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Old 01-13-2013, 01:58 PM   #51 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cking View Post
Sorry, I disagree. He is the one who was ripped off. He has every right to be pissed.
+1. I agree with this statement.
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Old 01-13-2013, 02:03 PM   #52 (permalink)
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What in da heck? I hope all is well with you because that was one off the mark post.

I never supported Otter05 backing out of this deal. If the facts are true he is trash like all of the other scammers here. My comment was directed at the OP and how his behavior was hurting his cause.

I never said this thread was uncalled for. Where did this come from? If something scams somebody it should be posted for all to see.

Here some truth for you. The way you behave around here often deserves comment. If I do wrong around here I welcome people to point that out. You are just trying to get out some pent up butthurt and type things that I never said, or even came close to saying.

Got to get back to being miserable to some others closer to me.

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Originally Posted by penny1fan View Post
Wow 37jetson make up your mind sir.. Why was it such a crime when I decided to back out of a deal several months ago? I recall you sayin I was a POS scumbag etc. without knowing me or dealing with me..Yet your buddy otter05 backs out of a deal your attempting to call the OP a crybaby? What has changed? You say this thread is uncalled for but you flamed that thread about me countless times? I bet you feel like a real bad ace puffing up your chest at the screen all day every day huh? Here at Blowout there is no such thing as right or wrong if your a member of the "it crowd" this consists of non life having dweebs who sit on the boards 24/7 carrying on about the lives they wish they had while passing judgement on everyone they do not know because they are simply miserable with themselves.Hey OP if you offered free contests they will all jump at the chance to be your friend...hell some of them will even tell you they love you!
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Old 01-13-2013, 02:11 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibberish View Post
So, now you are butt hurt and figure you will deflect from your ignorance and attitude towards me ?

I understand you are a child, but your lack of common sense and over-all lack of intelligence is about par for most newer members.

My feedback is moot to my issue with your attitude and sense of entitlement.

Your title said another reason to leave the site. Didn't imply you were making a threat, I was telling you to do it...leave. Clearly there is a nirvana over the hill,go on and find it. Dumb people are why thieves thrive, the fewer of you about,the better for those of us who enjoy the site.

By your logic moderators are police....again, showing just how silly your posts were.

The hollow remark about not dealing with me.......childish and empty.

Anything else ?
Are you trying to say that the buyer in this transaction is showing a sense of entitlement because he was expecting to recieve all of the cards that he paid for.The op paid $350 dollars for a lot from the seller and the seller did not send all the cards and you think the op is showing a sense of entitlement because hes pissed and is wondering where the rest of the cards are that he paid for.
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Old 01-13-2013, 02:17 PM   #54 (permalink)
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1. Based solely on the op, the seller is wrong for not sending all the cards.

2. By offering a full refund for a return, the seller is attempting to make it right. (Still worth a negative iTrader though, but right in that the buyer is not happy and offering a full refund.)

3. The op was bashed for reasons previously noted. Right or wrong, that is why.

4. The idea that blowout or the mods is responsible is just the dumbest #@#@#@#@ I have read in a long while.

Blowout offers a forum and the moderators offer forum moderation. In my opinion, this site is way too big for just the 2 active mods, but who the hell else would want that job? Sure as hell not me!

Blaming the forum or the mods for a situation like this is extremely poor form.

I have not seen the seller post once - so he could just as easily post in here that he sent all the cards and the buyer is trying to extort. NOT saying that happened, just saying we have not heard his side.

Nor have we heard from the mods who - if they were contacted - could easily be waiting for the other side of the story before taking action. Lord forbid they actually do that though and reserve judgment until such a time. Oh no, we should blame the mods for not immediately banning the seller... Who else could we blame our bitter ass lives on if not the mods? Seems legit.

I do not understand why the buyer did not just return the cards for the full refund? If they are worth more now, then just keep them I guess. I would not offer you a partial refund either, but I also would not have left any cards out of my end.

Then the OP should leave appropriate feedback.

Then, if the OP felt it was appropriate, he could post a callout thread warning the community.

As for blaming the site, the mods, and leading your merry band of disgruntled traders off to traders utopia at another site, I say ok, good luck, and goodbye.
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Old 01-13-2013, 02:17 PM   #55 (permalink)
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The deal was for a complete set of 50 cards not for everything since the oriiginal price was $500. With all the time and money I spend on putting this set together I was taking a loss at that. I never was rude and always kept in contact with him, and repeateally apologized for the delay. No excuse but it was during the holidays and stuff happens. I packaged extremenely well send insured priority and other than "hand deliver" it there was nother else I could do. However he wasnt satisfied and insisted that I send the dupes which at the discounted price I would not do. Immediately I offered a complete refund if and when he sent back and provided the cards were in the condition they were recieved by him. Is that rude? I think not. I did indicated to him that I did have others interested in the set and in my opinion I would have no problem reselling or even breaking it up or even keep it. Its in my opinion an iconic and beautiful set. Again he became irrate and insisted I send him his "dupes" and again I reiterated that if he wasnt satisfied to please send back, simpsle and direct but not rude. No contact after several back and forths w the same then he leaves me negative feedback, which is his right to do so but take a look at my feedback its my "first" negative. Like me or not my intentions on this board is to have fun enjoy collecting and provide the same to others not get into petty internet fights.
I too am guilty of taking this hobby too seriously but over the last year Ive been through a lot, lost my house, my job and collecting has taken a serious back burning to what really matters in life. So I feel blessed and in the end it has been a blessing in disguise. However that is neither here not there, but again it will be hard but my only recourse for this matter is to offer a complete refund provided I recieve my set back. Thank you Jesse Obas
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Old 01-13-2013, 02:30 PM   #56 (permalink)
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The deal was never for $500!!! If you paid over $500 thats your own problem! I have all the pm's dude, the deal was for $350!! For the 'lot'...In your post listing the cards you showed a picture of all 54 cards and said 'from the scans you can see there is dupes'...i have a screenshot of the original post(in case u try to edit it)

If the dupes werent included why would you waste the time to line all 54 up take the picture, and then mention they were in it? Then hand pick the best of the ones you had dupes of and keep them?
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Old 01-13-2013, 02:46 PM   #57 (permalink)
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Without getting into everything else,

it would appear their were some communication issues.

I'm guessing this is the set in question

Iconic 2009 Exquisite Patch Collection Complete SET for trade/Sale

and to paraphrase the first couple lines.

Quote:
Iconic 2009 Exquisite Patch Collection Complete SET for trade/Sale
Details
50 card set (from the pics you can see there are some extra)
I count 4 rows of 11 and 1 row of 10 for a total of 54 cards SHOWN in the pic.
BUT
The seller states that the 50 card set is for sale

If I had been interested in this, the first thing I would have done is clarify whaether or not the extras are included. Similarly, If I had been the one trading it or selling it, I would have had that info clearly stated in the post. Ok so maybe both parties overlook this in the initial conversation. As the negotiations proceed and the price (apparently) goes from $500 down to $350, again regardless of what end I was on , i would have tried to clarify exactly what was being sent.

Finally, while a trade manager is better,
at the end of any successful negotiation here on BO
I get rid of all the gobbledy gook and
I send a final PM that states concisely what is being sent by both parties.

example

otter05 will send 2009 Exquisite Patch Collection Complete SET (or 50 card set plus 4 dupes) in screwdown holders insured with DC and sig conf (or whatever it is you agreed to)
yourmyboyblue2 will pay $350 paypal goods

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Old 01-13-2013, 02:50 PM   #58 (permalink)
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Robert has handled this situation up until now. I hadn't read up on it until this morning. Reading through the moderators log, with what the OP reported and the sale thread, it seems to me that the deal was for the 50 card set, not the extra 4 cards that were also pictured in the shot of the set. Based on how the listing was worded, it seemed pretty clear to me that the 4 dupes were not part of the sale.

Here is the sale thread - Iconic 2009 Exquisite Patch Collection Complete SET for trade/Sale

Taken directly from the thread:
Quote:
50 card set (from the pics you can see there are some extras)
Having read that thread first before all of the reported posts and his convo with fish, it seemed to me that the seller was offering the 50 card set. While the wording was clunky (from the pics you can see there are some extras), that is saying to me that there are cards pictured that are not part of the lot.

From everything I have read so far, it looks like the OP was confused about the sale and thought that the lot contained 54 cards instead of the 50 card set that was stated. The seller offered a full refund when asked about it. unless there are more pms that haven't been reported yet, the first time the dupes were ever mentioned was after the lot was delivered. As far as I can tell, the buyer never asked if the extra 4 cards were part of the lot.

Despite what cking seems to believe and the agenda that she seems to want to push on the board, we do not take sides. We can only do so much and make decisions based upon the information we are given. And in this situation specifically, I have seen nothing to show me that the OP didn't get what he paid for. There may be more to this that I have not seen, but unless were are provided with said information, we can only do so much.
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Old 01-13-2013, 02:57 PM   #59 (permalink)
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Again, how can you not think they were included when he posts a picture of them and says there is dupes in the lot?! Am I supposed to guess which version of the dupes Im supposed to get? No...the post clearly showed a picture of 54 cards, and stated there was dupes!!
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Old 01-13-2013, 02:57 PM   #60 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MetDude View Post
Without getting into everything else,

it would appear their were some communication issues.
Agreed.

It seems the buyer thought he was getting 54 cards and the seller thought he was selling just the 50 at the discounted rate.

Could easily be that both people were telling the truth.

So, the seller offered a full refund to return the 50 cards. Seems fair. Based on his feedback, I would certainly give him the benefit of the doubt.

I do NOT like the two feedback left by the buyer - a negative and a neutral. That is straight BS. That kind of thing may be ok in the new trader utopia site, but not here.

I hope the mods remove the neutral at least. I believe the buyer had the right to leave the negative - although personally I would have left a neutral at the most.
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Old 01-13-2013, 02:59 PM   #61 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by yourmyboyblue2 View Post
Again, how can you not think they were included when he posts a picture of them and says there is dupes in the lot?! Am I supposed to guess which version of the dupes Im supposed to get? No...the post clearly showed a picture of 54 cards, and stated there was dupes!!
I assumed it was in your pm exchange as there clearly was one.

EDIT: Somehow I missed the mod post and both of my previous posts are now moot. Please ignore them. Thanks.
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:03 PM   #62 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by yourmyboyblue2 View Post
Again, how can you not think they were included when he posts a picture of them and says there is dupes in the lot?! Am I supposed to guess which version of the dupes Im supposed to get? No...the post clearly showed a picture of 54 cards, and stated there was dupes!!
No it said a 50 card set was for sale,
and that you can see there are extras in the picture.

It does not explicitly state whether or not the dupes are included.

Both of you assumed the other understood
what the deal was for without bothering to clarify.
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:09 PM   #63 (permalink)
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I assumed it was in your pm exchange as there clearly was one.
No, I asked what he wanted for them, he came back with $10 apiece...I did research on them, the bigger names barely went for that and gave him a list of what they were selling for...Countered at $5 apiece, he said he couldnt take less than $350 for the 'lot'... That being said, with a pic of 54 cards and the post saying dupes and his word lot all suggested all 54 cards which was my assumption...maybe my fault for assuming, but who takes the time to take pic of all 54 and mention them if they werent included, instead of just the 50 that were included?! If Id of paid more would I of got the better versions of the dupes? Or was I just taking a mystery lot


As for otter saying my pms were rude, not a single one was rude, ill forward them to anyone who wants them...And NOWHERE was there a $500 offer made

As far as leaving 2 feedbacks, the nuetral was in his favor, I tried leaving one total but there wasnt room to explain what the nuetral stated(that he did offer refund) and nuetrals dont affect your % rating
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:15 PM   #64 (permalink)
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$500 lot = 50 cards at $10 per

Quote:
Originally Posted by yourmyboyblue2 View Post
As far as leaving 2 feedbacks, the nuetral was in his favor, I tried leaving one total but there wasnt room to explain what the nuetral stated(that he did offer refund) and nuetrals dont affect your % rating
You could have linked your feedback to this thread or the sale thread and updated there. There is NO reason to leave two feedback for one transaction.

The idea that a neutral was in his favor is also ignorant or naive.

Many folks will only see the neutral and the negative and assume they are for two different transactions. Extremely poor form on your part.
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:18 PM   #65 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yourmyboyblue2 View Post
That being said, with a pic of 54 cards and the post saying dupes and his word lot all suggested all 54 cards which was my assumption...maybe my fault for assuming
This perhaps sums up this whole situation. You assumed something, the seller implyed something different. The 4 dupes were not brought up in the exchange when discussing a deal, so my take is that the seller assumed that you knew that the actual 50 card set was for sale, while you assumed that all 54 cards were part of it.

To me, this really seems like a no harm no foul misunderstanding by both parties.
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:19 PM   #66 (permalink)
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$500 was never mentioned in any pm or thread until his on here a bit ago!
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:22 PM   #67 (permalink)
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On what planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by yourmyboyblue2 View Post
As far as leaving 2 feedbacks, the nuetral was in his favor
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:24 PM   #68 (permalink)
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This perhaps sums up this whole situation. You assumed something, the seller implyed something different. The 4 dupes were not brought up in the exchange when discussing a deal, so my take is that the seller assumed that you knew that the actual 50 card set was for sale, while you assumed that all 54 cards were part of it.

To me, this really seems like a no harm no foul misunderstanding by both parties.
Perhaps mistake for 'assuming' but in any thread with a picture of 54 cards and set with dupes stated, why would you assume different? Why did he send the single/2 clr patches instead of the 3clr patches of the dupes? Basically he was playing for he'd send what he wanted depending on how much $ he got for them...

Anybody saying it was a miscommunication...this still hasnt been explained....why take a picture of 54 cards instead of 50? And then mention dupes in the thread?
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:26 PM   #69 (permalink)
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50 card set (from the pics you can see there are some extras).

Based off the way this is worded I believe these should have been included in the sale. If it was just for the 50 cards it should have stated which 50 cards and the picture should have been for only 50 cards. With that being said, sounds like the OP tried to make every thing right in the deal after the fact. I don't understand how the mods see it as any differently. 50 card set with some extras is the way I see it.
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:27 PM   #70 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by yourmyboyblue2 View Post
No, I asked what he wanted for them, he came back with $10 apiece...I did research on them, the bigger names barely went for that and gave him a list of what they were selling for...Countered at $5 apiece, he said he couldnt take less than $350 for the 'lot'... That being said, with a pic of 54 cards and the post saying dupes and his word lot all suggested all 54 cards which was my assumption...maybe my fault for assuming, but who takes the time to take pic of all 54 and mention them if they werent included, instead of just the 50 that were included?! If Id of paid more would I of got the better versions of the dupes? Or was I just taking a mystery lot
From my perspective, the blame is on both parties.
If you asked these questions during the process it likely would have been made clear.
If he had been less ambiguous to begin with there would have been no need to ask.

If either of you had been just a little more detail oriented and sent a final pm stating what was being sent and to please confirm, the other would have said,
whoa wait a sec I'm buying 54 cards not 50/I'm selling 50 cards not 54.

similiarly a trade manager would have borne this out while also eliminating the need for mods to spend excess time reading and examining PM's.

Bottom line, you are both at fault and seller has offered a refund.
Either take it and move on, or be content with what you got and move on.
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:29 PM   #71 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MetDude View Post
From my perspective, the blame is on both parties.
If you asked these questions during the process it likely would have been made clear.
If he had been less ambiguous to begin with there would have been no need to ask.

If either of you had been just a little more detail oriented and sent a final pm stating what was being sent and to please confirm, the other would have said,
whoa wait a sec I'm buying 54 cards not 50/I'm selling 50 cards not 54.
(similiarly a trade manager wold have borne this out while also eliminating the need for mods to spend excess time reading and examining PM's)
I agree, always best to state exactly what is being purchased through final PM.
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:32 PM   #72 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by yourmyboyblue2 View Post
Perhaps mistake for 'assuming' but in any thread with a picture of 54 cards and set with dupes stated, why would you assume different? Why did he send the single/2 clr patches instead of the 3clr patches of the dupes? Basically he was playing for he'd send what he wanted depending on how much $ he got for them...

Anybody saying it was a miscommunication...this still hasnt been explained....why take a picture of 54 cards instead of 50? And then mention dupes in the thread?
For the same reason an ebay seller often posts a picture of 4 cards and says one is for sale.
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:34 PM   #73 (permalink)
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50 card set (from the pics you can see there are some extras).

Based off the way this is worded I believe these should have been included in the sale. If it was just for the 50 cards it should have stated which 50 cards and the picture should have been for only 50 cards. With that being said, sounds like the OP tried to make every thing right in the deal after the fact. I don't understand how the mods see it as any differently. 50 card set with some extras is the way I see it.
THANK YOU! And yes a trade manager would be a great addition to this site, i mentioned it earlier and firmy believe it would help the buy/sell/trading, the site, and the headache for the mods
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:35 PM   #74 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MetDude View Post
For the same reason an ebay seller often posts a picture of 4 cards and says one is for sale.
And in their post they state what card is for sale not that theres 3 other cards...bogus point
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:36 PM   #75 (permalink)
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Trade manager may not help in this case either. It all depends on what they state in the comments - if lot or set is stated that may not may not help because there's lacking details on which patches might be included. All the PM's I have regarding this deal dont spell out the entire details. Which is why there are issues. Also why I told the buyer if he filed a paypal claim I think he'd loose. There's not enough details as to what was purchased IMHO.

Not exactly happy about being called out in this either based on the above postings as I've not only give you responses but been in contact with both parties however the seller in my opinion has been stand up. He's openly stated both in PMs and here if he's not happy send them back and he'll refund his money. What else can a seller do? He's not telling the buyer to go pound sand he's trying to make this right if there was a misunderstanding. If the buyer wants more cards but isnt willing to pay additional for them then the best option left to make both parties happy is to return the cards and get a refund, no?
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