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Old 12-29-2011, 06:26 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Help needed on my 1st eBay return: Harper Auto. Awful Scratches (tl;dr)

Hello All,

I could use a little help with the optimal return procedure for this horrendously scratched up Harper BC auto.

Harper Scan


3 iphone pics:
1
2
3

Harper Gallery Pic
[IMG][/IMG]

My message to him:
The Harper base auto was delivered by USPS. However, I will not be accepting this card. I will be returning it to you tomorrow because the condition of the card is unacceptable. There are major surface scratches running vertically from the top white border to the top of the auto box. These scratches run throughout this region of the card approximately 3/4" wide. Finally, these scratches do not appear in the gallery picture.
It appears that someone jammed into a top loader with out a penny sleeve.
How would you like me to proceed? This is my first return. I will pay the return shipping as stated in your terms and conditions.
_________________________________________
His terms specifically say "Returns Accepted." After receiving the item, contact seller within 7days. Refund will be given as Money back. Buyer pays return shipping.
_________________________________________
However, this young Harvard law grad responds with:
The card was pack fresh and place directly into the penny sleeve and toploader. You will need a letter from topps or beckett stating too me that the card is not in near mint to mint condition as stated in the description. If you send it to topps they will replace the card for you. The only way I will take return on item is if you can prove that the card is not near mint to mint condition by Beckett,PSA, or Topps.

_________________________________________

I know I'm going to win here, but my question is how do I proceed? His response is obviously nonsense adding material terms to the transaction.

Dispute via Paypal?

Mucho thanks,
Seth
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:33 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Jenkinssssss View Post
Dispute via Paypal?
Pretty much your only option unless you plan on knocking on his door.

I may be wrong but those scratches are pretty common on the last 2-3 years of Bowman & Topps Chrome. Been quite a few post on here regarding the subject.
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:34 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Those look like standard chrome printing defects to me.

On a side note, the only pictures I could remotely see anything wrong in were your iPhone pics. I don't see a reason for you to return this card. You sound like a nightmare buyer.
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:35 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Those look like standard chrome printing defects to me.
I agree with you 100%
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:40 PM   #5 (permalink)
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more and more people like this on ebay... suck it up and keep the card...
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:40 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Let me see if I can get a better pic before you all start trolling me. There are literally 30 lines that run 2 inches long and spread for .75-1 inch across the middle of the card.
That is acceptable? I know and accept chrome scratches but this looks like the card was scraped with some kind of fine tool.
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:43 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Give us a link to the auction so we can see his item description. If it says Nm-Mt, he is right. NM-MT is only a BGS 8. That is definitely an 8 or better.
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:44 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Can I get your eBay name please so I can block you? These lines are normal in chrome.
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:46 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Let me see if I can get a better pic before you all start trolling me. There are literally 30 lines that run 2 inches long and spread for .75-1 inch across the middle of the card.
That is acceptable? I know and accept chrome scratches but this looks like the card was scraped with some kind of fine tool.
Differing opinion=troll? Alright, we must be on the Internet.
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:47 PM   #10 (permalink)
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See those scratches i the middle. They run the entire way from the top white border through the auto box for almost 1" wide.

You would accept it for a $160 purchase? Give me a break.


Last edited by Jenkinssssss; 12-29-2011 at 06:55 PM.
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:48 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Guys I wouldnt hang the buyer out just yet. If there are evident scratches it really should be disclosed. Even if not, if the buyer is not happy they can return it.

I would see what the seller tells you to do to. Given value you may need to send it back signature required (greater than $250). otherwise you will need DC. Typically a claim will need to be opened if for anything so the seller can get their fees back.
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:52 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Give us a link to the auction so we can see his item description. If it says Nm-Mt, he is right. NM-MT is only a BGS 8. That is definitely an 8 or better.
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:52 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I'm not going to get into a pissing contest as to what constitutes a troll. I've busted multiple cases of BC and not a single card looked like this.

His terms say "Returns Accepted" and requires no additional terms. How am I a nightmare buyer? I've bought thousands of dollars of cards from members here and eBay in the last 3 months and this is the absolute worst surface condition I have seen.
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Old 12-29-2011, 07:35 PM   #14 (permalink)
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The seller agreed to accept the return after a curt but courteous response by me.

Thanks to everyone who gave advice in this thread. Those that want to block me add "hello_there" to your blocked list as I will happily give you no business.

Last edited by Jenkinssssss; 12-31-2011 at 05:11 AM.
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Old 12-29-2011, 07:51 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Looks like manufacturing scratches too me, I've seen them like that before. You don't seem them that bad often, but I'm pretty sure the card came out of the pack that way.

You can return the card without any issue. Just file a claim of "item not as described", you will win the claim as long as you don't write inflammatory statements in the claim, just state that the card is damaged pure and simple, and you'll have to pay return shipping. Make certain to use DC# when returning the card.

This sucks for the seller, as I'm sure they pulled the card out of the pack that way. But that's the risk of opening packs and selling, some cards you pull are damaged and should be mentioned as such in the description, or if a seller misses something, then a return should be accepted.

Good luck whatever you do.
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Old 12-30-2011, 08:27 AM   #16 (permalink)
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If you want to return the card. I wouldn't even respond to what that seller responded with. Just open a claim and start the return process.
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Old 12-30-2011, 08:34 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Looks to me that those scratches are pretty hard to notice. Seller knew card was jacked up and hoped buyer didn't notice......lol

File the claim, send with signature confirm (so guy can't claim he didn't receive it), get your refund and you will be out a couple of bucks for the shipping.
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Old 12-30-2011, 04:59 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by dthimesch View Post
If you want to return the card. I wouldn't even respond to what that seller responded with. Just open a claim and start the return process.
Do I still have open a claim since he agreed to return? I think I have my bases covered, Thanks for the help guys.

Me:
'm sorry but you can't add material terms and conditions to your auction after purchase.
The auction specifically states "Returns Accepted." After receiving the item, contact seller within 7days. Refund will be given as Money back. Buyer pays return shipping.
This means I can return the card for any reason within the 7 day window. You included no additional terms such as "Buyer must prove condition via some type of Grading Service in order to return card."
I will be opening a dispute for this transaction this evening unless you respond that you will accept the return.
I've busted 3 cases of Bowman Chrome and not a single card looked like this one-especially a $160 autograph card.
We can either resolve this amicably or let eBay decide.
Respectfully,

His Response:
Please just return the item to the address that was on the bubble mailer. Id rather me and you just work it out than have to wait for them to make a decision in 30 days. Thanks
Please if you can wait until the January 2nd to ship because im not home now and dont want the card to be sitting in my mailbox. I will be back in town on January 5th, 2012. Thanks
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Old 12-30-2011, 05:33 PM   #19 (permalink)
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You do not have to file the claim if the seller is willingly accepting the return. Make sure to keep your dc # and save all messages from the seller incase he tries to back out or cause other issues.
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Old 12-30-2011, 07:23 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jenkinssssss View Post
Hello All,

I could use a little help with the optimal return procedure for this horrendously scratched up Harper BC auto.

Harper Scan


3 iphone pics:
1
2
3

Harper Gallery Pic
[IMG][/IMG]

My message to him:
The Harper base auto was delivered by USPS. However, I will not be accepting this card. I will be returning it to you tomorrow because the condition of the card is unacceptable. There are major surface scratches running vertically from the top white border to the top of the auto box. These scratches run throughout this region of the card approximately 3/4" wide. Finally, these scratches do not appear in the gallery picture.
It appears that someone jammed into a top loader with out a penny sleeve.
How would you like me to proceed? This is my first return. I will pay the return shipping as stated in your terms and conditions.
_________________________________________
His terms specifically say "Returns Accepted." After receiving the item, contact seller within 7days. Refund will be given as Money back. Buyer pays return shipping.
_________________________________________
However, this young Harvard law grad responds with:
The card was pack fresh and place directly into the penny sleeve and toploader. You will need a letter from topps or beckett stating too me that the card is not in near mint to mint condition as stated in the description. If you send it to topps they will replace the card for you. The only way I will take return on item is if you can prove that the card is not near mint to mint condition by Beckett,PSA, or Topps.

_________________________________________

I know I'm going to win here, but my question is how do I proceed? His response is obviously nonsense adding material terms to the transaction.

Dispute via Paypal?

Mucho thanks,
Seth
Dont listen to any of these people,who cares what they say. Its your card and your money. If you are not happy with the card then send it back and open a dispute. Also, I have said this before and I will say it again. ATTN TO ALL SELLERS PLEASE STOP WASTING YOUR TIME TYPING THAT YOU DO NOT ACCEPT RETURNS. EBAY WILL MAKE YOU ACCEPT IT AND GIVE A REFUND,YOU HAVE NO CHOICE. IF YOU REFUSE EBAY AND PAYPAL WILL DO IT FOR YOU. YOUR "PERSONAL"RETURN POLICY MEANS NOTHING. YOUR "PERSONAL" RETURN POLICY DOES NOT OVERRULE EBAY POLICY,WHEN ARE YOU GONNA GET THIS THROUGH YOUR HEADS
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Old 12-30-2011, 09:29 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cking View Post
ATTN TO ALL SELLERS PLEASE STOP WASTING YOUR TIME TYPING THAT YOU DO NOT ACCEPT RETURNS. EBAY WILL MAKE YOU ACCEPT IT AND GIVE A REFUND,YOU HAVE NO CHOICE. IF YOU REFUSE EBAY AND PAYPAL WILL DO IT FOR YOU. YOUR "PERSONAL"RETURN POLICY MEANS NOTHING. YOUR "PERSONAL" RETURN POLICY DOES NOT OVERRULE EBAY POLICY,WHEN ARE YOU GONNA GET THIS THROUGH YOUR HEADS
Actually "Returns Not Accepted For This Item" is a built in eBay option. I agree that if the item is different than described then the buyer has the right to return the item even if the seller has a "no returns" policy. However if the item is described correctly then "Returns Not Accepted For This Item" is an accepted option and will be enforced by eBay and Paypal in the sellers favor.

A case in point was when I sold an old cook book, describing in detail some creases and small rips on the dust jacket. The buyer received the item and complained about the exact creases and rips that I had mentioned in the auction listing. I advised him that the item was exactly as described and that there was no return on the item. He made a eBay claim and it was decided in my favor.

Normally I would be happy to accept a return but at some point, when a buyer is being rude, and they don't take the time to read the auction properly then they need to take responsibility for their own mistake. I am not a huge seller, I don't have people working for me, it is just me. Returns are annoying, they take time out of my day and they cost me money. So why is it so bad if I choose to have some auctions with a "Returns Not Accepted For This Item" policy?
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