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Old 01-15-2010, 11:03 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Take a look at the centering on this Ozzie Rookie

1979 Topps OZZIE SMITH RC #116 BVG / BGS 9.5

1979 Topps OZZIE SMITH RC #116 BVG / BGS 9.5 - eBay (item 170402738370 end time Feb-02-10 00:45:39 PST)
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Old 01-15-2010, 11:04 AM   #2 (permalink)
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that's perfect centering for you!
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Old 01-15-2010, 11:06 AM   #3 (permalink)
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That is why BGS has no credibility. A diamond cut in a 9.5 holder, and don't give me this Beckett Vintage Grading b.s. either, 1979 isn't a vintage card.

Diamond cut, 57-43, not 55-45 minimum for a gem. Gorgeous card but has no business in a BGS 9.5 holder, none.
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Old 01-15-2010, 11:08 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLR0747 View Post
that's perfect centering for you!
Look closely, its a diamond cut. I'm not trying to bash the card (or you), but every real 9.5 is cheapened when something like that is missed.

I've seen some bad PSA 10s (In the interest of full disclosure I collect PSA 10s, not BGS graded cards) and they cheapen the rest. No one is perfect but jeez you are being paid $10 to look at a card, at least make sure its not diamond cut.

I think I'm going to start a grading company. I'm going to call it total bastard grading (TBG) and when you get a 10, it will be a 10!
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Old 01-15-2010, 11:13 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Look closely, its a diamond cut. I'm not trying to bash the card (or you), but every real 9.5 is cheapened when something like that is missed.

I've seen some bad PSA 10s (In the interest of full disclosure I collect PSA 10s, not BGS graded cards) and they cheapen the rest. No one is perfect but jeez you are being paid $10 to look at a card, at least make sure its not diamond cut.

I think I'm going to start a grading company. I'm going to call it total bastard grading (TBG) and when you get a 10, it will be a 10!
that's some pretty darn good centering on a hard to center card! I agree it is slightly skewed, ......slightly. Not to the point of changing the overall grade. Even though they don't use the four grade scale for BVG, at worst it is 9 for centering, even though I think it should be a 9.5.
I've seen this card in person, it's perfect!
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Old 01-15-2010, 11:18 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Look closely, its a diamond cut. I'm not trying to bash the card (or you), but every real 9.5 is cheapened when something like that is missed.
Could explain what a diamond cut is for those of us (me) that don't know what that is?
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Old 01-15-2010, 11:19 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Could explain what a diamond cut is for those of us (me) that don't know what that is?
a card that is skewed, slanted, centering differs from top to bottom
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Old 01-15-2010, 11:29 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLR0747 View Post
a card that is skewed, slanted, centering differs from top to bottom
I have an eye trained to spot it, but if you aren't sure, just check the centering near the top of the card and near the bottom, if they aren't the same, you are likely looking at a diamond cut.

A diamond cut was a common occurrence in the 1970s and 1980s, but it should stop a card from being a PSA 10 BGS 9.5.

Hey JLR, do you have some scratch riding on this card? Just kidding. I've submitted 30 Ozzie Smith rookies that I thought had a legitimate shot at PSA 10s and have struck out every time, its an incredibly tough card to get in Gem Mint.
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Old 01-15-2010, 11:35 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by KaraandMelliesDaddy View Post
Hey JLR, do you have some scratch riding on this card? Just kidding. I've submitted 30 Ozzie Smith rookies that I thought had a legitimate shot at PSA 10s and have struck out every time, its an incredibly tough card to get in Gem Mint.
I've not done well with them either. And no, I wish, like you said, that card is very valuable in that grade!
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Old 01-15-2010, 11:40 AM   #10 (permalink)
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a card that is skewed, slanted, centering differs from top to bottom
Thanks for explaining that. I initially thought it meant that the card was altered with some kind of diamond-tip cutting tool.
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Old 01-15-2010, 12:41 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KaraandMelliesDaddy View Post
That is why BGS has no credibility. A diamond cut in a 9.5 holder, and don't give me this Beckett Vintage Grading b.s. either, 1979 isn't a vintage card.

Diamond cut, 57-43, not 55-45 minimum for a gem. Gorgeous card but has no business in a BGS 9.5 holder, none.



This was the first thing I thought of when I saw this card. Beautiful card, but it does not belong in a 9.5 holder.
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Old 01-15-2010, 12:58 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Great input...The knowledge on this board is incredible...
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Old 01-15-2010, 01:43 PM   #13 (permalink)
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The front looks very good, but the back, I can see where some people would be skeptical of the grade.
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Old 01-29-2010, 05:15 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Wow. I saw that on ebay awhile ago and was heartbroken. I've failed submitting a bunch of those cards as well. A 9.5+ 1979 Topps Ozzie is pretty much my dream card and I wouldn't buy that one even if I had the $ to spend on it.
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Old 01-29-2010, 12:12 PM   #15 (permalink)
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All this debate on the condition of graded cards kind of defeats the purpose of grading a card.
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Old 01-29-2010, 01:14 PM   #16 (permalink)
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I zoomed the card to 800% magnification, and while the card is indeed the SLIGHTEST bit diamond cut, the card is also being displayed at the SLIGHTEST angle, which might be making it look worse than it is.

By converting the pixels top to bottom and left to right into inches and measuring what angle the card is diamond cut at, the card is diamond cut at EXACTLY 0.009 inches OR 0.225 MILLIMETERS.

That is probably the absolute least amount a card can be off-angle. Its less than a quarter millimeter from being perfectly straight and perfectly centered.

Pristine? No.

Gem Mint. Yes... or at least that extremely minor flaw alone would not keep it from getting a gem mint.

But turn the card over and the back is offcentered by a decent amount both T/B and L/R.

So combine the two minor flaws and I'd agree it probably should have just been Mint. But thats debatable... and thats why I'd agree with what carlo16 said that card grading in general defeats the purpose when you can still debate the condition afterward. Which is why I don't deal in graded cards. One opinion, regardless of how much experience that person has or what tools they use to form the opinion, is still an opinion just the same.
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