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Old 02-02-2011, 11:53 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Regaurdless that BO approves the breaks, the host acted on his own judgment to disreguard them. Hell, he probably didn;t even read the rules for hosting a break and thought nothing of buying somewhere else and keeping the rest.


I'm saying is BO wouldn't directly refund to the guys involved, but they do have more pull getting involved to get that money back from the host.
All the monkeys, I mean mods can do is pm and beg the thief to give the victims their money back, they don't have any special powers. BO provided a place for a fraud to be perpetrated and and provided the group members a reasonable expectation that the break was legit since BO approved it, it would be different if the thief was just able to post his break without it being approved.
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Old 02-02-2011, 11:56 PM   #27 (permalink)
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But what exactly gets approved? I never knew that a diposite had to be placed. I think the approval is just to make sure a) a complete newb isn't running one and b) the numbers are fair.
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Old 02-02-2011, 11:58 PM   #28 (permalink)
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But what exactly gets approved? I never knew that a diposite had to be placed. I think the approval is just to make sure a) a complete newb isn't running one and b) the numbers are fair.
That is the question, why isn't BO ensuring the case is bought? They let the thief take people's money by approving his thread - without them approving the thread the thief cannot get any money, so shouldn't they at a minimum make sure a case is purchased????

It almost makes BO look like an accomplice to the crime since they set the thief up with his own thread and even state in the thread, approved?
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:01 AM   #29 (permalink)
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The rules just stat who to contact for group break prices and prices may chance unless a deposit of 200 is made to lock that price. No requirment of a deposit just to host.
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:03 AM   #30 (permalink)
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The rules just stat who to contact for group break prices and prices may chance unless a deposit of 200 is made to lock that price. No requirment of a deposit just to host.
again - how do you ensure that the case is bought from BO?

why was the thread allowed to continue with no deposit to indicate the case was going to be purchased from BO?

why was the breaker allowed to collect money from everyone?
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:04 AM   #31 (permalink)
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I never mentioned a deposit, as soon as all payments are received it would take BO 5 minutes to check their records to see if a case was ordered. If I were in a break I would expect this to happen. Like I said BO shouldn't have their hand in the process all the way up til money exchanging hands and then play dumb when people are ripped off.
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:13 AM   #32 (permalink)
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That's what I'm saying...nowhere in the rules requires a depost to be made, only if the you want the quoted price locked in.

I think with all these breaks going south, rules will be changed
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:15 AM   #33 (permalink)
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I was on here complaining about trades, that now seems like very small potatoes. This is gonna get ugly. Its people like this guy that ruin stuff for all the honest, hard working people. If he does not get banned,despite if he pays everybody back then something is really wrong with this picture. Knowing he is capable of doing this and allowing him to stay here is crazy. I am glad my money is not on the line here. I am pretty sure he is gonna get banned, lets just hope its not before he pays everybody back.
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:17 AM   #34 (permalink)
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That's what I'm saying...nowhere in the rules requires a depost to be made, only if the you want the quoted price locked in.

I think with all these breaks going south, rules will be changed
herein lies the problem......had a deposit been made or something been done to indicate that the case were going to be purchased at blowout......we would not be talking about this f'd up break
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:32 AM   #35 (permalink)
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I agree for sure about a deposit should need to be made. Only problem is the break would need to be filled before I would make a down payment because if I push $200 down on a break myself and it doesn't fill...I'm out $200 because I couldn't afford to pay another $1300 for the rest of a case (just as an example.)

What I usually do is I'll collect enough payments to make the down payment (including some of my own money if I can once it's all filled) and then just set a deadline for the rest of the payments. Perhaps the best that could legitimately be done is to allow the breakers only to collect up to $200 until that $200 has been paid to blowout to make a down payment on the case. This would mean that the owners would have to keep track of the breaks as well, but would be better protection. Certainly not perfect, but would help qualm the amount of people that think they can just order somewhere else would not try to fill a break with that in mind.

Or...the possibility that all payments go to blowout themselves if they could work that out somehow. I would be open to that as well. Personally, I would love this as I could host more breaks, but would make it harder to keep track of who has paid and who hasn't. And I wouldn't have to worry about paypal taxes, etc. That's why I'm having to probably keep my breaks to a minimum this year so I don't have too many paypal incoming transactions.

Dunno...definitely a big headache and would hate to see all these breaks disappear because of people pulling crap like this, but just hard to tell just where things might lead now.
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:40 AM   #36 (permalink)
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Blowout can hire me with wax to keep track of all the breaks lol. That'd be a cool side job
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:42 AM   #37 (permalink)
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After this, they are probably going to have to adjust the rules. Whether that be confirming the case is coming from BO or other. I don't blame BO for this, we all take risks with buying and selling in this platform.

I can't call pennst4life a thief yet. He and BO state they are trying to get something worked out to get us our refunds. However, this is his mess and he should refund us all immediately whether it goes to a CC or whatever. It became his problem (not our's) when he decided to try and screw the system. He still doesn't explain the fact that he states he has no money in PP to refund when there should be money there. He is a liar and still will not answer questions asked without giving vague replies. I can't believe the others in the break aren't as upset as I am about this. You can do just about anything to me, but don't lie to me, screw with my family or try to take my money.
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:49 AM   #38 (permalink)
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The guy was just trying to rip people off plain and simple.I was in a break today and did not even realize the host had 0 feedback. The break was Ok but I will not do another with him. He did not understand much about breaks IMO only..Once the money is refunded I think he should be banned quickly..Again IMO. I would strongly suggest no one gets in a break with an unproven member. Greedy members have no place here.
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Old 02-03-2011, 01:18 AM   #39 (permalink)
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The guy was just trying to rip people off plain and simple.I was in a break today and did not even realize the host had 0 feedback. The break was Ok but I will not do another with him. He did not understand much about breaks IMO only..Once the money is refunded I think he should be banned quickly..Again IMO. I would strongly suggest no one gets in a break with an unproven member. Greedy members have no place here.
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Old 02-03-2011, 01:21 AM   #40 (permalink)
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Hey bud, how you feeling?
Better, Just dealing with bad headaches...Kinda like this break...LOL
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Old 02-03-2011, 03:16 AM   #41 (permalink)
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After this, they are probably going to have to adjust the rules. Whether that be confirming the case is coming from BO or other. I don't blame BO for this, we all take risks with buying and selling in this platform.

I can't call pennst4life a thief yet. He and BO state they are trying to get something worked out to get us our refunds. However, this is his mess and he should refund us all immediately whether it goes to a CC or whatever. It became his problem (not our's) when he decided to try and screw the system. He still doesn't explain the fact that he states he has no money in PP to refund when there should be money there. He is a liar and still will not answer questions asked without giving vague replies. I can't believe the others in the break aren't as upset as I am about this. You can do just about anything to me, but don't lie to me, screw with my family or try to take my money.
Others in this thiefs break, like myself, as just as upset as you. You're not the only one, believe me. One thing I'd like to point out is that not all new members (such as myself) should be immediately mistrusted. I completed my first Host break last Friday and it went very well. When it was all said and done, I actually ended up loosing about 60 bucks, but it was fun, and I'd do it again in a heartbeat! If anything, this thread will show that A bunch of positive reviews meant squat. It's time for a rule change for group breaks. Maybe BO needs to approve hosts in some way...perhaps holding a CC on file so they have some insurance against thieves like Pennst4life?

Just an idea.
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Old 02-03-2011, 03:26 AM   #42 (permalink)
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...Also, as someone else stated, this seems like a pretty clear cut case of fraud over $1000. He should probably get on those refunds soon, as I'm sure BO would be happy to provide a name and address to PennSt4life's friendly neighborhood police department.
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Old 02-03-2011, 07:34 AM   #43 (permalink)
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I may be wrong but shouldn't Blowout be on the hook to refund those who are being ripped off? Blowout or an agent of Blowout (mod) has to approve all group breaks and they state that the case is to be bought from blowout, then one would assume that blowout would preform due diligence and actually check that the breaker has purchased a case from them. I would recommend filing a complaint with the local Better Business Bureau in Sterling, VA if you cannot get a refund from either the thief or blowout.

if this is the case that they are held liable, then you can bet that will be the end of the case breaks all-together

the reasoning that blowout is liable because this is there forum doesn't hold a lot of water...should they be held liable for every trade or sale that goes bad as well, since they provided the forum for someone to post their trade/sale list
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Old 02-03-2011, 08:10 AM   #44 (permalink)
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again - how do you ensure that the case is bought from BO?

why was the thread allowed to continue with no deposit to indicate the case was going to be purchased from BO?

why was the breaker allowed to collect money from everyone?
There is no assurance that the case is coming from BO but I think if it was found to be bought from another place, a ban would be in order.

The breaker does not use his own money to put a deposit down, that's why they collect from everyone first.
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Old 02-03-2011, 08:11 AM   #45 (permalink)
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if this is the case that they are held liable, then you can bet that will be the end of the case breaks all-together

the reasoning that blowout is liable because this is there forum doesn't hold a lot of water...should they be held liable for every trade or sale that goes bad as well, since they provided the forum for someone to post their trade/sale list
The key is BO requires the they APPROVE the break and the case is bought from them while with a regular BST thread no approval is required. The key to this is BO has 100% of the power to decide who gets to host a break and since they require the case is bought from them BO should have a mechanism in place to ensure a case was bought.

If you look at it this way the group case breaker is acting as a salesman for BO, he tries to convince people to pool their money together to buy a case from BO, no other vendor is to be used so it sure looks like he is acting as a salesman for BO. You people need to understand that case break forum is not here to provide enjoyment for members it is there to sell cases, plain and simple. It would be different if the breaker was able to shop for the best price but he is 100% trying to connivence people to pool their money together and buy a case.
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Old 02-03-2011, 08:37 AM   #46 (permalink)
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The key is BO requires the they APPROVE the break and the case is bought from them while with a regular BST thread no approval is required. The key to this is BO has 100% of the power to decide who gets to host a break and since they require the case is bought from them BO should have a mechanism in place to ensure a case was bought.

If you look at it this way the group case breaker is acting as a salesman for BO, he tries to convince people to pool their money together to buy a case from BO, no other vendor is to be used so it sure looks like he is acting as a salesman for BO. You people need to understand that case break forum is not here to provide enjoyment for members it is there to sell cases, plain and simple. It would be different if the breaker was able to shop for the best price but he is 100% trying to connivence people to pool their money together and buy a case.
I completely disagree, people enjoy their case breaks and the chance at a case hit or to beat the odds or get their team or whatever their motive may be...Either way, not/new product is going to be moved and yes, this helps move their inventory, but if you took a poll, people do enjoy being in case breaks, otherwise, why are they so popular...if people don't like them, then they don't need to join them...since payments are made with paypal as goods, i see no reason why if a case goes sour like this, that people just don't file a claim...
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Old 02-03-2011, 08:49 AM   #47 (permalink)
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The reason the host has no money to refund, is because that 500 was already spent!!

I'm not sure that BO will require a deposit from now on, but they should at least require a purchase order number be posted at the bare minimum. I join group breaks because of the chance at hitting some nice cards at a fraction of the cost of even buying 1 full box. Out of the 5 group breaks I have joined, only 1 host has really done them in a way that I'm happy with...but those guys do them weekly on their own anyways.

I understand why people want to host too. Break a case on other people coin? SURE. I just think people don;t realize the responsibility it takes to make 10-32 people happy. CRappy webcams, lack of communication with members, can't see cards, stubborn host who want to do things their way, slow shipping, no DC, wrong supplies, no scans ect are just a few things that must be done to be a successful break host.
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Old 02-03-2011, 09:17 AM   #48 (permalink)
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So a Scammer took everyone's money for a group break, and then got scammed themselves by Mama-Bear?

You just can't make this sh!t up.....
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Old 02-03-2011, 09:30 AM   #49 (permalink)
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Thank You all for your input. As our forums have grown, so have a lot of areas such as the Group Breaks. Going forward, we will be implementing stricter guidelines for Group Breaks to ensure the integrity of those doings the group breaks and also peace of mind to those participating in the group breaks.

We will be posting the new changes shortly.

Thanks
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Old 02-03-2011, 09:36 AM   #50 (permalink)
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Thanks for the response Pat. I'm sure it's a daily thing as this place grows to make changes and unfortunatly, some people will be involved in bad situations in order to improve the system.
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