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Old 11-17-2013, 12:09 PM   #26 (permalink)
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it's not what the lord wanted.
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Old 11-18-2013, 05:00 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Hendricks clearly did not do enough to take the title away..
GSP meanwhile did do enough to keep the title... but a rematch is the right thing.... supposedly its to happen in Hendricks hometown....
the passing of the torch happens there..
Hendricks will not hold the title thereafter more than 1-2 more fights.
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Old 11-19-2013, 12:38 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Apparently 90% of UFC fans are Hendricks fans. Even that very arena was booing that decision after cheering for GSP during the fight.
what the majority of "fans" think about a fight means little, if anything. i'm not sure there's another sport where fans know so little about what they are watching. i'll even go out on a limb and say that the majority watching UFC fights are "UFC fans"... not MMA fans. that is, they like the UFC including fighters it promotes but don't really know much about MMA in general.

nothing wrong with that. most kids have grown up playing football or baseball or basketball. MMA is relatively new.

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Old 11-19-2013, 01:09 AM   #29 (permalink)
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If you are implying I'm only a UFC fan, that's wrong. If the fans in general, I can see that. As a matter of fact, I'd agree with that 100%
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Old 11-19-2013, 01:44 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Hendricks clearly did not do enough to take the title away..
GSP meanwhile did do enough to keep the title... but a rematch is the right thing.... supposedly its to happen in Hendricks hometown....
the passing of the torch happens there..
Hendricks will not hold the title thereafter more than 1-2 more fights.
what are you talking about ? the winner of the fight was clearly hendricks .
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Old 11-19-2013, 03:01 AM   #31 (permalink)
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If you are implying I'm only a UFC fan, that's wrong. If the fans in general, I can see that. As a matter of fact, I'd agree with that 100%
definitely not implying it about you or anyone on this forum.... just fans in general.

and like i said, i don't even want to judge them too harshly. it's easy to grow up playing little league, sandlot and, eventually, some softball beer league, watch hundreds of baseball games a year on tv, etc. most people just don't get that level of exposure to MMA.
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Old 11-19-2013, 09:06 AM   #32 (permalink)
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what are you talking about ? the winner of the fight was clearly hendricks .
I agree Hendricks won, but after seeing the judges sheet of significant strikes, it makes you wonder what fight they watched.

Now there are rumors surround GSP over brain damage. I really think the fix was in.
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Old 11-19-2013, 09:48 AM   #33 (permalink)
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If that is what you want to believe. Apparently 90% of UFC fans are Hendricks fans. Even that very arena was booing that decision after cheering for GSP during the fight.
90% of UFC fans only score matches on violence. The other 10% must score the fight on a 10 pt system just like the judges. This is why most times decisions don't make sense to hungry violence fans.
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Old 11-19-2013, 09:51 AM   #34 (permalink)
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what are you talking about ? the winner of the fight was clearly hendricks .
How did hendricks win?

here is a good write up without fist fighting that shows what most UFC fans miss when it comes to judging.
Making the Unpopular Case for Georges St-Pierre - Fight Network
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:46 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Orangejello is exactly right...doesnt matter whose face is all damaged..im not a gsp fan by any means but after re watching this fight many times it was alot closer then i thought..hendicks didnt finish and in a close fight champ is always gonna get the nod.....not to mention...and this is my opinion...that in the first round big rig is very lucky that the fight wasnt stopped...he clearly made a quick tapping motion just before gsp let the choke go..weather it was accidental or not who knows....ive rewinded and watched it like 30x and i see what i see.
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:54 AM   #36 (permalink)
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Orangejello is exactly right...doesnt matter whose face is all damaged..im not a gsp fan by any means but after re watching this fight many times it was alot closer then i thought..hendicks didnt finish and in a close fight champ is always gonna get the nod.....not to mention...and this is my opinion...that in the first round big rig is very lucky that the fight wasnt stopped...he clearly made a quick tapping motion just before gsp let the choke go..weather it was accidental or not who knows....ive rewinded and watched it like 30x and i see what i see.
I watched the fight. While Im a die hard GSP fan, I admit he got a beat down. He didn't look right. His chest was small and he just didn't seem excited like he usually does like a spark plug.

But the match was close. I think GSP got in more strikes than Hendricks. I think Hendricks strikes were more powerful did more damage. But pts are scored on frequency to win rounds.

WHen a fight comes down to a decision, the champ does not need to prove himself to win the fight. THe opponent must do everything to take the fight away from the champ. Did Hendricks win decisively? In my opinion, No, it was a close match. Therefore hedricks did not do enough to take that belt away from GSP. If hendricks thought he won, why didn't he win all 5 rounds and knock the champ out? That way he wouldn't leave it up to the judges? WHy? because he couldn't.

GSP didn't knock Hendricks out. But then again, he doesnt have to. He is the champ, you have to take the belt from him. He doesn't have to do anything but defend his belt.
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Old 11-19-2013, 11:05 AM   #37 (permalink)
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what are you talking about ? the winner of the fight was clearly hendricks .
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Old 11-19-2013, 11:40 AM   #38 (permalink)
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By the way:

GSP medically suspended just 45 days by Nevada State Athletic Commission. Hendricks out potentially 6 months.

Maybe GSP did more damage than people think, Firas said GSP's injuries are all cosmetic. MMA is not about BLOOD. Fight was close guys anyone that has watched UFC recently know that Judges ALWAYS lean Champ. Hendricks even claimed he was going 70%, which is STUPID. Even Dana, who though Hendricks won was not happy when he said that. Hendricks thought he won going into round 5 and didn't do much in the round. Guy had 5 minutes to go for the kill and decided to coast.
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Old 11-20-2013, 05:50 AM   #39 (permalink)
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Hendricks may have won the fight, but GSP won the MMA contest. A major thing to point out is that these judges are scoring an MMA contest, not a fight. There is a big difference between the two. The main thing obviously being the 10 point must system for each round. It is simply an antiquated system which was adopted (years ago) from boxing, and it obviously doesn't work the greatest.

MMA fights should be recorded primarily by WINS & DRAWS. No more of these wild decisions (Jones, GSP, etc.) The only way you should get a "W" is if you finish your fight. Also, obviously the only way you would have a "loss" on your record is if you are finished. If the fight doesn't get finished (KO, TKO, SUB) then there is NO winner, a draw goes to both guys! How can you realistically say either guy won when they are both still standing and ready to go?

Either way, the 170lb division is on serious notice with Lawler, Woodley, and Lombard coming up fast from ATT.
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Old 11-20-2013, 09:05 AM   #40 (permalink)
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Every fight's a draw without a finish. I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings, but that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard in my life. The thought of how long it would take to get title pictures sorted out with all the constant rematches alone would be insane. Bottom line is if you don't want the judges deciding your fight than do something about it or live with it.
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Old 11-20-2013, 03:44 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Every fight's a draw without a finish. I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings, but that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard in my life. The thought of how long it would take to get title pictures sorted out with all the constant rematches alone would be insane. Bottom line is if you don't want the judges deciding your fight than do something about it or live with it.
I agree, that's just nuts. Wins and Draws only....not a chance.
While I think Hendricks did enough to win, he left it in the judge's hands and paid the price. There's not much doubt he'll be in the title picture for some time to come.
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Old 11-20-2013, 04:55 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Bottom line is if you don't want the judges deciding your fight than do something about it or live with it.
I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings, but that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard in my life. These are two athletes at the TOP of their game, you don't think that they are trying to finish the fight? The reality is that at such a high level, given the current time-limit/round system...decisions are bound to happen. NOBODY should be rewarded for going to a decision.

Consider how ridiculous the 10-point system is:

Hendricks wins round 2 via rocking GSP (has him wobbly and badly hurt) = Hendricks is awarded 10pts and GSP 9pts
George won round 3 via strikes, regardless of Hendricks' one takedown = GSP is awarded 10pts and Hendricks 9pts

HOW ON EARTH are these two rounds scored the same? How does GSP get the same amount of points for jabbing/slipping punches as Johnny, who in the previous round smashed Georges. This is as far as you need to look to see how messed up the current point system is. It makes NO SENSE that those rounds could be scored the same!

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Old 11-20-2013, 11:01 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Because if he would've really had George more then just wobbled he might of got a 10-8 round. That's why it's the same amount of points and they all live with it and know it going into the fight. I don't understand why fans make everything so personal and not realize stuff like this happens all the time and will continue to happen. We've seen it twice this year alone in big title matchups and regardless of what you say Johny said he gave 70% percent so if you ask me he's the one who should be questioning himself. You didn't hear GSP saying he only gave 70% right. If your only going to give 70% and rest on your laurels thinking you've done enough after one ore two rounds then how much do you really deserve to be champion in all honesty.
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Old 11-21-2013, 03:45 AM   #44 (permalink)
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BI don't understand why fans make everything so personal and not realize stuff like this happens all the time and will continue to happen. We've seen it twice this year alone in big title matchups and regardless of what you say Johny said he gave 70% percent so if you ask me he's the one who should be questioning himself. You didn't hear GSP saying he only gave 70% right. If your only going to give 70% and rest on your laurels thinking you've done enough after one ore two rounds then how much do you really deserve to be champion in all honesty.
I don't have a favorite between GSP/Hendricks so I really am unbiased. Having said that, I wouldn't disagree with you on the above. Regardless, the rules could use a serious rethinking.

There have been a number of fighters that have spoken recently about wanting no time limits, no cage, no gloves, etc. They want to make it more like a fight and less like a sport (with regulation intact, obviously.) They spend a good portion of training camp fighting off/against the cage for crying out loud...this is not a fight. It will never happen due to the image/stigma, however, I am in BIG favor of going back to bare knuckle, no wraps. The truth is that the gloves/wraps/tape do nothing but protect the puncher's hand (you can actually punch much harder with them.) When people freak out about this idea, remember that there are ZERO pads on the shins and you can kick people in the face and head full blast.

Without gloves/wraps, you wouldn't see so many sloppy bar room brawl type fights. If guys continued to fight like Erik Perez/Edwin Figueroa, they would be shattering at least one of their hand's every single fight. It really would force the level of boxing to increase dramatically as punches would have to be much more well placed (those big overhands that land on the back of the head would be particularly risky.) Of course there would be guys that don'y care and throw them anyway haha. Also, I would like to add knees on the ground and make elbows only legal while standing. These are my pipe dreams...
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Old 11-21-2013, 11:23 AM   #45 (permalink)
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I don't think there's anyway ever they could get sanctioned in todays times going back to the way it used to be. I agree the wraps and tape only really protect the fighters hands, but the UFC made all those changes from the early days to make the sport more legit and mainstream. The only real option if you want to do away with poor decisions might be to have fights judged by computers. And by the way according to fight metric Johny won very slightly from what I read even though GSP out landed him. So maybe that's the way of the future I don't really know. I really think the problem lies in fighters thinking they've done enough after 2 or 3 rounds of a 5 round fight though and trying to coast home and then we end up with the judges and half the world being split on who wins.
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Old 11-21-2013, 11:31 AM   #46 (permalink)
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I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings, but that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard in my life. These are two athletes at the TOP of their game, you don't think that they are trying to finish the fight? The reality is that at such a high level, given the current time-limit/round system...decisions are bound to happen. NOBODY should be rewarded for going to a decision.

Consider how ridiculous the 10-point system is:

Hendricks wins round 2 via rocking GSP (has him wobbly and badly hurt) = Hendricks is awarded 10pts and GSP 9pts
George won round 3 via strikes, regardless of Hendricks' one takedown = GSP is awarded 10pts and Hendricks 9pts

HOW ON EARTH are these two rounds scored the same? How does GSP get the same amount of points for jabbing/slipping punches as Johnny, who in the previous round smashed Georges. This is as far as you need to look to see how messed up the current point system is. It makes NO SENSE that those rounds could be scored the same!
I can easily discredit your theory on removing the pt system. What if you win 4 rounds by pounding your opponent each single round, then in the final round he throws a sub on you and makes you tap. What good is your 4 round punishment when he just made you submit in a single round?

Those rounds are scored similar because you are ignoring the technical fight. The judge bases their points on the technical fight whereas you are basing the fight on what you think hurt the most?

What next? awarding a fighter pts because he made the other fight more red?

You need a pt system to atleast add logic back into the decision of choosing a winner. Like I stated before, there are some that base it on the technical fight. THen there are UFC fans who base it on blood and punishment. 2 totally different ways of judging a fight.
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Old 11-21-2013, 11:34 AM   #47 (permalink)
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I don't have a favorite between GSP/Hendricks so I really am unbiased. Having said that, I wouldn't disagree with you on the above. Regardless, the rules could use a serious rethinking.

There have been a number of fighters that have spoken recently about wanting no time limits, no cage, no gloves, etc. They want to make it more like a fight and less like a sport (with regulation intact, obviously.) They spend a good portion of training camp fighting off/against the cage for crying out loud...this is not a fight. It will never happen due to the image/stigma, however, I am in BIG favor of going back to bare knuckle, no wraps. The truth is that the gloves/wraps/tape do nothing but protect the puncher's hand (you can actually punch much harder with them.) When people freak out about this idea, remember that there are ZERO pads on the shins and you can kick people in the face and head full blast.

Without gloves/wraps, you wouldn't see so many sloppy bar room brawl type fights. If guys continued to fight like Erik Perez/Edwin Figueroa, they would be shattering at least one of their hand's every single fight. It really would force the level of boxing to increase dramatically as punches would have to be much more well placed (those big overhands that land on the back of the head would be particularly risky.) Of course there would be guys that don'y care and throw them anyway haha. Also, I would like to add knees on the ground and make elbows only legal while standing. These are my pipe dreams...
If fighters want to fight like that, maybe going underground is the way to go for them. If they want to fight in a death match, by all means go do it. But there is no way society opens up any possibilty such types of throwdowns for television.
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Old 11-22-2013, 06:13 AM   #48 (permalink)
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Those rounds are scored similar because you are ignoring the technical fight. The judge bases their points on the technical fight whereas you are basing the fight on what you think hurt the most?
Like I stated before, there are some that base it on the technical fight. THen there are UFC fans who base it on blood and punishment. 2 totally different ways of judging a fight.
I think you misinterpreted a lot, as well as made some false assumptions. You are kind of emphasizing my point as to why fans need to understand that this is not a "fight," as they see it. MMA is a sport with "strict " criteria for winning. What you said also falls in line with what I stated in that I think Johnny won the fight, but GSP won the MMA match. lol at least Bruce Buffer says, "...and the referee for this contest, as well as, ...and the winner of this contest."

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If fighters want to fight like that, maybe going underground is the way to go for them. If they want to fight in a death match, by all means go do it. But there is no way society opens up any possibilty such types of throwdowns for television.
lol this is one of this biggest misconceptions when it comes to these ideas. As I attempted to point out, as it currently stands you can kick to the head and face of your opponent without restraint. lol please locate the padding in this video. IMO, these highlights are way more brutal than a bare knuckle punch...let's be real here. Without gloves, we may (arguably) see a reduction in wild KOs that fighters don't necessarily "earn" through the execution of excellent technique.

As far as not having a cage, the idea is that an open space, wrestling mat, etc. would be more realistic because you can't jam someone up against the fence to completely nullify attacks, down to even just a simple hip escape. Having no cage would also stop fighters from using it to prevent take downs, escape submissions, and most importantly, to stop wall wrestling. Nobody likes to watch that for more than a few seconds between transitions.

I don't know if I would say no-time limit, but the Gracie's run some grappling tournaments that are submission only. The rules read"

All Matches - 15 min
Finals - no time limit

An athlete must submit their opponent within the 15 minute time limit to win the match and advance in the bracket.

ROLLING OR PULLING A COMPETITOR OFF OF THE MAT
*If an athlete is caught in a submission and PURPOSELY pulls their opponent or rolls off of the mat in an attempt to free themselves from the submission, they will be considered submitted and will lose the match.

**If an opponent is countering a submission and they happen to roll off of the mat but are caught in a deep and completely sunk submission (ie a heel hook or an armlock and the competitor being caught rolls to counter the submission and happens to end up off of the mat) the referee will reset the position in the center of the ring with the submission INTACT to the submitters liking. The referee will give the person caught in the submission the option to tap out before the match is restarted to give a verbal submission. If the competitor refuses and opts out start the match will be restarted with the heel hook in place.

TIE
In case of a tie neither athlete will advance in the bracket."

Do you think that fighters would be highly inclined to try to finish their fights (and early) knowing they only get a W for a finish...and definitely don't want the L (obviously means you were finished.) Think how much more badass a guy like Anderson would seem, knowing that every W on his record is a finish. He would be 26-4 instead of 33-5. Jon Jones 15-"1" instead of 19-"1." Cain 11-1 instead of 13-1. GSP would be 13-2 instead of 25-2 lol.

If this truly is the evolving sport that it seems to be, I believe that rules and format need to be considered in its evolution. Maybe penalize timidity (ie: PrideFC yellow/red cards?) I'm sure we all can at least agree that there is room for improvement.

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Old 11-22-2013, 07:54 AM   #49 (permalink)
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There's always room for improvement, but setting the sport back 20 years doesn't really seem like an improvement to me bud. Until they come up with a better judging system then the 10 point must system we're just stuck with it and should get used to decisions. I personally don't mind decisions as much as most people probably do because I love the technical aspect of MMA. Sure I love slugfests to, but every fight can't be that way.
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Old 11-22-2013, 10:37 AM   #50 (permalink)
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Yea, we'll agree to disagree. I just dont see how making the fight more violent is the key to making fans happy. One messed up society I live in. You give people a sport with a fighter like GSP who throws a technical fight on you and shows what hard work and determination gets you and its thrown out the window because all people want is blood and death.

Do me a favour and watch hockey. If a body check is done properly it does the job and is punishing. Done erratically and it can paralyze a player and end his career. Even death if hit in a certain way. If violence and blood is what you want, legal fighting is not meant for you.

Maybe MMA fights and rules are not the problem. Ever stop to think that maybe fans are the issue?
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