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Old 10-25-2013, 08:53 AM   #876 (permalink)
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@pitviper,

Didn't see that, bit disappointing if true. Any higher end ones or puzzles appeared yet?

I am guessing as Ted says, the dam will break over the weekend and we will get a very quick feel for quality of the release.

Still optimistic. I'll confirm over the weekend!
You shouldn't really use ebay as a guide: more often than not the best sketches will be kept in personal collections and the mid-quality or lower will end up being sold off.

Best to keep an eye on fan box breaks to get a sense of quality.
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Old 10-25-2013, 08:54 AM   #877 (permalink)
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Unless I'm missing something, he's merely matching the prices already being set by someone else (ups1298) on the base sets. Although the chase set price is much lower than those already listed.
he listed MASTER sets at $49.99 Best Offer. So after fees and shipping he is down to about $35 per set and that's if he doesn't take a lower offer. Considering you get two masters per CASE, that is beyond absurd.
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Old 10-25-2013, 08:58 AM   #878 (permalink)
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i only broke two cases last night and he is my honest, non-biased assessment.

First the good:

Wow! considering I only have one "bad" where do i start? the base card stock, the base card art, the story, the medallions, the patches, the other hits, the golds (look great!), the inserts, the collation, the QC - this is a fantastic release and topps should be very proud.

the lone bad:

man the sketches were a big miss. i got 16 sketches and at least 12 are hurried, MA Heritage type sketches. What a letdown after seeing all the ones here that were previewed. and only 1 of the other 4 was stellar.

of course, two cases is a very small sampling but that's all i have to go on for now. will break a lot more today/tonight. overall, this is going to be a strong release, especially if those patches and medallions catch on, which i think they will!
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Old 10-25-2013, 09:12 AM   #879 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Tim View Post
i only broke two cases last night and he is my honest, non-biased assessment.

First the good:

Wow! considering I only have one "bad" where do i start? the base card stock, the base card art, the story, the medallions, the patches, the other hits, the golds (look great!), the inserts, the collation, the QC - this is a fantastic release and topps should be very proud.

the lone bad:

man the sketches were a big miss. i got 16 sketches and at least 12 are hurried, MA Heritage type sketches. What a letdown after seeing all the ones here that were previewed. and only 1 of the other 4 was stellar.

of course, two cases is a very small sampling but that's all i have to go on for now. will break a lot more today/tonight. overall, this is going to be a strong release, especially if those patches and medallions catch on, which i think they will!
Not happy you pulled a lot of what you consider poor sketches (would be curious to see them) but glad to hear that otherwise you're very happy. Very pleased there was lots for you to enjoy! Hopefully you'll pull some gem sketches in your next few cases and make up for what you didn't like.
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Old 10-25-2013, 09:15 AM   #880 (permalink)
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Not happy you pulled a lot of what you consider poor sketches (would be curious to see them) but glad to hear that otherwise you're very happy. Very pleased there was lots for you to enjoy! Hopefully you'll pull some gem sketches in your next few cases and make up for what you didn't like.
will post them tonight or link you to ebay - again it's only two cases so i am not worried here but had to post honest assessment of those two cases.

oh and just checked - gelavi LOWERED his master set to $39.99 with BO! he sold five already. i will let him sell his off; i am not matching him or stormshadow this time around b/c i believe in the quality of this release!
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Old 10-25-2013, 09:31 AM   #881 (permalink)
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I ordered two boxes through Blowart Cards, and according to UPS tracking, my box arrives today, and my Mom's getting hers on Monday. Woo-hoo!
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Old 10-25-2013, 09:34 AM   #882 (permalink)
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WOW. You really can't please everyone. This is an excellent sketch, and one i'd love to have way more than his Heritage pencils.
You're kidding right? To each his own, but degree of difficulty is not as subjective as taste. I can do a better version of the "new" sketch, I however, I could not do this:

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Old 10-25-2013, 09:35 AM   #883 (permalink)
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Didn't see any big names - the crapy-ness of the "new" Teranishi sketches stood out to me - compared to the nice pencils he did for Heritage:

I like Robert's work, and this one is no exception.
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Old 10-25-2013, 09:39 AM   #884 (permalink)
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I like Robert's work, and this one is no exception.
I agree I think hes way underrated. The new sketches look too much like those awful stencils, by someone other than Russ Walks lol.

I'm hoping to see more cards of his - maybe he mixed styles.
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Old 10-25-2013, 09:40 AM   #885 (permalink)
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Pitchfork and torches time.

And Teranishi does GREAT work.
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Old 10-25-2013, 09:40 AM   #886 (permalink)
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I agree I think hes way underrated. The new sketches look too much like those awful stencils, by someone other than Russ Walks lol.

I'm hoping to see more cards of his - maybe he mixed styles.
LOL.

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Old 10-25-2013, 09:47 AM   #887 (permalink)
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We need to see more breaks, it's still too early, and I agree with @Alvin that ebay listings are not always representative if best cards are cherry picked for personal collection.

Perhaps @Tim can upload the first batch of sketches for discussion. :-)
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Old 10-25-2013, 09:48 AM   #888 (permalink)
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LOL.

I'd much rather have the ink than the pencil. His pencils were too light on MAH for my tastes.

Keep in mind, I like to frame/display my sketches. So I want something that's going to stand out.

Plus I find the compositions he did this time were far more impressive. His soldiers coming out of the fire really knocked me over.

EDIT: Sorry, quoted the wrong post! Was responding to someone else.

Last edited by alvin; 10-25-2013 at 10:27 AM.
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Old 10-25-2013, 09:49 AM   #889 (permalink)
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will post them tonight or link you to ebay - again it's only two cases so i am not worried here but had to post honest assessment of those two cases.

oh and just checked - gelavi LOWERED his master set to $39.99 with BO! he sold five already. i will let him sell his off; i am not matching him or stormshadow this time around b/c i believe in the quality of this release!
HE's going to get bitten on his master sets. Those Anatomy cards are NOT easy to get a full set! And they are easily my favorite insets (medallions a close second)
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Old 10-25-2013, 09:57 AM   #890 (permalink)
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I'd much rather have the ink than the pencil. His pencils were too light on MAH for my tastes.
Yeah, I love his bold confidence in the inks. The pencils ones are obviously more detailed, but I really think "less is more" in this case.
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Old 10-25-2013, 09:57 AM   #891 (permalink)
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I like that b&w ink above too.
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Old 10-25-2013, 10:00 AM   #892 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Tim View Post
will post them tonight or link you to ebay - again it's only two cases so i am not worried here but had to post honest assessment of those two cases.

oh and just checked - gelavi LOWERED his master set to $39.99 with BO! he sold five already. i will let him sell his off; i am not matching him or stormshadow this time around b/c i believe in the quality of this release!
This is pretty much why I am done breaking cards in general, non-sport and sport. The wave of case breakers right now absolutely slaughter the market right off the bat. Look what happened with GPK chrome. I was preselling sets for $50-$60 each then here comes the listings at sub $30 and lower. Amazing.
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Old 10-25-2013, 10:02 AM   #893 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by richo View Post
We need to see more breaks, it's still too early, and I agree with @Alvin that ebay listings are not always representative if best cards are cherry picked for personal collection.

Perhaps @Tim can upload the first batch of sketches for discussion. :-)
I can show you the two i've seen pulled around the office. A Jeremy Scott and a Lee Bradley. Neither are "gems" but both are nice.

And that's the point-- we tried not to put too many rushed stinkers into the set. There will never be ZERO because we can't control what artists do and can only afford to scrap so many... but between "trimming the fat" so to speak and finding a new crop of talent this time around, the average quality is going to be much higher on this set.

You guys aren't going to get a true sense for at least a week. Plus people tend to always expect at least one Charles Hall/Gary Kezele/Ted Dastick-level sketch in their case, and the odds are ALWAYS stacked against them on those types!
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Old 10-25-2013, 10:05 AM   #894 (permalink)
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Can you guys explain to me then how these dealers make money? As a collector, I really do sometimes wonder when I see base sets and other inserts listed at what appear very low prices immediately post release.
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Old 10-25-2013, 10:06 AM   #895 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by alvin View Post
I'd much rather have the ink than the pencil. His pencils were too light on MAH for my tastes.

Keep in mind, I like to frame/display my sketches. So I want something that's going to stand out.

Plus I find the compositions he did this time were far more impressive. His soldiers coming out of the fire really knocked me over.
I agree. I think my LOL and rolly eye guy may have been misunderstood.

It wasn't about Roberts work at all. I love what he does.
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Old 10-25-2013, 10:08 AM   #896 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by alvin View Post
I can show you the two i've seen pulled around the office. A Jeremy Scott and a Lee Bradley. Neither are "gems" but both are nice.

And that's the point-- we tried not to put too many rushed stinkers into the set. There will never be ZERO because we can't control what artists do and can only afford to scrap so many... but between "trimming the fat" so to speak and finding a new crop of talent this time around, the average quality is going to be much higher on this set.

You guys aren't going to get a true sense for at least a week. Plus people tend to always expect at least one Charles Hall/Gary Kezele/Ted Dastick-level sketch in their case, and the odds are ALWAYS stacked against them on those types!
Well based on two cases I don't agree. I don't expect CH/GK per case. I happen to think Teranishi is a good artist and would consider him a decent pull. I have been doing this a long time and don't resort to hyperbole. My two cases had lame sketches, period. It happens. As I said, it is NOT a true representation of sketches across this whole release.

I opened 8 cases of SW GF2 (initial preorder). I had the worst 8 cases' worth of sketches in my life. I trashed the product. I was lucky to average $10 per sketch across all 8 cases. But I kept reading of other decent breaks. So I ordered more. And boom I got two really nice cases. I have since ordered another 10 cases, and only one was a stinker and the rest had really nice art! So there is no reason for anyone to read too much into a simple two-case break here.
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Old 10-25-2013, 10:10 AM   #897 (permalink)
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You shouldn't really use ebay as a guide: more often than not the best sketches will be kept in personal collections and the mid-quality or lower will end up being sold off.

Best to keep an eye on fan box breaks to get a sense of quality.
That's true.

I'd estimate that about a third to half of what I consider to be my best sketch cards for "Mars Attacks Heritage," "Star Wars Galactic Files," and "Star Wars Galactic Files 2" never showed up on eBay. Yet the ones I wasn't happy with, but had to turn in anyway, seem to always show up for sale.
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Old 10-25-2013, 10:24 AM   #898 (permalink)
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Can you guys explain to me then how these dealers make money? As a collector, I really do sometimes wonder when I see base sets and other inserts listed at what appear very low prices immediately post release.
Case breakers enter and leave in waves. Most of the good established ones won't sell that low. What you are seeing is people who are buying product on credit card and need to sell fast to pay the bill as it comes. Believe me, they are not making money at some of the low prices you are seeing. What they are doing is losing 30-40% on their breaks but don't feel it as much because of the attrition balance that is rising on their credit card.

The problem is, when they finally max out all their credit cards and drop out of the case breaking, a whole new wave of credit card case breakers enters in the market and sells low right off the bat. It's just a viscous cycle.

Edit to add: I was never a big case breaker myself 3-5 cases on average. But I NEVER put anything on a credit card. If I couldn't pay for it with funds I had available then I wouldn't mess with it.

The reason you see prices so strong on releases like Fleer Retro Marvel is not a lot of the case breakers bought it, and it was rather limited as well which kept the prices high. I can bet you anything if some of the low sellers we see on Mars Attacks and GPK bought Marvel Retro it would not have the high marks for insert singles that it does.
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Last edited by Carrbeaz; 10-25-2013 at 10:27 AM.
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Old 10-25-2013, 10:25 AM   #899 (permalink)
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Didn't see any big names - the crapy-ness of the "new" Teranishi sketches stood out to me - compared to the nice pencils he did for Heritage:

I agree with Alvin. This is all subjective of course, but I like the bold graphic look of this as well as the composition.
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Old 10-25-2013, 10:26 AM   #900 (permalink)
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Well based on two cases I don't agree. I don't expect CH/GK per case. I happen to think Teranishi is a good artist and would consider him a decent pull. I have been doing this a long time and don't resort to hyperbole. My two cases had lame sketches, period. It happens. As I said, it is NOT a true representation of sketches across this whole release.

I opened 8 cases of SW GF2 (initial preorder). I had the worst 8 cases' worth of sketches in my life. I trashed the product. I was lucky to average $10 per sketch across all 8 cases. But I kept reading of other decent breaks. So I ordered more. And boom I got two really nice cases. I have since ordered another 10 cases, and only one was a stinker and the rest had really nice art! So there is no reason for anyone to read too much into a simple two-case break here.
I think that's pretty fair. Appreciate your viewpoint.
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