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Old 07-09-2013, 11:08 AM   #51 (permalink)
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I have loved these comments... ooo you got HOF autos how is that a bad case. When 50% of the product is HOF autos and you're guaranteed hits, its not necessarily a good break.

If you pay $1600 for a case of cards and pull 4x HOF autos that total $600 and get back $700 total thats not a good break. UD and other companies destroyed the value of HOF auto's, they are the crap cards in Exquisite no matter how you spin it. If you lose $900 on a break, its a bad break, even if you do get 4x overproduced HOF autos. Its not about the fun of the break for a $600 pack of cards, its about hitting chase cards. If you want a fun product to break you go for college lends which is $600 and gives you a crap ton of cards to break for hours. Anyone who spends $1600 for 3 mins of breaking for "fun" is out their dang mind. Its about hitting the big RPA's.

After watching more breaks, I can say some people faired off much worse though. A HOF auto is destroying the nonRPA rookie autos. Most players cards are $5-$50 regardless of print run. So I change my original response from crap break to pretty decent break.
Correct. I watched a live case break yesterday and one box was great (RGIII), one box was awful ($120 total SV of all cards) and the third box gave the second box a run for its money for how bad it was. So even with the RGIII auto (non RPA) the case was horrid...but that second box was abismal. Best card in the box was a Keenum RPA that sells for under $25. If anything I'm being generous estimating that the entire box would get $120 back. I would be sick to my stomach spending $600 on a box like that.
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Old 07-09-2013, 11:21 AM   #52 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by rbb147 View Post
I have loved these comments... ooo you got HOF autos how is that a bad case. When 50% of the product is HOF autos and you're guaranteed hits, its not necessarily a good break.

If you pay $1600 for a case of cards and pull 4x HOF autos that total $600 and get back $700 total thats not a good break. UD and other companies destroyed the value of HOF auto's, they are the crap cards in Exquisite no matter how you spin it. If you lose $900 on a break, its a bad break, even if you do get 4x overproduced HOF autos. Its not about the fun of the break for a $600 pack of cards, its about hitting chase cards. If you want a fun product to break you go for college lends which is $600 and gives you a crap ton of cards to break for hours. Anyone who spends $1600 for 3 mins of breaking for "fun" is out their dang mind. Its about hitting the big RPA's.

After watching more breaks, I can say some people faired off much worse though. A HOF auto is destroying the nonRPA rookie autos. Most players cards are $5-$50 regardless of print run. So I change my original response from crap break to pretty decent break.
You are all over the place in your review of high end products such as Exquisite, but I hear where you are coming from. But it is impossible to make your money back or a profit on any kind of break regardless of how much you pay for it.

Exquisite such as other high end products such as the CUP and NT is the cream of the crop when it comes to their brand, so basically if you are criticizing it, you don't like football cards.

The poor sale value of Exquisite accounts for a number of reasons from it being a college product, but it has little to do with the hits you can get. The hits are great and this break included some of the best vets you can get. I also don't think this product relies on the big RPA either and it's more of a mix of rookies and vets which any high end product should be.
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Old 07-09-2013, 12:16 PM   #53 (permalink)
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You are all over the place in your review of high end products such as Exquisite, but I hear where you are coming from. But it is impossible to make your money back or a profit on any kind of break regardless of how much you pay for it.

Exquisite such as other high end products such as the CUP and NT is the cream of the crop when it comes to their brand, so basically if you are criticizing it, you don't like football cards.

The poor sale value of Exquisite accounts for a number of reasons from it being a college product, but it has little to do with the hits you can get. The hits are great and this break included some of the best vets you can get. I also don't think this product relies on the big RPA either and it's more of a mix of rookies and vets which any high end product should be.

I see Tiger Woods in your profile. Imagine a Tiger Woods auto being worth $80, because thats where he will be soon with Upper Deck. It is cool to get a legend in a product, but it is not necessarily good from a SV stand point.

Lets look at this scenario. You buy a case of 2011-12 Exquisite basketball at $1450 and hit a Michael Jordan / Lebron James dual auto //5. You're set right??? I mean that card Mojozzz?!?! No its a $700 card because both autos have been overproduced. Then you hit double Mojozzz in the same case, an MJ //23 Legacy worth $310. You're at $1100, not even the value of the case while hitting 2 HUGE autos of arguably the hottest players in sports history.

Michael Jordan Lebron James 2011 12 Exquisite Dual Gold Auto Serial 4 5 | eBay


KKX 2011 12 Exquisite Michael Jordan El JN Legacy Autograph 6 23 hbv $800 | eBay


Now lets look at the lowest selling Jambalaya non-auto card from the 90's. Its a $2,000 card, because it wasn't over produced. Thats double the value of the 2 Exquisite Autos.

Michael Jordan 1997 97 98 Skybox E X2001 Jambalaya RARE Insert 1 720 Packs | eBay

Yes pulling a Jordan auto used to be the most amazing thing ever, with overproduction its just not the case anymore. The same goes for football but its even worse. Every product Upper Deck releases is bogged down with Barry Sanders and Jerry Rice autos.

I have 4 different /5 Exquisite Barry Sanders autos from 2010 Exquisite, each could easily fetch $700+ for each. Fast forward to 2012 Exquisite and the market is already pre-saturated with Barry Sanders autos and this product alone has about 250 total Barry Sanders autos making their SV less than $100 a piece. It would have been awesome to pull 4 autos of Jerry Rice and Barry Sanders in a case of Exquisite back in 2010, you'd be easily at $2,000+. In 2012 Exquisite you're praying that you can get $500 out of the 4 autos, because you know with those hits the remainder of value in your case is $100 and 1/3 of the case price.

I understand completely that you're not usually going to make your money back on a case, but to lose $1,000 when you hit 4 big name legends in a product isn't a good thing. People are saying the OP should be happy with hitting the cards, but the fact is nobody should be content to lose close to $1,000 on a case regardless of how big the name is. It's not about the name on the card, its about SV. Can I trade an /65 Barry Sanders auto for an /99 Weeden RPA? No it would take me 2-3 Barry Sanders autos to trade for a Weeden RPA. Who EVER thought that statement could be made?!
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Old 07-09-2013, 12:59 PM   #54 (permalink)
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I understand totally where you are coming from but this brings about another debate and that is the nature of the hobby. You are very knowledgeable in the value of cards, but there was a time believe it or not when that did not matter.

The examples you have given of the legends you mentioned are just a product of the nature of the hobby. For example, there was a time when a Gretzky auto was a $1000 card w/o a question but now due to mass production you can get one for $100 quite easily. Why do companies like UD mass produce? You need to look at the other side of the coin here in that now the average collector can afford a hall of fame auto whereas in the past they could not.

At the end of the day, UD and other card companies are still making the money and sure with this method of mass production people suffer, but just as many people suffer as prosper in this case..
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Old 07-09-2013, 05:32 PM   #55 (permalink)
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We decided the resale value of the cards, not the card company.

The veterans auto value has been dropping consistently. Everyone knows Jordan North Carolina auto value is decreasing since there are so many out there. People should have taken that into consideration when opening cases of stuffs. People just can't expect to make money back on opening a case of exquisite and NT unless you hit something huge.
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:38 PM   #56 (permalink)
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I guess if people are not happy with the results of the wax they are busting then hows this sound for a plausible solution...............stop busting wax. Busting wax and then complaining because you got bent over will fall on deaf ears from the majority of collectors.
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:43 PM   #57 (permalink)
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Can we please put an end to this thread already????
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Old 07-09-2013, 10:59 PM   #58 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by rbb147 View Post
I have loved these comments... ooo you got HOF autos how is that a bad case. When 50% of the product is HOF autos and you're guaranteed hits, its not necessarily a good break....
No one is saying this - we're all mocking the "Possbily Worst" comment...
If the OP had said "Nice HOFs but Horrible rookie" this thread would not exist.
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Old 07-10-2013, 10:01 PM   #59 (permalink)
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Hey pm on the elway and Alshon Jeffrey.
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Old 07-11-2013, 12:44 AM   #60 (permalink)
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I see Tiger Woods in your profile. Imagine a Tiger Woods auto being worth $80, because thats where he will be soon with Upper Deck. It is cool to get a legend in a product, but it is not necessarily good from a SV stand point.

Lets look at this scenario. You buy a case of 2011-12 Exquisite basketball at $1450 and hit a Michael Jordan / Lebron James dual auto //5. You're set right??? I mean that card Mojozzz?!?! No its a $700 card because both autos have been overproduced. Then you hit double Mojozzz in the same case, an MJ //23 Legacy worth $310. You're at $1100, not even the value of the case while hitting 2 HUGE autos of arguably the hottest players in sports history.

Michael Jordan Lebron James 2011 12 Exquisite Dual Gold Auto Serial 4 5 | eBay


KKX 2011 12 Exquisite Michael Jordan El JN Legacy Autograph 6 23 hbv $800 | eBay


Now lets look at the lowest selling Jambalaya non-auto card from the 90's. Its a $2,000 card, because it wasn't over produced. Thats double the value of the 2 Exquisite Autos.

Michael Jordan 1997 97 98 Skybox E X2001 Jambalaya RARE Insert 1 720 Packs | eBay

Yes pulling a Jordan auto used to be the most amazing thing ever, with overproduction its just not the case anymore. The same goes for football but its even worse. Every product Upper Deck releases is bogged down with Barry Sanders and Jerry Rice autos.

I have 4 different /5 Exquisite Barry Sanders autos from 2010 Exquisite, each could easily fetch $700+ for each. Fast forward to 2012 Exquisite and the market is already pre-saturated with Barry Sanders autos and this product alone has about 250 total Barry Sanders autos making their SV less than $100 a piece. It would have been awesome to pull 4 autos of Jerry Rice and Barry Sanders in a case of Exquisite back in 2010, you'd be easily at $2,000+. In 2012 Exquisite you're praying that you can get $500 out of the 4 autos, because you know with those hits the remainder of value in your case is $100 and 1/3 of the case price.

I understand completely that you're not usually going to make your money back on a case, but to lose $1,000 when you hit 4 big name legends in a product isn't a good thing. People are saying the OP should be happy with hitting the cards, but the fact is nobody should be content to lose close to $1,000 on a case regardless of how big the name is. It's not about the name on the card, its about SV. Can I trade an /65 Barry Sanders auto for an /99 Weeden RPA? No it would take me 2-3 Barry Sanders autos to trade for a Weeden RPA. Who EVER thought that statement could be made?!
Upper deck is literally pinned between staying relevant and devaluing their own products. That's not good. No one will open the products without MJ, but because MJ is in there, the expectations for his autos really drag demand down for them a lot. I feel for UD, they made some of my favorite cards when I re-entered the hobby back in 2009, but they've destroyed themselves.
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Old 07-11-2013, 04:57 AM   #61 (permalink)
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People are saying the OP should be happy with hitting the cards, but the fact is nobody should be content to lose close to $1,000 on a case regardless of how big the name is.
agreed. but while the card companies are partially at fault, so are collectors and dealers.


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We decided the resale value of the cards, not the card company.
and this is what i don't get and blame on collectors/dealers. the OP has a valid point about overproduction driving down values, but what really does it is sellers racing each other to the bottom on pricing.

for example, i just looked at the Exquisite Weeden RPA /99. one sold the other day for $260... the very next guy sells his for $122, the next was something like $100 and the last ended at $90. no doubt it'll be a $40-$50 card with another sale or 2.

if those sellers had held tight in a reasonable range, there were clearly people willing to pay more. but for some reason they decided they didn't want or need the extra money.

and you see it with every product. people are so anxious to dump all their cards they practically give them away. why are these people even opening product if they're going to immediately sell everything at a huge loss?

that, even more than price and overproduction, is what causes someone to lose $1,000 on a case.
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Old 07-11-2013, 09:25 PM   #62 (permalink)
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and this is what i don't get and blame on collectors/dealers. the OP has a valid point about overproduction driving down values, but what really does it is sellers racing each other to the bottom on pricing.

for example, i just looked at the Exquisite Weeden RPA /99. one sold the other day for $260... the very next guy sells his for $122, the next was something like $100 and the last ended at $90. no doubt it'll be a $40-$50 card with another sale or 2.

if those sellers had held tight in a reasonable range, there were clearly people willing to pay more. but for some reason they decided they didn't want or need the extra money.

and you see it with every product. people are so anxious to dump all their cards they practically give them away. why are these people even opening product if they're going to immediately sell everything at a huge loss?

that, even more than price and overproduction, is what causes someone to lose $1,000 on a case.
100% correct...its crazy...it's as if they stole the items...

They may as well be standing on the corner with cards under their trenchcoat...'Hey u wanna buy an RPA reeeeal cheap??'

It makes zero sense to me...but what do I know.
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