Blowout Cards Forums
eBay Card Event 4/27/14

Go Back   Blowout Cards Forums > THE MARKETPLACE > Member Sales/Trade Feedback

Member Sales/Trade Feedback Share feedback on Buyers, Sellers, and Traders

Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-12-2013, 04:39 PM   #126 (permalink)
Member
 
Prospectorsadvantage's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Virginia
Posts: 1,186
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kencope View Post
Correct. Here's another example for you. Today I called Topps about a redemption that had not been fulfilled (2012 TTT 6-HOF QB Auto). They're still waiting on some stickers that haven't been signed. I was offered a replacement: a 2012 Andrew Luck Topps Chrome SSP Auto. This is a card that was produced, but not inserted into packs. Still part of the general population of those produced by Topps, but never put into a pack. All companies have a very limited stock of cards that are produced and don't make it into packs. They're still part of the general population (a very small %), that eventually always make it out to the public at some point or another, and were produced so that they would at some point be available to the public. Is the card I was offered not "legit" or "real" because it wasn't put into a pack in a box at your LCS? Should I have been offended that I was offered this card that is clearly worthless because it didn't come from a pack?

I think this is clearly distinguishable from the current situation. Here topps has completed making the card and has simply not released it, compared to the situation with Fleer where the process was not complete and you completed it using the same cutting specifications they would.
__________________

Always buying Highend Items: PhotoBucket:
http://s1176.beta.photobucket.com/user/PACARDS/library/
Prospectorsadvantage is online now  
Old 09-12-2013, 04:44 PM   #127 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 4,216
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by prospectorsadvantage View Post
i think this is clearly distinguishable from the current situation. Here topps has completed making the card and has simply not released it, compared to the situation with fleer where the process was not complete and you completed it using the same cutting specifications they would.
what difference does it make if ken cuts it or jose who works for the company?
JOHNJOHNNY is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 04:45 PM   #128 (permalink)
Member
 
Sikkcaden's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Erie,Pa
Posts: 5,643
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kencope View Post
Correct. Here's another example for you. Today I called Topps about a redemption that had not been fulfilled (2012 TTT 6-HOF QB Auto). They're still waiting on some stickers that haven't been signed. I was offered a replacement: a 2012 Andrew Luck Topps Chrome SSP Auto. This is a card that was produced, but not inserted into packs. Still part of the general population of those produced by Topps, but never put into a pack. All companies have a very limited stock of cards that are produced and don't make it into packs. They're still part of the general population (a very small %), that eventually always make it out to the public at some point or another, and were produced so that they would at some point be available to the public. Is the card I was offered not "legit" or "real" because it wasn't put into a pack in a box at your LCS? Should I have been offended that I was offered this card that is clearly worthless because it didn't come from a pack?

You took the Luck right? If so, when it comes in, its for sale/trade?
__________________
ORLANDO JOHNSON/PAUL GEORGE/Albert Belle and many more! Pacers/Dolphins!
My bucket! http://s1321.beta.photobucket.com/user/sikkcaden/library/
Twitter: @SikkCaden
Sikkcaden is online now  
Old 09-12-2013, 04:48 PM   #129 (permalink)
Member
 
ffwiseguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 1,125
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JOHNJOHNNY View Post
what difference does it make if ken cuts it or jose who works for the company?
Jose is an employee of the company who doesn't get paid based on the secondary value of the card. OP is replicating the same process, and is profiting directly from the sales of the card.

Whether or not that makes a difference to you is a judgement call for yourself, but I think most will agree that for the majority of collectors, it will make a difference in how they value the card.
ffwiseguy is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 04:48 PM   #130 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,112
Default

I didn't. Thinking about it now. The 6-QB autos sells for higher. I started a thread over on SCF for opinions. First time I've ever asked for opinions, but I'm truly torn on what to do on that one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sikkcaden View Post
You took the Luck right? If so, when it comes in, its for sale/trade?
kencope is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 04:51 PM   #131 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 4,216
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ffwiseguy View Post
jose is an employee of the company who doesn't get paid based on the secondary value of the card. Op is replicating the same process, and is profiting directly from the sales of the card.

Whether or not that makes a difference to you is a judgement call for yourself, but i think most will agree that for the majority of collectors, it will make a difference in how they value the card.
what does jose getting paid have to do with a card being cut to specifications?

As long as it is cut to proper specifications, what is the problem.

EVERYTHING IS LEGIT EXCEPT FOR ONE MACHINE VERSUS ANOTHER CUTS THE CARD.

Last edited by JOHNJOHNNY; 09-12-2013 at 04:53 PM.
JOHNJOHNNY is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 04:52 PM   #132 (permalink)
Member
 
spinotron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 894
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kencope View Post
Appreciate your input. My answer to all of your questions is "no". I see those situations as much more egregious, dishonest, and deliberately deceptive.

I am a buyer who is ok with spending hard-earned money on sheet-cut cards. I stated that earlier. I understand this may not be the common opinion, but it is mine. Conducting a poll will have no effect.
I think probably the reason that you are ok buying sheetcut cards at certain price levels is that you can sell them with your money covered and those cards are probably temporary inventory for you to be sold in near future. If the card name got destroyed or market is completely diluted or buyer confidence on this card is totally ruined, then you can just move onto the next type of cards as long as they are profitable in some ways.

So, effectively someone else will be carrying the burden or facing the consequences later or down the road, which is out of sight.

One of the selling points of Jambalaya is the high odds 1:720. The way you sheetcut and inject them into general population unannounced is just diluting the market and mix the good ones with the bad. So things get less rare, and authenticity of any given card becomes a question mark.

Some other sheetcut are easier to tell so that collectors can avoid them, sheetcut playmaker theater won't be embossed, sheetcut Flair legacy has off foil stamping on them. But for those Jambalaya, once you inject them into market, collectors cannot tell or trace back the original source after a while. So althought people are pissed to have Jambalaya sheetcut card but cannot tell when one surfaces, all they can do is entirely avoid it. Thus probably the best unnumbered 90s card get ruined just like that. I won't buy a Jambalaya knowing this, that's for sure.

Moreover, those Jambalaya sheet might not be always out there, but they are not that rare. Also the entire sheet isn't that hard to reproduce.

Also you cannot authenticate sheets being legit and from Fleer bankruptcy sources. So although you claim you won't do above three worse actions, but you could be assisting the worst action of the three.

That's my .02.
__________________
Mainly collecting Kobe and Jordan cards.

PLMK if you want to sell cards which I might need. Thx!

Last edited by spinotron; 09-12-2013 at 04:56 PM. Reason: typo
spinotron is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 04:57 PM   #133 (permalink)
Temporarily Suspended
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 6,286
Default

Plus, people believe "since Beckett graded it then it must be real" - adding to the diluted market
hairyangryfella is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:00 PM   #134 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,112
Default

#1. It is real
#2. Why am I held responsible for people's conceptions of Beckett?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hairyangryfella View Post
Plus, people believe "since Beckett graded it then it must be real" - adding to the diluted market
kencope is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:07 PM   #135 (permalink)
Member
 
spinotron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 894
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JOHNJOHNNY View Post
what does jose getting paid have to do with a card being cut to specifications?

As long as it is cut to proper specifications, what is the problem.

EVERYTHING IS LEGIT EXCEPT FOR ONE MACHINE VERSUS ANOTHER CUTS THE CARD.
How about trimming then? Sheetcutting is cutting from a sheet, while trimming is cutting from the original card.

A small crafty trim will be very close to the standard spec, especially done by laser. Then a flaw is fixed. 7.5 becomes 9.5/10. Value jumps potentially up to 10 folds if 9.5 is literally impossible to get.

Your argument seems to also justify this type of action.
__________________
Mainly collecting Kobe and Jordan cards.

PLMK if you want to sell cards which I might need. Thx!
spinotron is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:14 PM   #136 (permalink)
Member
 
ffwiseguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 1,125
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JOHNJOHNNY View Post
what does jose getting paid have to do with a card being cut to specifications?

As long as it is cut to proper specifications, what is the problem.

EVERYTHING IS LEGIT EXCEPT FOR ONE MACHINE VERSUS ANOTHER CUTS THE CARD.
If that were true, then disclosing it would have no effect on the market value. But the overwhelming view is that it would of course affect the value. Even the OP can't deny that disclosing this fact would have an adverse affect on the value.

My problem with the OP's argument is that it's clearly formed on the spot to support his practice. The things the OP said that are true are:

-He is not providing any false information in his listing (true)
-The uncut sheet is provided by Fleer and is made from the same materials as a pack pulled card (true)
-The cutting process is the same as Fleer's, so the end result is not much different than Fleer's (no way to confirm, but can give him the benefit of the doubt, especially since BGS was willing to grade the card)

Where I disagree, and where I find his argument to be self-serving to his practice are:
-That the origins of the sheet and the cutting process used make this card no different than a pack pulled card (I disagree, but this is the biggest gray area of the argument, and his "strongest" counter to us dissenters)
-He personally would not care if a card is pack pulled or manipulated by a third party, as long as it was not materially different from the original (I don't believe him when he says this)
-That he cannot disclose the true origin of these cards, because he also sells cards that he does not know the origin that may have also been manipulated by third parties (flimsy, self-serving argument)

Arguments can be made to points on each side, but no arguments can be made to the below:
-Having the sheet cut increases the value exponentially over an uncut sheet (after cutting fees is debatable, as I know nothing of this process)
-Selling the cut card on eBay with no disclosure of cutting process is far more profitable than selling with a disclosure
-A BGS grade combined with no disclosure almost 100% ensure that the card will sell for as much as a factory-cut version of the same card

It's up to each person whether or not to believe the OP when he says what his intentions were. It is also up to each person to decide whether these practices in sum are ethical or not.

OP, in the end, you are doing what you are okay with in order to make money to support your family. You're certainly not committing the worst crimes when it comes to this hobby, but in my mind, there is no doubt in my mind that these steps were taken intentionally to make as much money as possible, and that they are wrong.
ffwiseguy is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:20 PM   #137 (permalink)
Member
 
ffwiseguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 1,125
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JOHNJOHNNY View Post
what does jose getting paid have to do with a card being cut to specifications?

As long as it is cut to proper specifications, what is the problem.

EVERYTHING IS LEGIT EXCEPT FOR ONE MACHINE VERSUS ANOTHER CUTS THE CARD.
So if someone bought the same printer and materials used for 86-87 Fleer, printed their own Michael Jordan RCs, and began selling, there would be no ethical issue with that?

The origin and means used to generate the card is important. Even if you can somehow argue that for most collector's it wouldn't make a difference, then disclosing the fact that they were processed in this way and letting the buyer decide for themselves if they want it, and what they would pay for it, is still the right thing to do.
ffwiseguy is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:29 PM   #138 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,112
Default

ffwiseguy - My actions were absolutely done with the intention of making the most money possible. No disagreement. We disagree that they are wrong. Thanks for the perspective.
kencope is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:32 PM   #139 (permalink)
Temporarily Suspended
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 6,286
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kencope View Post
#1. It is real
#2. Why am I held responsible for people's conceptions of Beckett?
Why did you send a sheet cut card to beckett to begin with? Surely if it were labelled as sheet cut it would garner less revenue. But you lucked out with them not stating so, and grading it. They are a shady company and you have taken advantage of that fact.
hairyangryfella is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:37 PM   #140 (permalink)
Temporarily Suspended
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 6,286
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kencope View Post
#1. It is real
#2. Why am I held responsible for people's conceptions of Beckett?
Also, no it is not 'real'. It is a card from an uncut sheet. It may be made the same way as the originals but it is not considered REAL as it did not come from a pack the way REAL cards do.
hairyangryfella is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:39 PM   #141 (permalink)
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 101
Default

Once again Beckett proves to be a joke. They knew the Jordan's were cut and graded them and everyone continues buying into their legitimacy. I wonder if this was "special treatment" from Beckett for the OP after a certain amount of orders. I don't even want to address the OP who perches over this thread from his moral high ground meanwhile selling fake crap to kids/adults on ebay to fund his children's college fund while diluting the entire market with his frankenstein cards. Buy stock or something stop ruining the hobby.
cypher is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:43 PM   #142 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,112
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hairyangryfella View Post
Why did you send a sheet cut card to beckett to begin with? Surely if it were labelled as sheet cut it would garner less revenue. But you lucked out with them not stating so, and grading it. They are a shady company and you have taken advantage of that fact.
Because I felt they were in good condition and would get a premium for a higher grade. Not all of them were sent in for grading, which completely disproves your theory of me doing it to "validate" the authenticity or "realness" in some way. The ones that had centering issues or more major surface issues were not sent in for grading and were just sold raw.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hairyangryfella View Post
Also, no it is not 'real'. It is a card from an uncut sheet. It may be made the same way as the originals but it is not considered REAL as it did not come from a pack the way REAL cards do.
You're entitled to your opinion, but if your argument is based on the fact that only cards that come from a pack are REAL, I would urge you to read above about the replacement I was offered today and explain how that card is not real because it didn't come from a pack.

Last edited by kencope; 09-12-2013 at 05:45 PM. Reason: type
kencope is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:48 PM   #143 (permalink)
Approved Group Break Host
 
Pejarox7620's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Cali
Posts: 4,980
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JOHNJOHNNY View Post
what does jose getting paid have to do with a card being cut to specifications?

As long as it is cut to proper specifications, what is the problem.

EVERYTHING IS LEGIT EXCEPT FOR ONE MACHINE VERSUS ANOTHER CUTS THE CARD.
Because the uncut sheet is supposed to be exactly that...UNCUT...

OP: I understand making the most money is important, but doing shady practices isn't the right way to do it. I do give you kudos for openly admitting it that you cut it yourself, and that you are doing this for the money, but bringing in your kids' education wasn't necessary. I'm just curious Ken but what if someone was to fake a patch card, and the original was a 1 color patch, but the patch faker decides to change it to a sweet logo. So the person buys a patch card of the same player and uses that patch to put into the card, would that be right to you? The "Patch" is real is it not? Its for the right player and everything. Would it be wrong to say the patch isn't real because it came from the same players jersey? No, because technically it is for the right player. But yes the card is now faked since that's not how the manufacturer did it. But again it would be ok selling that card as an authentic card since its for my children's education and it's technically authentic right?
Anyway I have done tons of high end deals with you and i have lost a lot quite a bit of respect for you now. Your practices are extremely shady and doesn't take into consideration of others. But i guess you gotta do what you gotta do to make money
__________________
http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q229/Pejarox7620s_Collection/
Looking For:
Drew Brees High End, 1/1s, or Super Short Prints
Current Open Group Breaks: None

Last edited by Pejarox7620; 09-12-2013 at 05:52 PM.
Pejarox7620 is online now  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:52 PM   #144 (permalink)
Member
 
motu79's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Spokane
Posts: 729
Default

Man, there a lot of people with their panties in a bunch over this. The card isn't fake, it isn't trimmed, it isn't anything but the real deal. I could care less who cut the damn thing.

The fact that BGS slabbed means: 1) It isn't trimmed and 2) it is the same card that was produced in 1997 by Fleer (i.e. it isn't fake)

If people have problems with this then they should take a look at ALL of the cards in their collection. How do you know you don't have a cut sheet card right now?

Also, what is the print run of this card - 300? (I have no idea, this is just hypothetical) What's to say Fleer didn't pack out 295 and hold back 5 uncut sheets for auctions/replacements. This card could still be part of the original print run.

I have no issue with this since it's the original card.
motu79 is online now  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:56 PM   #145 (permalink)
Member
 
SPauthentic84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: PA
Posts: 5,685
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by motu79 View Post
Man, there a lot of people with their panties in a bunch over this. The card isn't fake, it isn't trimmed, it isn't anything but the real deal. I could care less who cut the damn thing.

The fact that BGS slabbed means: 1) It isn't trimmed and 2) it is the same card that was produced in 1997 by Fleer (i.e. it isn't fake)

If people have problems with this then they should take a look at ALL of the cards in their collection. How do you know you don't have a cut sheet card right now?

Also, what is the print run of this card - 300? (I have no idea, this is just hypothetical) What's to say Fleer didn't pack out 295 and hold back 5 uncut sheets for auctions/replacements. This card could still be part of the original print run.

I have no issue with this since it's the original card.
lol this is the definition of trimming...he trimmed the entire card.

Also-remember when beckett graded all those fake patches and that Mike C inscription? (My point is the beckett arguement doesnt add any validation)
__________________
*Photobucket: let me know if you like anything. http://s1114.photobucket.com/user/Marsili84/library/Harder%20To%20Get%20Stuff?sort=4&page=1

*Looking for Pistol Pete Maravich Autographs or other rare HOFers
SPauthentic84 is online now  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:57 PM   #146 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,112
Default

I'm extremely sorry and disheartened that you've lost respect for me in any way, and of course that was never my intent.

These cards are the way Fleer intended them to be in every respect ; the fake patch situation you mentioned is of course not. That's the difference.

Your comments about doing whatever I need to to make money are, quite honestly, hurtful. If I was crossing a moral line in my own mind (and in the scale of humanity, I would consider myself to have quite high morals) then I wouldn't have done it. The fact is, I truly deep down don't believe this practice to be immoral. If others do, that's their prerogative.

My comment about the money going to my children's college education was never meant to be a justification for anything. It was a response to someone saying that I was "in the hobby for the wrong reasons", and I can personally think of no better reason (it is of course fun to me as well). Please don't misconstrue that comment for something it wasn't.

Also, I would disagree that the uncut sheet is supposed to be uncut. It's just that Fleer didn't get around to it. They don't just make uncut sheets for the hell of it. They make it so that they can eventually be cut and released to the public as such.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pejarox7620 View Post
Because the uncut sheet is supposed to be exactly that...UNCUT...

OP: I understand making the most money is important, but doing shady practices isn't the right way to do it. I do give you kudos for openly admitting it that you cut it yourself, and that you are doing this for the money, but bringing in your kids' education wasn't necessary. I'm just curious Ken but what if someone was to fake a patch card, and the original was a 1 color patch, but the patch faker decides to change it to a sweet logo. So the person buys a patch card of the same player and uses that patch to put into the card, would that be right to you? The "Patch" is real is it not? Its for the right player and everything. Would it be wrong to say the patch isn't real because it came from the same players jersey? No, because technically it is for the right player. But yes the card is now faked since that's not how the manufacturer did it. But again it would be ok selling that card as an authentic card since its for my children's education and it's technically authentic right?
Anyway I have done tons of high end deals with you and i have lost a lot quite a bit of respect for you now. Your practices are extremely shady and just doesn't take into consideration of others. But i guess you gotta do what you gotta do to make money
kencope is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 05:59 PM   #147 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 12,479
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by motu79 View Post
Man, there a lot of people with their panties in a bunch over this. The card isn't fake, it isn't trimmed, it isn't anything but the real deal. I could care less who cut the damn thing.

The fact that BGS slabbed means: 1) It isn't trimmed and 2) it is the same card that was produced in 1997 by Fleer (i.e. it isn't fake)

If people have problems with this then they should take a look at ALL of the cards in their collection. How do you know you don't have a cut sheet card right now?

Also, what is the print run of this card - 300? (I have no idea, this is just hypothetical) What's to say Fleer didn't pack out 295 and hold back 5 uncut sheets for auctions/replacements. This card could still be part of the original print run.

I have no issue with this since it's the original card.
So if I cut theses cards, they can be considered legit 1/1 flair legacies?

Just want to cofirm that you are saying uncut cards are real and legit just like pack pulled and what I have below is a real 1/1 from fleer?




Orangejello727 is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 06:00 PM   #148 (permalink)
Member
 
motu79's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Spokane
Posts: 729
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SPauthentic84 View Post
lol this is the definition of trimming...he trimmed the entire card.

Also-remember when beckett graded all those fake patches and that Mike C inscription? (My point is the beckett arguement doesnt add any validation)

First, Beckett doesn't care about patches and inscriptions. They are grading the card and the autograph if there is one.

Also, trimming is when the card is already cut and is then altered afterward. Ken paid thousands of dollars to CUT this card to the exact dimensions and Beckett has determined the dimensions are spot on. Still no issues.
motu79 is online now  
Old 09-12-2013, 06:02 PM   #149 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,112
Default

Well said. Don't join the darkside though, they'll jump all over you, too. And to think, I haven't received a single "thank you" for allowing people to enjoy these cards that would otherwise never have been available (that's a joke people, had to lighten up the mood a little)


Quote:
Originally Posted by motu79 View Post
Man, there a lot of people with their panties in a bunch over this. The card isn't fake, it isn't trimmed, it isn't anything but the real deal. I could care less who cut the damn thing.

The fact that BGS slabbed means: 1) It isn't trimmed and 2) it is the same card that was produced in 1997 by Fleer (i.e. it isn't fake)

If people have problems with this then they should take a look at ALL of the cards in their collection. How do you know you don't have a cut sheet card right now?

Also, what is the print run of this card - 300? (I have no idea, this is just hypothetical) What's to say Fleer didn't pack out 295 and hold back 5 uncut sheets for auctions/replacements. This card could still be part of the original print run.

I have no issue with this since it's the original card.
kencope is offline  
Old 09-12-2013, 06:03 PM   #150 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,112
Default

Not sure how, I don't see a 1/1 on them anywhere?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Orangejello727 View Post
So if I cut theses cards, they can be considered legit 1/1 flair legacies?

Just want to cofirm that you are saying uncut cards are real and legit just like pack pulled and what I have below is a real 1/1 from fleer?




kencope is offline  
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:04 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO
Copyright 2013, Blowout Cards Inc.