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Old 09-07-2012, 01:09 PM   #451 (permalink)
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I'm still going to collect a Master Set of Season 2. It's a quality product that I really enjoy. I'm not happy with all the secrecy surrounding this product. I'm contacting distributors and this "Secret Squirrel" stuff is getting old.
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Old 09-07-2012, 01:10 PM   #452 (permalink)
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BO trying to hold out and be the last to put product up whether it be cases/boxes/binders so they can sell it at a premium because they will be the only ones in stock and people will pay whatever to get their hands on it. Being the last place where you can find the product it will flood the site, its all business to BO not about collectors or loyal customers, its who has the dough. Btw the link on the front page of BO.com for the "fantastic store" is that BO store front? Id like to call and speak with them and not get this lie sent to me by email and so they can't avoid a followup email questioning their lie.

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Old 09-07-2012, 01:16 PM   #453 (permalink)
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Also, reps from diamond and southern distributors said their orders were severely cut. This release is spread out so thin across the board.
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Old 09-07-2012, 01:33 PM   #454 (permalink)
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Also, reps from diamond and southern distributors said their orders were severely cut. This release is spread out so thin across the board.
Of course they were cut.

And then when the product is $150 per box they will magically have a bunch more for sale.
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Old 09-07-2012, 01:34 PM   #455 (permalink)
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Im actually happy with what Cryptozoic is doing. To many times companies go for the money grab and just crank the presses with no regard to the quality or collectibility of the product. Crypto is keeping the print run low and producing a quality product. Id rather open that one box packed with an autograph and two wardrobe cards for the $90.00, rather then a box that is watered down to stretch the product further then it should be and it might have an autograph and one wardrobe card. I don't see why Crypto should care about the flippers at all. They're not in the business to have other people profit off their product by hoarding the product and selling it at jacked up prices later. We complain all the time about cards not being worth anything cause they are overproduced. Cryptozoic is listening and making a product that is hot, collectible, and somewhat rare. I hope they continue to do this and have no problem with it.
I could not agree more. Crypto cares about their PRODUCTS and that is all you can hope for in a manufacturer, because that pride equates to collectible products that collectors will want.
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Old 09-07-2012, 01:36 PM   #456 (permalink)
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Of course they were cut.

And then when the product is $150 per box they will magically have a bunch more for sale.
That's what I'm sayin', I think ALL OF THEM are going to do this to a degree. Which is sad because once that happens, me and anyone else that doesn't have deep pockets will be forced out of the game. I understand the business aspect of it but it just sucks for the collectors. With the astronomical demand for the product I don't think it would have hurt the value/collectability of the cards at all to up the production more than they did.

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Old 09-07-2012, 01:48 PM   #457 (permalink)
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That's what I'm sayin', I think ALL OF THEM are going to do this to a degree. Which is sad because once that happens, me and anyone else that doesn't have deep pockets will be forced out of the game. I understand the business aspect of it but it just sucks for the collectors. With the astronomical demand for the product I don't think it would have hurt the value/collectability of the cards at all to up the production more than they did.
It's not Cryptozoic's responsibility to water down a good product so that people with limited funds can secure a case. It's also not Crypto's responsibility to stop dealers from charging fair market value. If BO or anyone else presells these boxes for $100+ each and no one buys them, BO will lower the price. If they are gobbled up, then BO will up the price, and rightfully so.

The only issue I have is being told by anyone that they don't have allocations or they only have a certain number of boxes or they got cut by 83% when in reality they DO have allocations and they have more than what they are saying and they didn't get cut 83%, but more likely by 50%. In other words, all the dealers should just tell the truth - most buyers would understand and feel respected and give respect back.
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Old 09-07-2012, 02:01 PM   #458 (permalink)
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It's not Cryptozoic's responsibility to water down a good product so that people with limited funds can secure a case. It's also not Crypto's responsibility to stop dealers from charging fair market value. If BO or anyone else presells these boxes for $100+ each and no one buys them, BO will lower the price. If they are gobbled up, then BO will up the price, and rightfully so.

The only issue I have is being told by anyone that they don't have allocations or they only have a certain number of boxes or they got cut by 83% when in reality they DO have allocations and they have more than what they are saying and they didn't get cut 83%, but more likely by 50%. In other words, all the dealers should just tell the truth - most buyers would understand and feel respected and give respect back.
I'm not crying because I can't afford as many boxes as other people; I'm not even talking about price, I'm talking about AVAILABILITY. It's not watering down a product if you are increasing the supply to match the demand. Compared to Season 1's numbers, they are only increasing production slightly while demand has greatly increased. If I had paid more attention in my Economics courses I could come up with more than that, but alas, I didn't. All I'm trying to say is I don't think they match up.
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Old 09-07-2012, 02:04 PM   #459 (permalink)
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I'm not crying because I can't afford as many boxes as other people; I'm not even talking about price, I'm talking about AVAILABILITY. It's not watering down a product if you are increasing the supply to match the demand. Compared to Season 1's numbers, they are only increasing production slightly while demand has greatly increased. If I had paid more attention in my Economics courses I could come up with more than that, but alas, I didn't. All I'm trying to say is I don't think they match up.
they increased production by 40-50%; how many walker wardrobe cards do we need before they are so oversaturated they aren't even worth $5? S1, with only 5000 boxes produced, still has walker cards bringing less than $10 each. So you have to be very careful here. You have to factor in that the product is available; it's just being hoarded.
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Old 09-07-2012, 02:12 PM   #460 (permalink)
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they increased production by 40-50%; how many walker wardrobe cards do we need before they are so oversaturated they aren't even worth $5? S1, with only 5000 boxes produced, still has walker cards bringing less than $10 each. So you have to be very careful here. You have to factor in that the product is available; it's just being hoarded.
I didn't know it was increased that much. It still doesn't seem like enough considering one message board of fans [us] is struggling to find a place to order a single box, and will still have that problem even after Blowout posts their pre-sales. There will be a lot of people who will be left out altogether. Of course we'll just have to deal with it but that's my thoughts on the situation.
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Old 09-07-2012, 02:26 PM   #461 (permalink)
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Wow... I'm not going to hate on CZE for being secretive about this set. I mean I could... but then again they didn't have to MAKE them in the first place.

I'll just be happy with any boxes that I get but man am I not going to burn the house down with them in it just because I'm angry.
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Old 09-07-2012, 02:55 PM   #462 (permalink)
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Did you ever think the reason Blowout is waiting on their allocations is to ensure that their customers get the product they ordered and not have their order cut? Maybe BO does know what they are getting, maybe they don’t, but I bet when you preorder it you won't get an Email saying "Your order has been reduced"! If the supply out paces the demand it’s a smart business decision to slow down and ensure your distributors can and will provide the product you ordered. How many people on this thread have been bit-hing about their cases being cut to boxes or nothing at all.
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Old 09-07-2012, 02:57 PM   #463 (permalink)
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Nevermind... this is getting old
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Old 09-07-2012, 02:59 PM   #464 (permalink)
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Nevermind... this is getting old
old wasn't the word i was thinking of, lol. wow.
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:10 PM   #465 (permalink)
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I don't blame Cryptozoic for any of this. The first set was such a huge success, you knew everyone and their mother was going to be clamoring for the follow-up. You've now got 100 people vs 10 the first time trying to get their hands on this stuff (I just picked random numbers, you get the idea). It's all playing out the way you would expect it to. Anyone pre-ordering this product should have known from the get-go there would be no guarantee of actually getting any because you know every distributor that bought in the first time probably at least tried to quadruple what they ordered before (cha-ching). When the supply doesn't equal the demand...

And I think it's great they're not going to simply cash in and flood the market with over-production just to meet the demand. When's the last time there was this much anticipation for a non-sports set? The Walking Dead cards will be talked about for a long time.
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:16 PM   #466 (permalink)
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When's the last time there was this much anticipation for a non-sports set?
Forget non-sports, I think it's up there with 03-04 exquisite nba and 2010 bowman bb in terms of anticipation/hype.
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:24 PM   #467 (permalink)
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I know that the person I am getting my two cases from ordered 10 cases of Season 1, and was allocated 10 cases of Season 2 as well.
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:27 PM   #468 (permalink)
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I know that the person I am getting my two cases from ordered 10 cases of Season 1, and was allocated 10 cases of Season 2 as well.
I ordered one case of binders for season one, and I am getting one case of binders for season 2. Yet there were 500 binders made for season 1, and 750 binders made for season 2.
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:28 PM   #469 (permalink)
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I know that the person I am getting my two cases from ordered 10 cases of Season 1, and was allocated 10 cases of Season 2 as well.
Sounds about right. I was allocated what I ordered of Season 1 myself.
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:29 PM   #470 (permalink)
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I hold Cryptozoic to just as much fault. My understanding is that they've barely raised the production because they want their items to be "collectible".

"Collectible" and "Rare" don't always go hand-in-hand. You can have a collectible product with a high production run. You can cut the Autos to 1 every 2 boxes while upping the Sketches to 2/case. This is a rare occurrence where that would work. Enough to satisfy sellers, collectors and flippers and not make all 3 royally pissed off at you.

Again, I made the mistake that CZE was a company that actually cared about collectors and made products that people wanted, all while making a profit that they do deserve. This tells me that they just want to F*** with people with a big smirk on their faces.

So, in addition to the retailers crapping on the collectors, we now have the company crapping on collectors. Is Richard McWilliam running CZE? I've gotten more and more away from Sports cards because of the corruption and terrible quality. Now, I see the beginnings of the same thing happening here. This strategy will surely backfire on CZE.

I await the response from CZE.
Wow, some of the most off base comments about a card company that I have ever seen. CZ has stated that they want to be very careful when raising production as to not produce a watered down product that will hold no value.

As to dropping autos to one a box, that would make the product less desirable. Doubling the sketch count as well as increasing production? Sure, if you want to get lower quality sketches (IF you could get the images approved) as your 1-2 per case hit.

Comparing the company which has been churning out hit product after hit product with "Dick" McWilliam and his illegal tactics is simply moronic, especially when they are passing up on more money to keep the products limited and collectable.
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:39 PM   #471 (permalink)
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I think Madbacker made a great point though about the current situation of Sports Cards. Those guys release so many damn products in a year that getting a high draft pick doesn't even recoup the cost of a box, much less a case. I bought a lot of Walking Dead and BBT because the price of buying singles was about equivalent to buying a box. It is annoying how since series 1 went sky high you now have all these people who normally buy sports cards buying this just to make a quick buck. I don't have all the answers but I wish Cryptozoic and the various retailers could help out those who made series 1 a success by giving us a chance at a case for ourselves to open, keep, and collect. If I do get my hands on a case, the only way I'd sell a card would be if I got doubles of it. Even then I'd much rather trade for a card I didn't get than sell it off. I get his frustration because I think a lot of us feel the same way. Look back at that first few pages of this post, a lot of us die hard fans have been here since the beginning, it just stinks that we may not get a chance at what Cryptozoic has to offer. Either way, if I can'e get a case of this, maybe I'll just put it towards BBT because regardless, Cryptozoic makes a fantastic product.
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:45 PM   #472 (permalink)
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I think Madbacker made a great point though about the current situation of Sports Cards. Those guys release so many damn products in a year that getting a high draft pick doesn't even recoup the cost of a box, much less a case. I bought a lot of Walking Dead and BBT because the price of buying singles was about equivalent to buying a box. It is annoying how since series 1 went sky high you now have all these people who normally buy sports cards buying this just to make a quick buck. I don't have all the answers but I wish Cryptozoic and the various retailers could help out those who made series 1 a success by giving us a chance at a case for ourselves to open, keep, and collect. If I do get my hands on a case, the only way I'd sell a card would be if I got doubles of it. Even then I'd much rather trade for a card I didn't get than sell it off. I get his frustration because I think a lot of us feel the same way. Look back at that first few pages of this post, a lot of us die hard fans have been here since the beginning, it just stinks that we may not get a chance at what Cryptozoic has to offer. Either way, if I can'e get a case of this, maybe I'll just put it towards BBT because regardless, Cryptozoic makes a fantastic product.
You are definitely barking up the right tree - the sports card dealers are completely different from the non-sports card dealers. Same goes for the collectors.

My non-sports supplier(s) has been communicative and it looks like i will get my allotment. My sports card suppliers are not communicative and it looks like I will be cut WAY back or shut out.
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:50 PM   #473 (permalink)
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Tim wrapped it up better than I did - and much shorter.
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:58 PM   #474 (permalink)
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I think Madbacker made a great point though about the current situation of Sports Cards. Those guys release so many damn products in a year that getting a high draft pick doesn't even recoup the cost of a box, much less a case. I bought a lot of Walking Dead and BBT because the price of buying singles was about equivalent to buying a box. It is annoying how since series 1 went sky high you now have all these people who normally buy sports cards buying this just to make a quick buck. I don't have all the answers but I wish Cryptozoic and the various retailers could help out those who made series 1 a success by giving us a chance at a case for ourselves to open, keep, and collect. If I do get my hands on a case, the only way I'd sell a card would be if I got doubles of it. Even then I'd much rather trade for a card I didn't get than sell it off. I get his frustration because I think a lot of us feel the same way. Look back at that first few pages of this post, a lot of us die hard fans have been here since the beginning, it just stinks that we may not get a chance at what Cryptozoic has to offer. Either way, if I can'e get a case of this, maybe I'll just put it towards BBT because regardless, Cryptozoic makes a fantastic product.
That's actually not true. You will always have flippers - but to generalize a comment about sport card buyers picking this up to flip it, is just plain incorrect.

However, when these boxes were $150ea, I did see people who NEVER bought non-sport wax opening the product.. Why? Because this was a show they enjoy. They were/are huge fans and having something besides the same stuff you see year after year - it was great for the market. I also saw people purchase these boxes because it was something they could open and not "hide" from their wife. Actually, it was something they could open with their wife because they enjoyed the series too.

What's happened here - is you have a product(s) that's brought in all new fans - not just the same non-sport collector we've always had. I think the non-sport niche market isn't use to this and it's just blown everyone away. The sport card market has dealt with this for years and it's nothing new. Hell, go read the Bowman Jumbo threads every year when it's pre-sell time... Same thing
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Old 09-07-2012, 04:01 PM   #475 (permalink)
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That's actually not true. You will always have flippers - but to generalize a comment about sport card buyers picking this up to flip it, is just plain incorrect.

However, when these boxes were $150ea, I did see people who NEVER bought non-sport wax opening the product.. Why? Because this was a show they enjoy. They were/are huge fans and having something besides the same stuff you see year after year - it was great for the market. I also saw people purchase these boxes because it was something they could open and not "hide" from their wife. Actually, it was something they could open with their wife because they enjoyed the series too.

What's happened here - is you have a product(s) that's brought in all new fans - not just the same non-sport collector we've always had. I think the non-sport niche market isn't use to this and it's just blown everyone away. The sport card market has dealt with this for years and it's nothing new. Hell, go read the Bowman Jumbo threads every year when it's pre-sell time... Same thing
Exactly - and this is funny because I was JUST telling my wife last night that WD is the first product I have ever seen where non-trading card people want a piece of the product! It is transcending the trading card market.
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