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Old 03-30-2013, 09:41 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default need advice on deal with new member verona

I started a negation with verona on a very high end card that I wanted for my collection. Due to the rarity I am not going to use the real prices discussed.
I asked verona if the card was available and he stated that it was. He quoted me 2,500 on the card, I offered him 2,000 (again not the actual prices). We went back and forth trying to work a potential trade without success and he responded to me "I prefer 2,000 cash" as opposed to the trade we working working on. I said ok sounds good we have a deal send me your paypal. He comes back to a few messages later saying "my friend offered 2,200 when he understood I want to sell the card, so if you can offer more, sorry its only business" I stated that we had already agreed on a deal and that he should honor it. He responds "I think I'll hold the card so I won't be a wrong to you." I responded saying just be reasonable with me we had a deal so lets work it out. and he responds "I can do 2,750 shipped" 250 more than he originally quoted me and 450 more than what he claim his other offer was. Really frustrated, let me know what you think guys, thanks
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Old 03-30-2013, 09:50 AM   #2 (permalink)
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so the two of you came to a deal then he said to up your offer if you wanted it/
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Old 03-30-2013, 09:53 AM   #3 (permalink)
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well we reached a deal, then he said claimed friend offered 2200 and his exact quote was "so if you can offer more"
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Old 03-30-2013, 10:06 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Old 03-30-2013, 10:08 AM   #5 (permalink)
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it's borderline extortion, but i think it's just awful business practice though. When you're negotiating if you say a number, you better be able to stick with it, which is what you did. I just think it's classless and dishonorable.
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Old 03-30-2013, 10:12 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Its a sign of the times...everyone wants as much as they can pinch...I just envision that AT&T commercial where they want to strap a cheetah to the kids grandmas back to make her faster...
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Old 03-30-2013, 10:25 AM   #7 (permalink)
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thanks for the feedback guys
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Old 03-30-2013, 10:27 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by SPauthentic84 View Post
so the two of you came to a deal then he said to up your offer if you wanted it/
Your buddy WIllC just pulled this stunt. But its all good in your books because a friend of yours pulls this stunt. Im waiting for the double standard!

"If my friends extort a buyer its fair game because they are good guys. But if someone else does it, they are frauds and bad people"

Last edited by iluvfish2; 03-31-2013 at 09:26 PM. Reason: whole thing is confusing - closed thread
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Old 03-30-2013, 10:34 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Orangejello, you know absolutely nothing.

Joe (spauthentic) was the first person who told me what I was doing was wrong.

He hasn't once tried to defend me.

You're the most irrational and hate-filled person I have ever had the misfortune of encountering.
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Old 03-30-2013, 10:39 AM   #10 (permalink)
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OJ, thanks for your comment, while I would not have a problem with wilc in any way I'm not sure I would call him a buddy per say. I have actually never done any type of deal with him up until yesterday when I bought a kobe auto from him and paid him for it and then shortly after he messaged me saying he cannot sell it to me because of this whole situation he is wrapped up in so he refunded me and I am not getting the card. Just an FYI and I do not agree with what wilc did
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Old 03-30-2013, 10:51 AM   #11 (permalink)
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That Italian stallion wanted my Jordan card. I never responded to him.
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Old 03-30-2013, 10:55 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Orangejello727 View Post
Your buddy WIllC just pulled this stunt. But its all good in your books because a friend of yours pulls this stunt. Im waiting for the double standard!

"If my friends extort a buyer its fair game because they are good guys. But if someone else does it, they are frauds and bad people"
Can we not litter this thread with other stuff? PM him if you'd like to chat about WillC.
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Old 03-30-2013, 11:01 AM   #13 (permalink)
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OJ, thanks for your comment, while I would not have a problem with wilc in any way I'm not sure I would call him a buddy per say. I have actually never done any type of deal with him up until yesterday when I bought a kobe auto from him and paid him for it and then shortly after he messaged me saying he cannot sell it to me because of this whole situation he is wrapped up in so he refunded me and I am not getting the card. Just an FYI and I do not agree with what wilc did
Honestly, this issue tells you exactly the type of person you are dealing with. I wouldnt bother dealing with such people who go back on their word and play games to "squeeze" a few bucks by selling their integrity.


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Can we not litter this thread with other stuff? PM him if you'd like to chat about WillC.
Its pretty safe to assume there is a hierarchy on these forums. It needs to be fixed NOW. Just because you are well liked, does not give you a free pass to pull unethical moves. These two guys hammered out a deal. Now the seller is going back on his word and you people saying "Its ok do it because he's a good guy bro!". Its not okay. If you dont want the board littered with other stuff then stop your friends from pulling stupid stunts like this. Better yet, stop supporting them when they do attempt to defraud people.
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Old 03-30-2013, 11:16 AM   #14 (permalink)
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OJ, thanks for your comment, while I would not have a problem with wilc in any way I'm not sure I would call him a buddy per say. I have actually never done any type of deal with him up until yesterday when I bought a kobe auto from him and paid him for it and then shortly after he messaged me saying he cannot sell it to me because of this whole situation he is wrapped up in so he refunded me and I am not getting the card. Just an FYI and I do not agree with what wilc did
You should leave WillC appropriate iTrader. He agreed to a deal and did not follow through. He should have a couple negs by now.

For this deal it is quite similar to the SCAM mentioned with WillC. Backs out of a deal after SUPPOSEDLY being offered more. Then he offers it back up at a higher price which ultimately breaks a second agreement. Scam scam scam.
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Old 03-30-2013, 11:24 AM   #15 (permalink)
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leave appropriate feedback to verona - you had a deal in place and he tried to incresae his profits after the fact.
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Old 03-30-2013, 11:25 AM   #16 (permalink)
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yea I think I should do that, I hate to leave a negative but I feel I should in this instance
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Old 03-30-2013, 11:35 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orangejello727 View Post
Honestly, this issue tells you exactly the type of person you are dealing with. I wouldnt bother dealing with such people who go back on their word and play games to "squeeze" a few bucks by selling their integrity.




Its pretty safe to assume there is a hierarchy on these forums. It needs to be fixed NOW. Just because you are well liked, does not give you a free pass to pull unethical moves. These two guys hammered out a deal. Now the seller is going back on his word and you people saying "Its ok do it because he's a good guy bro!". Its not okay. If you dont want the board littered with other stuff then stop your friends from pulling stupid stunts like this. Better yet, stop supporting them when they do attempt to defraud people.
OJ, well I appreciate your concerns, Im not sure what Will has to do with this thread. While you usually bring factually correct information to the boards (I almost said that with a straight face)...

Your facts are wrong in this case. While I am "internet buddies" with Will, I dont condone what he did. I actually told him to sell to the first person he made the deal with. He did what he wanted. He is his own person. If you notice though I didnt stick up for him in his thread, but I also didnt throw mud on him. I was nowhere in that thread. I hate the mob mentality this place comes to at times. I had nothing to add to the 10 page thread its become.

I have no idea why you feel the need to comment on a different topic than OPs thread. You added nothing to this thread, like many others. If you are going to add something, please get the facts straight. It leads to less confusion. Also, please get outside today and take a breath of fresh air. Im sure its been a while
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Old 03-30-2013, 11:36 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Just make sure you don't buy this card, its not worth the stress or time. The people on this forum need to walk away from anyone who says they will sell a certain card for $800 and the buyer accepts then the seller says "well I got an $850 offer, so can you do $900?" Its the only way hiking up the price on cards will stop? Say no!!!!!
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Old 03-30-2013, 11:38 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orangejello727 View Post
Its pretty safe to assume there is a hierarchy on these forums. It needs to be fixed NOW. Just because you are well liked, does not give you a free pass to pull unethical moves. These two guys hammered out a deal. Now the seller is going back on his word and you people saying "Its ok do it because he's a good guy bro!". Its not okay. If you dont want the board littered with other stuff then stop your friends from pulling stupid stunts like this. Better yet, stop supporting them when they do attempt to defraud people.
Please show me where I supported what Will did or called him a friend.

All I am saying is there is a thread on the WillC situation already with all the information you need to know about what happened. No need to bring it up in a thread where someone has a different issue. Contact a mod or something.
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Old 03-30-2013, 11:39 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Situation is def frustrating. Negative for welching on a deal when no money traded hands prob is warranted but you will prob get a retaliatory neg back.

Walk away.

You can't leave a negative on ebay if negotiations break down or deal via invoice doesn't get done.
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Old 03-30-2013, 11:50 AM   #21 (permalink)
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I hope this "I'll tell him I got a higher offer because he accepted that offer so easily" theory isn't going to be the new trend in our hobby. It is extremely shady and greedy! What's wrong with people these days man!?

ONCE A DEAL IS AGREED UPON, IT'S DONE! I think that negatives should be left automatically after someone "backs out" of a deal that has been agreed upon. If not, this fad will only get worse.... Negs are the only way of keeping track and preventing it
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Old 03-30-2013, 12:06 PM   #22 (permalink)
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This social circle of bums apparently is starting to finally show their true face.

I had issues with these guys a long time ago and called them out and nothing was done because supposedly they are the "NICE" guys.

I posted needing a card ($1 value) and spauthentic tried to scam me by trying to suggest the card was worth $45 and to pay that much under the guise I didnt know my stuff! I called him out and all that came from it was "Spauthentic is a good guy, he can do what he wants"

I posted about WillC playing a sap role to sucker people to give him free cards. He then turned around and tried to sell them on the German boards for $$. Unethical in my books. Using peoples charity to profit by laying a sap story. I confronted him about it and the same guys stood up for him saying its WillC, hes a good guy, he can do what he wants. I later called out his shady marketing tactics whereby he ploys to buy Russells cards on the cheap (im getting married blah blah, I dont have money blah blah) then posts a plethora of articles to pimp the player only to turn around and sell them once everyone is on the bandwagon. If anyone else does it, they get burnt and punished. But sinces its WillC, hes a good guy, he is allowed to do it.

Verona pulls this stunt now. Its a form of extortion using the guise of false pretence. Supposedly there is always some mystery buyer willing to pay more everytime you show interest in the card. You offer $1k, and BAM suddenly there is a mystery buyer willing to pay $1200. But at $1300 the card is yours. So you offer $1300 what the heck is a few dollars more. Then BAM...wait there is someone offering more now. We dont know who and ironically its always when you want to buy the card. That is a prime example of extortion. Shilling auctions works the same way.. False activity intended to make the buyer think that there is someone else who is buying to artificially raise the price. Doing this KNOWINGLY is a ponzi scheme through and through.

The only way to stop such gang mentality of unethical behaviour is to stop it from the root cause. The cause in this case is for people to realize that these "good guys" are not good guys. They are con artist that build a false reputation using their same circle of misfits to make you believe that. Thats why they seem good on the outside, but when they deal like weasels in private you finally see their true faces. So what do they do? THey go out and discredit anyone that catches on to their schemes and gangs up on them to get people to stray from their frauding ways. Exactly what Spauthentic is doing.

You might not have said it was okay for him to pull this stunt. But its very apparent with your lack of words that you had no issues with it either. Double standard much?

Ill be sure to get out side today for some fresh air if you promise to stop trying to defraud people into thinking you are a genuine person while pulling unethical stunts in the background. Be man! Show some integrity for once!
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Old 03-30-2013, 12:08 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Please show me where I supported what Will did or called him a friend.

All I am saying is there is a thread on the WillC situation already with all the information you need to know about what happened. No need to bring it up in a thread where someone has a different issue. Contact a mod or something.
This is the same thing happening again. Im telling the OP to not deal with these people. They have been doing it for a while now. They KNOWINGLY are shilling their prices with fake fantom buyers to get people to pay more.
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Old 03-30-2013, 12:11 PM   #24 (permalink)
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I posted about WillC playing a sap role to sucker people to give him free cards. He then turned around and tried to sell them on the German boards for $$. Unethical in my books. Using peoples charity to profit by laying a sap story. I confronted him about it and the same guys stood up for him saying its WillC, hes a good guy, he can do what he wants. I later called out his shady marketing tactics whereby he ploys to buy Russells cards on the cheap (im getting married blah blah, I dont have money blah blah) then posts a plethora of articles to pimp the player only to turn around and sell them once everyone is on the bandwagon. If anyone else does it, they get burnt and punished. But sinces its WillC, hes a good guy, he is allowed to do it.
You are an absolute disgrace to these boards. Despite there being a 10-page thread against me yesterday, at least I'm man enough to admit when I've done something wrong. Nothing that you posted above is true. You are on a witch hunt. I have never seen anyone so bitter and twisted as you are.

1) I was given some cards for free. I never asked for them. Yes, I sold them on, but I made sure that I sent cards of equal value to the kind people who sent me cards. Just ask Shnapper (Andrew). He sent me some Exquisite base cards, so I sent him some TMac jersey and patch cards.

2) I paid well above market value for ALL of my Bill Russell cards. Please provide evidence of me playing a sob-story to get them for cheap? I bought most of them from eBay from emoncards who notoriously over prices his cards. I was happy to pay his prices. I got some other cards from Bostoncorn and paid top dollar for them.

3) I still own nearly ALL of my Bill Russell cards! I sold one of them (the Consummate Masters auto) along with some non-Russell cards so that I could buy my girlfriend's engagement ring. Sorry if that offends you.

4) I posted an awesome GIF of Bill Russell doing a lay-up from the free throw line and you think that's my attempt to inflate Russell's card prices? Hahaha, oh man, you are a funny guy!

Like Joe said, I think it's time you stepped outside and got some fresh air. It must be really dark and depressing in your folks' basement.
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Old 03-30-2013, 12:12 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Orangejello727 View Post
This social circle of bums apparently is starting to finally show their true face.

I had issues with these guys a long time ago and called them out and nothing was done because supposedly they are the "NICE" guys.

I posted needing a card ($1 value) and spauthentic tried to scam me by trying to suggest the card was worth $45 and to pay that much under the guise I didnt know my stuff! I called him out and all that came from it was "Spauthentic is a good guy, he can do what he wants"

I posted about WillC playing a sap role to sucker people to give him free cards. He then turned around and tried to sell them on the German boards for $$. Unethical in my books. Using peoples charity to profit by laying a sap story. I confronted him about it and the same guys stood up for him saying its WillC, hes a good guy, he can do what he wants. I later called out his shady marketing tactics whereby he ploys to buy Russells cards on the cheap (im getting married blah blah, I dont have money blah blah) then posts a plethora of articles to pimp the player only to turn around and sell them once everyone is on the bandwagon. If anyone else does it, they get burnt and punished. But sinces its WillC, hes a good guy, he is allowed to do it.

Verona pulls this stunt now. Its a form of extortion using the guise of false pretence. Supposedly there is always some mystery buyer willing to pay more everytime you show interest in the card. You offer $1k, and BAM suddenly there is a mystery buyer willing to pay $1200. But at $1300 the card is yours. So you offer $1300 what the heck is a few dollars more. Then BAM...wait there is someone offering more now. We dont know who and ironically its always when you want to buy the card. That is a prime example of extortion. Shilling auctions works the same way.. False activity intended to make the buyer think that there is someone else who is buying to artificially raise the price. Doing this KNOWINGLY is a ponzi scheme through and through.

The only way to stop such gang mentality of unethical behaviour is to stop it from the root cause. The cause in this case is for people to realize that these "good guys" are not good guys. They are con artist that build a false reputation using their same circle of misfits to make you believe that. Thats why they seem good on the outside, but when they deal like weasels in private you finally see their true faces. So what do they do? THey go out and discredit anyone that catches on to their schemes and gangs up on them to get people to stray from their frauding ways. Exactly what Spauthentic is doing.

You might not have said it was okay for him to pull this stunt. But its very apparent with your lack of words that you had no issues with it either. Double standard much?

Ill be sure to get out side today for some fresh air if you promise to stop trying to defraud people into thinking you are a genuine person while pulling unethical stunts in the background. Be man! Show some integrity for once!
+1. The "really good guys" seem to end up being the biggest d-bags around. Except for Corbin, of course
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