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-   -   Marvel Beginnings or Bronze Age? (http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/non-sports/407730-marvel-beginnings-bronze-age.html)

101stLee 12-02-2012 02:26 PM

Marvel Beginnings or Bronze Age?
 
So ive been ahuge Marvel fan since I was a kid... completed most of Marvel 3 and all of masterpieces 92. With that being said, I'm getting back into the hobby, which case / set will hold better value, better artists , etc... I'm also a huge Gambit fan... thanks

Spider-Fan 12-02-2012 02:57 PM

Well if you are looking for Gambit I don't think you'll find much in Bronze Age because I don't think he came into play until after that era. If you are looking for sketch cards, Bronze age will give 1 per box, the odds for Beginnings 1 & 2 were 1:3 boxes.

Personally, I'm going to buy a box of Bronze Age and a mini master set of MB3 from a rip-n-flip dealer. I bought 3 boxes of MB1 and didn't complete a base set, die-cut set, or prime set. Pulled 1 sketch, 1 holo, 1 printing plate and a bunch of auto comic covers. As a collector I thought it was a huge loss.

If you can afford to buy cases, you are in a different boat from me. Not sure which is better - but I don't think the Rittenhouse stuff holds much value unless you pull a 'premium' sketch. You normally get a full base set per box, so they tend to sell pretty cheap. You need to buy an entire case to make the subsets. I think that if you buy a case and don't make all of the subsets, you can file a case with Rittenhouse they will send you whatever you missed (except you usually have to cash in your wrappers to get one subset card). The Upper Deck stuff probably has better resale value for anything you don't want to keep, but the randomization isn't nearly as good. I don't know what a case 'guarantees' you.

Cork&Fuzz 12-02-2012 03:07 PM

Which cards have a better point stock/gloss/graphics card set, Upper Deck MB or Ritttenhouse Greatest Heroes? So what would be the idea behind buying a case of Rittenhouse if your a set builder and a complete set comes in one hobby box? Also did not know if you bought a case from Rittenhouse and did not complete the entire sub sets that they compensate you. Good to know. Thanks!

Zerokruel 12-02-2012 03:09 PM

Without getting into a long discussion - I like MB. I think it's a very well put together series. You just need to make sure the hit ratio is for you.

Igman7 12-02-2012 05:48 PM

For those who mainly like the thrill of the hunt of the base and chase, it is hands down Beginnings. It takes at least a case to put all of the low chase together and a great hunt to get the autos and holograms. Sketches are not the primary focus here, but you will tend to see more done by relevant Marvel Comics artists.

While there will be some beautiful sketches in Bronze Age (you will get shut out on Gambit as previously mentioned), there are 2-3 dealers who will open TONS of the product. One in particular is promising to have "over 2,400" sketches available. The mega busters seem to all get "above odds" on all of the best cards as well.

As far as "down the road value" both sets will decrease in time but it happens much quicker on the RA products as those same mega busters will dump all of the base/chase/master sets in order to move on to the next thing. There really are not any large dealers busting Beginnings because UD does not give them a boatload of incentives (free merchandise to lower the cost in volume) as RA does.

Spider-Fan 12-02-2012 06:00 PM

[QUOTE=Cork&Fuzz;3740410]Which cards have a better point stock/gloss/graphics card set, Upper Deck MB or Ritttenhouse Greatest Heroes? So what would be the idea behind buying a case of Rittenhouse if your a set builder and a complete set comes in one hobby box? Also did not know if you bought a case from Rittenhouse and did not complete the entire sub sets that they compensate you. Good to know. Thanks![/QUOTE]

Double check that, but the odds work out and that is what I have assumed from reading product info on the website. Have never put out the $$ to get an entire case for myself.

BHotz 12-02-2012 06:19 PM

From a value perspective, it's Bronze Age hands-down.

Here's a recent break of Marvel Beginnings II for myself -->

3 boxes =
$4.99 auto
$4.99 auto
$9.99 sketch
$29.99 inserts
$50 TOTAL for $150+ worth of boxes

There's just too many ~$5-10 hits for MB II to be worthwhile outside of case breaks which can still be very hit or miss.

Whereas Bronze Age is loaded with nice sketches and $$ artists. Rumor is Rittenhouse really doubled-down on sketch quality/artists to make-up for the last two sets which are still being discounted/easily found. Also from my experience, set-building and selling is more profitable from Rittenhouse especially with sets that have parallels.

BUT, many above make great points so if value isn't your main concern... it's close. Personally, I still like Rittenhouse inserts more and hopefully they can continue to be innovative with more things like shadowbox.

aggie4ever 12-02-2012 06:32 PM

If you haven't opened up any MB before, then you might consider MB II, since you can get a box of that for $15-20 cheaper than MB III.

Spider-Fan 12-02-2012 07:19 PM

[QUOTE=aggie4ever;3741974]If you haven't opened up any MB before, then you might consider MB II, since you can get a box of that for $15-20 cheaper than MB III.[/QUOTE]

Another good point. If you are a collector looking to make a set, even if its just a base set, MB3 starts at 361. I wouldn't feel complete without starting from the beginning. Bronze Age, on the other hand, is a stand alone set.

I like the quality of the base cards better for Rittenhouse over Upper Deck. I think the stock is a little heavier and there isn't any foil so they don't stick together.

As far as the art goes - that is personal preference. I'm a big fan of the MB base cards. Rittenhouse has done some cool stuff in the past, Dangerous Divas was my favorite in that respect because each 9 card binder page made up a nice puzzle on the backs. Not sure if they are doing anything like that with this set.

I'd say the subset cards are about equal in 'coolness'. I really like the MB prime cards (although I have had problems with peeling on the edges when cards are sitting in a box in soft sleeves and top-loaders). The MB subsets are very large though and you really have to be willing to make the investment if you want to collect them. The odds of pulling a hologram are the same as a printing plate or a sketch card, making that set impossible to pull from box breaks alone (well... not impossible, but it wouldn't make sense economically when you can buy the holos for $25-$50 a piece)

MCAutoGraphs 12-02-2012 08:37 PM

exactly why base sets kill me, i wanted to try some MB2 but as you mentioned I also would personally like to start from the beginning as well so i just couldn't see doing it that way. Also agree Marvel has way better artists/characters VS Rittenhouse/DC...though you won't hit Gambit - id choose Bronze Age just cuz you can start it & not have to go back into prior releases.

After my 1st Marvel Premier break the other day id rather recommend that just due to ROI or better chance to hit a Gambit or trade someone for one (have seen some pretty nice Gambit ones in Premier)

101stLee 12-02-2012 09:28 PM

Man all great points, im liking the MB's, but Rittenhouse is certainly looking good too.. ugh decisions decisions.. :( .. I can't do premier way too expensive at the moment. Thanks, I think I'll have to look at it more! Bronze comes out on the 5th, while MB on the 18th, gives me more time to save .. hmm damn!

Spider-Fan 12-02-2012 11:13 PM

If $$ is a factor, I wouldn't pre-sale either. Both releases tend to drop below the pre-sale price after like 3 months, and there is plenty of product available that you'll be able to get it pretty easily off of Amazon, Dave & Adams Card World, or Pittsburgh Cards. I picked up my MB1 boxes at about $45 each, and MB2 was selling at that price on Black Friday. The Rittenhouse stuff tends to drop to about $55/box. You can buy the current release at that price right now if you are just itching to tear some packs open. If you ask around this forum, you might be able to get a couple boxes of Bronze Age for under $60/box right now.

101stLee 12-03-2012 12:47 AM

aw what!? I just bought a hobby box for MB1 and MB2 at around 55-63 a box :( can you PM where you can get them at 45 a box? Also, the presell case for the Rittenhouse is 700+, decent price?

Igman7 12-03-2012 11:04 AM

A check of Ebay shows that you can get a case of Bronze Age for
about $650 delivered.

monkeymcgee 12-03-2012 12:34 PM

I don't see how the rip and flippers do it with that one guy listing 2,400 sketches right out the gate (and I guess there are one or more others who do that too). Seems like that will destroy resale value.

As a buyer, it's great, but as a seller that would suck.

Zerokruel 12-03-2012 12:46 PM

[QUOTE=monkeymcgee;3745682]I don't see how the rip and flippers do it with that one guy listing 2,400 sketches right out the gate (and I guess there are one or more others who do that too). Seems like that will destroy resale value.

As a buyer, it's great, but as a seller that would suck.[/QUOTE]

As a seller, it sucks. This is the one reason I will never touch another Rittenhouse product again. It's a came played with the Incentive program, and it kills everything else. However, if your quick when they list the sketches - you can actually get some cheap and resale them. I know I bought 2 last year from him, and I made a decent profit on them.

This is actually why I like MB. Those same sellers don't whore out the product and cause a sudden crash in value - plus their isn't an incentive game played. It's tough for those retailers to get their hands on bulk quantities of non-sport UD out the gate.

Rian Fike 12-03-2012 01:14 PM

[QUOTE=monkeymcgee;3745682]I don't see how the rip and flippers do it with that one guy listing 2,400 sketches right out the gate (and I guess there are one or more others who do that too). Seems like that will destroy resale value.

As a buyer, it's great, but as a seller that would suck.[/QUOTE]

It has definitely gutted the market for the sellers down the road. It has also driven a large gap between prices for the top value artists and the rest.

But.

It is a wild party on midnight of release day. Tomorrow night will be a blast. Things at the top end sell really fast, and there is a flood of amazing artwork.

Treasue hunt!!!

101stLee 12-05-2012 03:23 AM

damn! Adam's cards are going for over 150 :( .. I guess that's normal?


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