Opinions needed!!! Fake or real?

[zonacats8]

Originally Posted by Jackg1980

Ask him if he is so sure why not put down 50K like he did with the shilling thread.

he said he won't respond to any more PM's from me (even though he initiated the PM conversation with me) because I "failed to keep our private message private"

But even still, I asked him to prove one is real by taking the member up on their offer of paying to have it certified, as well as asking him to post pictures of the cards in his possessions to look at the signatures.

He ignored my request to take up that member on their offer, and said he couldn't show me any pictures because the cards are in his shipping department.

[Bob Loblaw]

Originally Posted by WilsonValdez

Wow..what a pathetic response by a pathetic seller. So everyone must be kids who is questioning you...good logic. And a witch hunt is not something with documentable proof. When you sell these fake cards/autos that is not even close to a witch hunt.

Your excuses/defenses are so sad. Anyone with half a brain can see you are full of it. But hey, you can call him and hear him deny it over the phone...Ignore the actual proof in the auctions themselves.

PS- Terry, how did you end up with almost all of the print run of the rare /25 2011 Leaf Valiant Baseball purple autos? Amazing that one seller can end up with almost all of the print run of a set of autos. You really must love the back door...

What's even more interesting is how the FCB board keeps locking those threads down asserting that there's something shady going on with Leaf.......

[Jackg1980]

Originally Posted by Bob Loblaw

What's even more interesting is how the FCB board keeps locking those threads down asserting that there's something shady going on with Leaf.......

What is FCB?

[Bob Loblaw]

Freedom Card Board.

[Jackg1980]

Originally Posted by Bob Loblaw

Freedom Card Board.

Whats the story on that?

[WilsonValdez]

Originally Posted by Bob Loblaw

What's even more interesting is how the FCB board keeps locking those threads down asserting that there's something shady going on with Leaf.......

Yeah, agreed..."Freedom" my arse. It's a legit question that so far has not been answered by Boyd and has been given a complete blow-off answer by Brian Gray.

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by WilsonValdez

Yeah, agreed..."Freedom" my arse. It's a legit question that so far has not been answered by Boyd and has been given a complete blow-off answer by Brian Gray.

Could you guys expand what you're talking about here? As a guy who hasn't been to FCB in many, many months, I legitimately don't know what you're talking about. I'd love a link to a locked thread or even just more explanation from someone with details. I'm curious

[Jackg1980]

Has someone pm him the question?

[WilsonValdez]

Originally Posted by SpastikMooss

Could you guys expand what you're talking about here? As a guy who hasn't been to FCB in many, many months, I legitimately don't know what you're talking about. I'd love a link to a locked thread or even just more explanation from someone with details. I'm curious

Not sure if posting a link to another place is kosher, but if it's not, Mods please just lmk and I'll remove it:

Leaf / Bigboydsportscards / Purple Refractors

Thanks, Leaf!!

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by WilsonValdez

Not sure if posting a link to another place is kosher, but if it's not, Mods please just lmk and I'll remove it:

Leaf / Bigboydsportscards / Purple Refractors

Thanks, Leaf!!

Ahhh I see. I've seen you occasionally post in a thread where we're all talking one thing and you mention Leaf and then question why no one answers you. I don't think I've ever seen a Blowout thread directly related to this question, so I definitely appreciate you sharing the links!

Have you pm'd Boyd or Brian to see what they had to say? Because I too noticed all those purple valiants /25, and that is super odd.

Edit: I see Brian showed up to the thread and said there is no link to Boyd from his end. Interesting.

[SpastikMooss]

Also a thought for the Sanchez is fake crowd. I know Boyd won't send it in for authenticity, so why doesn't someone work out a deal with Boyd where they buy it, have it graded, and if it comes back fake Boyd can refund the BGS price and the buy/shipping price. I'd do it myself but I'm kinda of low on income right now...but if anyone would still be interested in 2-3 months I could probably do it then. Just an idea...

[SpastikMooss]

Final thought, I noticed in that thread that Brian wrote this -

"PS- the posts in this thread which serve no useful purpose (but to harass, insult,etc) are precisely why manufacturers don't interact with collectors anymore.. These people cost real collectors the opportunity to improve the hobby through personal communication.."

I 100% agree with what Brian said. I know some of you are mad at Brian or Boyd and I'm not saying you don't have a legitimate reason, but don't call them pathetic or curse at them and then expect them to be helpful and nice. Just saying.

[Bob Loblaw]

Originally Posted by SpastikMooss

Ahhh I see. I've seen you occasionally post in a thread where we're all talking one thing and you mention Leaf and then question why no one answers you. I don't think I've ever seen a Blowout thread directly related to this question, so I definitely appreciate you sharing the links!

Have you pm'd Boyd or Brian to see what they had to say? Because I too noticed all those purple valiants /25, and that is super odd.

Edit: I see Brian showed up to the thread and said there is no link to Boyd from his end. Interesting.

Brian lies.

A lot.

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by Bob Loblaw

Brian lies.

A lot.

Gotcha. I know very little about his issues with Razor/Leaf etc. so I can't speak to anything.

[ssbledsoe]

Originally Posted by SpastikMooss

Also a thought for the Sanchez is fake crowd. I know Boyd won't send it in for authenticity, so why doesn't someone work out a deal with Boyd where they buy it, have it graded, and if it comes back fake Boyd can refund the BGS price and the buy/shipping price. I'd do it myself but I'm kinda of low on income right now...but if anyone would still be interested in 2-3 months I could probably do it then. Just an idea...

Not a bad idea. I'll see what I can do. If I win one and it comes back fake, I'd assuredly get my purchase price back. Losing the grading fee would be salty, but I'd be happy to pay to put the issue to bed.

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by ssbledsoe

Not a bad idea. I'll see what I can do. If I win one and it comes back fake, I'd assuredly get my purchase price back. Losing the grading fee would be salty, but I'd be happy to pay to put the issue to bed.

I'd message him and see if he'll do the grading fee too. He's a nice guy to me in messages and seems like he'd like to put the issue to bed as well.

I think asking him to pay the grading fee if the card comes back fake is more productive than asking him to put $50,000 behind his claims haha.

[ssbledsoe]

Originally Posted by SpastikMooss

I'd message him and see if he'll do the grading fee too. He's a nice guy to me in messages and seems like he'd like to put the issue to bed as well.

I think asking him to pay the grading fee if the card comes back fake is more productive than asking him to put $50,000 behind his claims haha.

I won't be dealing with him via PM. This should be public info and I refuse to get into a he said he said pissing match.

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by ssbledsoe

I won't be dealing with him via PM. This should be public info and I refuse to get into a he said he said pissing match.

Well sure I get that. But maybe PM him, see if he thinks it's a good idea. If he says yes have him come in this thread and post that he's willing to do it so that everyone knows. That way everyone knows the terms AND you might get your grading money back.

And if he says no, you can still buy it and get the refund for the price anyways. Not like he gets your name and address with a PM!

But yeah I agree, public is good.

[WilsonValdez]

Why would he (Boyd) agree to send it for grading or do anything to address when he 100% knows that it's fake? He's going to avoid the issue and hope people forget about it. Doesn't take a genius to figure that out.

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by WilsonValdez

Why would he (Boyd) agree to send it for grading or do anything to address when he 100% knows that it's fake? He's going to avoid the issue and hope people forget about it. Doesn't take a genius to figure that out.

I get what you're saying, BUT if you buy it anyway and after grading it comes back fake you have a pretty easy item not as described case. AKA he has to give you that refund anyway.

Might as well offer the double refund if he really thinks it's real. If he won't then yeah, that looks suspicious even prior to the card being graded, but it doesn't hurt to try.

I just think you guys are so pessimistic about it. Instead of looking for options to fix it or giving the guy a chance to do right you just trash him left and right and say he's a pathetic scammer. If that card came back real I'm sure you'd hope that people forgot about this thread too

That said, I am thinking the card would come back fake, and I'm mostly thinking of ssbledsoe here if he actually bought the card. If it is fake and Boyd is wrong, I'd rather see him pay the grading fee too - why should bledsoe have to eat a bunch of money just to prove a point when Boyd is the one in question? That's why I'm saying to see if he'd be into it or not.

[ssbledsoe]

Originally Posted by SpastikMooss

I get what you're saying, BUT if you buy it anyway and after grading it comes back fake you have a pretty easy item not as described case. AKA he has to give you that refund anyway.

Might as well offer the double refund if he really thinks it's real. If he won't then yeah, that looks suspicious ever prior to the card being graded, but it doesn't hurt to try.

I just think you guys are so pessimistic about it. Instead of looking for options to fix it or giving the guy a chance to do right you just trash him left and right and say he's a pathetic scammer. If that card came back real I'm sure you'd hope that people forgot about this thread too

That said, I am thinking the card would come back fake, and I'm mostly thinking of ssbledsoe here if he actually bought the card. If it is fake and Boyd is wrong, I'd rather see him pay the grading fee too - why should bledsoe have to eat a bunch of money just to prove a point when Boyd is the one in question? That's why I'm saying to see if he'd be into it or not.

Pessimistic, yes. I have not once called Boyd pathetic or trashed him. I have said he hurts his perception with his demeanor. As for finding ways to prove the accusations, I've publicly offered to cover the fees. Boyd has ignored me. If he wants to weigh in, he knows where to find me.

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by ssbledsoe

Pessimistic, yes. I have not once called Boyd pathetic or trashed him. I have said he hurts his perception with his demeanor. As for finding ways to prove the accusations, I've publicly offered to cover the fees. Boyd has ignored me. If he wants to weigh in, he knows where to find me.

Not saying you, was looking more at Wilson with that haha, since he specificially used the word pathetic in this post. Apologies!

Anyway, I'm digging around on the Premieres, and I found an old SCU post that claims that BGS stopped taking submissions on RPA's since they were so easy to fake? Sports Cards Uncensored – Further Problems With The Rookie Premiere Autos

I guess you'd have to go with some other service. But still possibly worth a try!

[WilsonValdez]

Originally Posted by SpastikMooss

I just think you guys are so pessimistic about it. Instead of looking for options to fix it or giving the guy a chance to do right you just trash him left and right and say he's a pathetic scammer. If that card came back real I'm sure you'd hope that people forgot about this thread too

.

Originally Posted by SpastikMooss

Not saying you, was looking more at Wilson with that haha, since he specificially used the word pathetic in this post. Apologies!

Why are you digging at semantics? What does it matter what adjective I used to describe Boyd? (Btw I called him a pathetic "seller", not scammer...)

What are you even arguing? Anyone with half a brain can tell the card is fake. Anyone who is an informed collector, who has followed the hobby knows that Bigboyd has sold a ton of questionable stuff, a ton of "questionably obtained" stuff, and I'm not even going to get into the shill-bidding accusations.

Would you be defending him this vehemently if it was just some random seller and not a local guy, who you clearly know? I doubt it...

[cassius423]

Of course he wouldn't. Boyds his hero apparently. Even without concrete proof of shilling(which is so blatant its not funny). this selling of fake cards is worse but some will prob still defend his character, oh he didn't know, an employee did it...blablabla. What gets me is ppl string scammers up by their necks yet defend the biggest of all of em(Boyd).

[SpastikMooss]

Originally Posted by WilsonValdez

Why are you digging at semantics? What does it matter what adjective I used to describe Boyd? (Btw I called him a pathetic "seller", not scammer...)

What are you even arguing? Anyone with half a brain can tell the card is fake. Anyone who is an informed collector, who has followed the hobby knows that Bigboyd has sold a ton of questionable stuff, a ton of "questionably obtained" stuff, and I'm not even going to get into the shill-bidding accusations.

Would you be defending him this vehemently if it was just some random seller and not a local guy, who you clearly know? I doubt it...

Apologies for getting into semantics, that was kind of crappy by me. I just feel, like Brian said, that you get a lot further in these kind of threads with good questions and helpful advice instead of loaded words and accusations (founded or unfounded). You obviously have good info and are passionate about what you think, I just tend to share my info in a different way.

As far as fakes go, I have a pretty general knowledge, and I like to have these conversations not only to get to the bottom of things but also to really learn information and get educated. That's why it's frustrating when people share loaded words or are really vague or just attack Boyd (again, not you or Bledsoe attacking, but in other threads it has happened). If he really is faking and you really want to be effective you need to point out the obvious reasons for a fake in that thread to teach the noobs. Like here - I had to do some research into other blog and forum posts to find out more about RPA's (and I found that there are player issues and backdoor issues in 2009 that could account for some of these autos, even if that is a tricky possibility for lots of these autos). This conversation could've been much shorter and would be much further along now if someone mentioned that here.

As for the shilling, I've done my research and I've seen almost every Boyd shill thread out there and I firmly don't think it happens. Whereas with fakes I don't consider myself versed enough to really make a call (and I do lean towards fake as the odds of that many non certified autos getting to one seller seems odd), with shilling I feel very confident and that's why I stand up.

And in general, would I stand up for anyone? Sure. I've posted in other threads that this isn't about Boyd for me, it's about sticking up for someone who is being bashed often without any real evidence. If people put together well written threads that explain the accusations with good evidence, then I and others have nothing we can fight and I'll admit there's shadiness going on. But when people just post a random auction and allude to information on other forums without providing links or info...that's when it gets muddled and these threads don't help. People get lost in the rambling and the threads don't deliver the message that was intended. Like with the 30 page shilling thread - that really could've been 4 pages if you take out all the BS, on both sides (not saying all my posts are perfect haha)

I actually think you've been one of the better discussers WV, especially since you linked me to the discussion about the Valiant /25 threads which were enlightening.