn't know the wrong doing in the first place.

[WiggumPI]

Originally Posted by mwheeler27

It's okay. You should always feel free to say what's on your mind as long as you're following the rules.

Here's the back of one of the cards I'm talking about:



Obviously Ernie Davis did not wear a Syracuse jersey in "an official NFL game".

This is why stuff like this needs to get posted repeatedly...Either people forget, or they didn't know the wrong doing in the first place.

Thanks for posting that. In this case, I believe the copy on the card was an honest mistake by Panini, as they have been very forthright with this piece of memorabilia. Panini Behind the Scenes: A History-Making Ernie Davis Jersey - YouTube I wouldn't judge them too harshly for it, unlike the case with Topps where they try to attribute stadium seat pieces to specific players (as if they had anything to do with the seat themselves).

[mwheeler27]

Originally Posted by WiggumPI

Thanks for posting that. In this case, I believe the copy on the card was an honest mistake by Panini, as they have been very forthright with this piece of memorabilia. Panini Behind the Scenes: A History-Making Ernie Davis Jersey - YouTube I wouldn't judge them too harshly for it, unlike the case with Topps where they try to attribute stadium seat pieces to specific players (as if they had anything to do with the seat themselves).

You're welcome.

I'm not so sure about how "honest" this "mistake" was though. Here's some more information if you'd like to find out more:

Uh oh...Is Panini trying to pull something over on us?

That first post gives several links that clearly state Ernie Davis may not have worn that jersey. It doesn't surprise me at all though that Panini would pass it off as an authentic, "game-worn" jersey even though I can't find a single thing that states he ever wore it.

[WiggumPI]

Originally Posted by mwheeler27

It's okay. You should always feel free to say what's on your mind as long as you're following the rules.

Here's the back of one of the cards I'm talking about:



Obviously Ernie Davis did not wear a Syracuse jersey in "an official NFL game".

This is why stuff like this needs to get posted repeatedly...Either people forget, or they didn't know the wrong doing in the first place.

Originally Posted by mwheeler27

You're welcome.

I'm not so sure about how "honest" this "mistake" was though. Here's some more information if you'd like to find out more:

Uh oh...Is Panini trying to pull something over on us?

That first post gives several links that clearly state Ernie Davis may not have worn that jersey. It doesn't surprise me at all though that Panini would pass it off as an authentic, "game-worn" jersey even though I can't find a single thing that states he ever wore it.

Sure, the auctions clearly have a letter from Davis' nephew that his uncle wore the jersey. At any rate, it is at the very least, very likely that it is in fact the very uniform that was issued to him for the purpose of the game.

[mwheeler27]

Originally Posted by WiggumPI

Sure, the auctions clearly have a letter from Davis' nephew that his uncle wore the jersey. At any rate, it is at the very least, very likely that it is in fact the very uniform that was issued to him for the purpose of the game.

But it wasn't "game-worn" as Panini stated. It wasn't worn in an NFL game or a collegiate all-star game.

This is one of my favorite pieces of information that was dug up:

Originally Posted by mindbinge

This guy has a website that details the College All Star games...he has some cool pics and info on all of the games...so I decided to ask him if he had any pics or info on if Davis was actually at the game or not or any pics he knew of that might show Davis at the game in street clothes or wearing the jersey...and as the plot thickens...here is what he had to say:

"Okay, here's what I know.

Davis was diagnosed in Evanston during the All-Star Game physicals. Immediately, they knew it was a major problem. He was scratched from the game and tests continued through the day of the game. Davis, who was interviewed by phone, said, "I feel good. I'm certainly sorry to miss the game. If I'm still here, I'll be watching it on television."

Apparently, the Browns flew Davis back to Cleveland for additional tests on Friday, Aug. 3, 1962. It appears from all the newspaper accounts that he did not attend. The Packers gave the game ball to him, so everyone seemed to know the gravity of the situation. By August 2, the newspapers were syaing he was out for the season.

Hope this helps.

Mark Bolding
Houston, TX"


so...according to this guy, Davis wasn't even at the game?

So as you said:

Originally Posted by WiggumPI

I believe the copy on the card was an honest mistake by Panini, as they have been very forthright with this piece of memorabilia.

I agree, they were forthright "at first". That is until they were questioned by knowledgeable collectors. They then clammed up, and I never heard another word from them. I wonder why?

What a shame. They could have been honest, and the cards would have probably been worth just as much. Instead, they look dishonest.

[blowoutcards]

Congrats to Member KenTyler with the John F Kennedy Cut Auto 1/1 From Sport Kings C ! Please email us at Blowoutcards@aol.com for your FREE BOX of 2006 Bowman Draft Picks & Prospects Baseball Hobby Box!

[mwheeler27]

Congrats Ken!

I'm happy to see a worthy card won and wasn't artificially voted up.

How about that...two months in a row, non-licensed cards ran away with this contest over some very nice licensed examples.

I think it's safe to say that if you want the best shot at winning this contest, you should consider opening something other than Topps, upper deck, or Panini. The odds of you hitting a winning card are much, much greater leaving those other 3 companies off your list.

[bprice]

Hey Matt, what do you mean non-licensed?

Sportkings and Horrors of War are both licensed by collectors and that's all that counts.

Congratulations to the September and October winners.

Brian Price

[mwheeler27]

Excellent point! Thank you for correcting me.