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Old 09-28-2012, 10:25 PM   #551 (permalink)
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anyone got any ideas to start with?
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Old 09-28-2012, 10:34 PM   #552 (permalink)
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Seneca Wallace as a signer? He's practically retired...right? Lol.

Seriously though, my initial vote is towards the defense/special teams/offensive line types that rarely ever got cards outside of mid 90's college uni autos or early 00's pro bowl jersey cards.
And we SP all the hot rookies! Wait, we would be called Topps if we did that.

I agree with this idea, give the nontraditional guys some hobby love. I say we also incorporate some coaches into our product.
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Old 09-28-2012, 10:37 PM   #553 (permalink)
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i was thinking we do a SignaCuts HOF edition name: Canton Cuts

every box has 1 card 1 HOF cut auto /25 or less

checklist: Alphabetically with duals triples and quads

chase hit: walter camp (founder)/ vince lombardi (best coach)/ emit smith (best player)

price: $50 /box
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Old 09-28-2012, 10:38 PM   #554 (permalink)
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and it's good to be back motha truckas!
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Old 09-28-2012, 11:53 PM   #555 (permalink)
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#@#@#@#@ man, he gives us a crazy challenge when I'm in the lead.

ok RKC, let's hear your favorite retirees you would like to see in the product as well as a name.

as for the checklist, we could try just HOFers (going with autos for the living legends and maybe some SP'd cut autos for the dead ones?)

or do you think we should whittle down the checklist even more? to something offensive player focused? defensive player?


as for product names, Gridiron Legends is all I can think of right now.


DBO- are we assuming UD doesn't have license to show the pros in their pro Unis?
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Old 09-29-2012, 01:20 AM   #556 (permalink)
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I would think it would be interesting to somehow include cuts/memorabilia/on card autos of forgotten stars of the past. Everyone remembers Montana, Rice, Starr, etc., but there are tons of guys who were the best of the best during their eras and often get lost in the history. Perhaps there could also be something focusing on some of the game's greatest plays and failures.
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Old 09-29-2012, 12:31 PM   #557 (permalink)
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or do you think we should whittle down the checklist even more? to something offensive player focused? defensive player?
I say more defense/special teams like I was saying above. Maybe even all? Has there ever been a primarily defense set before? Insert sets sure, but there are complete sets of football where the list is like 98% offense...could be neat to go the other way.

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emmit smith (best player)
Jerry Rice, Jim Brown, and Joe Montana (among others) would disagree
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Old 09-29-2012, 01:32 PM   #558 (permalink)
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Jerry Rice, Jim Brown, and Joe Montana (among others) would disagree
lol i knew i would hear about that

it doesn't have to be smith but a cut along those lines would be cool
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Old 09-29-2012, 01:46 PM   #559 (permalink)
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lol i knew i would hear about that

it doesn't have to be smith but a cut along those lines would be cool
Haha I agree.

I'm also a fan of multiple autos of guys from the same team, especially of guys from the past since you can make sure all the autos on the card are worth something (versus a modern day dual where you can pair a future HOF with a scrub who is out of the league in a year).

I'm thinking Super Bowl autos, maybe 2-4 guys per card, still thinking defense. You could do a team like the 1996 Super Bowl Packers - some combo of Reggie White (RIP), LeRoy Butler, Eugene Robinson, and Gilbert Brown.

Or the 1997 Broncos. John Mobley, Steve Atwater, Bill Romanoski, Neil Smith, Ray Crockett...all options.

Certainly the 2000 Ravens. Ray Lewis, Rod Woodson, Rob Burnett, Peter Boulware, Michael McCrary, Chris McCallister.

And I know I'd personally be interested in a 2001 Patriots. Lawyer Milloy, Tw Law, Tedi Bruschi, Willie McGinest. Maybe even Mike Vrabel, Brian Cox, or Ted Johnson mixed in there.

I just think there are lots of sweet cards out there of offensive forces, like Elway-Davis, or Aikman-Smith, that kind of thing. Here we have a tribute to Super Bowl defenses - we could do non Super Bowl teams as well but I think it being the Super Bowl winner makes it that much more collectible. Like imagine the 1995 Cowboys too, but instead of Aikman and Smith it's an auto of Darren Woodson, Brock Marion, Charles Haley and Deion Sanders. That'd be such a sweet card for Cowboys collectors.

Plus we're talking financially viable for Upper Deck. I would guess guys like Brock Marion and Neil Smith would be cheaper signers than your Aikmans and Elways.
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Old 09-29-2012, 02:01 PM   #560 (permalink)
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Also re: everything I wrote above, I just typed "defense" into comc to see what insert sets have ever existed with that name in them. I count just 3 - 1993 Power All Pro Defense, 2006 Ultra Kings of Defense (parallel sets with an without jerseys), and 2007 SP Chirography Signs of Defense (an auto set with a few parallels). All of those were with current players, and Chirography had a lot of younger up and coming defense types so there are plenty of duds in there who didn't pan out.

So I think there's a market for an all D set, or at least some solid d inserts in our set. Maybe we could call it like Defensive Dynasties or Dynamos or Dynamite Defenses...something with alliteration lol.
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Old 09-29-2012, 03:49 PM   #561 (permalink)
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Also re: everything I wrote above, I just typed "defense" into comc to see what insert sets have ever existed with that name in them. I count just 3 - 1993 Power All Pro Defense, 2006 Ultra Kings of Defense (parallel sets with an without jerseys), and 2007 SP Chirography Signs of Defense (an auto set with a few parallels). All of those were with current players, and Chirography had a lot of younger up and coming defense types so there are plenty of duds in there who didn't pan out.

So I think there's a market for an all D set, or at least some solid d inserts in our set. Maybe we could call it like Defensive Dynasties or Dynamos or Dynamite Defenses...something with alliteration lol.
How about the Dynamic Defensive Dynasty Set?
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Old 09-29-2012, 06:48 PM   #562 (permalink)
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Also re: everything I wrote above, I just typed "defense" into comc to see what insert sets have ever existed with that name in them. I count just 3 - 1993 Power All Pro Defense, 2006 Ultra Kings of Defense (parallel sets with an without jerseys), and 2007 SP Chirography Signs of Defense (an auto set with a few parallels). All of those were with current players, and Chirography had a lot of younger up and coming defense types so there are plenty of duds in there who didn't pan out.

So I think there's a market for an all D set, or at least some solid d inserts in our set. Maybe we could call it like Defensive Dynasties or Dynamos or Dynamite Defenses...something with alliteration lol.
this is an excellent vein you've tapped.

RKC, we're going with a defensive only set. I like the Quad autos from superbowl winning teams. Let's make that a part of the set, but definitely look along other areas as well.

come up with your favorite 4 players for the defense that won the superbowls, and let's see if we can't come up with something else as another set of chase cards for it (or 2).

Ultimately, i think it would be great to have:
1. Superbowl defensive quad auto set (thoughts on numbering? we have to keep it manageable especially for any dead members of the D)

2. Base set (base cards of defensive greats from all eras), maybe some refractors or parallels to keep chasing the sets.

and maybe 1 or 2 other chase sets. thoughts on these? Perhaps a jersey/materials set for other greats that weren't on the SB teams, and maybe a base auto set (with lower number parallels).

i think Dynamic Defensive Dynasty set might be a little too much "D". Defensive Dynasties ok with the RKC crew?
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:08 PM   #563 (permalink)
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this is an excellent vein you've tapped.

RKC, we're going with a defensive only set. I like the Quad autos from superbowl winning teams. Let's make that a part of the set, but definitely look along other areas as well.

come up with your favorite 4 players for the defense that won the superbowls, and let's see if we can't come up with something else as another set of chase cards for it (or 2).

Ultimately, i think it would be great to have:
1. Superbowl defensive quad auto set (thoughts on numbering? we have to keep it manageable especially for any dead members of the D)

2. Base set (base cards of defensive greats from all eras), maybe some refractors or parallels to keep chasing the sets.

and maybe 1 or 2 other chase sets. thoughts on these? Perhaps a jersey/materials set for other greats that weren't on the SB teams, and maybe a base auto set (with lower number parallels).

i think Dynamic Defensive Dynasty set might be a little too much "D". Defensive Dynasties ok with the RKC crew?
I would love to try and figure out a way to come up with a Sean Taylor auto in there. I know he is dead and unable to sign, but surely we can come up with something. Make it a 1/1.
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:11 PM   #564 (permalink)
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this is an excellent vein you've tapped.

RKC, we're going with a defensive only set. I like the Quad autos from superbowl winning teams. Let's make that a part of the set, but definitely look along other areas as well.

come up with your favorite 4 players for the defense that won the superbowls, and let's see if we can't come up with something else as another set of chase cards for it (or 2).

Ultimately, i think it would be great to have:
1. Superbowl defensive quad auto set (thoughts on numbering? we have to keep it manageable especially for any dead members of the D)

2. Base set (base cards of defensive greats from all eras), maybe some refractors or parallels to keep chasing the sets.

and maybe 1 or 2 other chase sets. thoughts on these? Perhaps a jersey/materials set for other greats that weren't on the SB teams, and maybe a base auto set (with lower number parallels).

i think Dynamic Defensive Dynasty set might be a little too much "D". Defensive Dynasties ok with the RKC crew?
Sweet, glad you're feeling it. I love your expansion to the idea of the set - base set with parallels/refractors, quad auto set, base auto set, jersey/material set. I think that'd be real solid right there, and I agree it might be especially nice to make the jersey/autos of guys that weren't on those Super Bowl teams.

As for the numbering of the quad autos, I was envisioning like /100 and lower. I've seen a lot of sets where there is a set max number of cards, but many cards end up short printed because they can't get enough autos or materials and so those are numbered to less. So something like a 2006 defense could be /100 since those guys are easier gets, but older teams (or like the 96 Packers with Reggie White) could be more like /25 or even as low as /10 depending on how many cuts are available for the product.

And as for quads, I definitely nominate Lawyer Milloy, Ty Law, Tedy Bruschi, and Willie McGinest for the Patriots 2001 quad. Tempting to swap Willie out for Roman Phifer or Mike Vrabel since they meant a little more that year, but Willie was a long time Pat before them and he gets the nod for me. I'd buy every version of that card if I could!

As for the 86 Bears, Singletary gets a decent amount of love, so I'm thinking the D Line - Dan Hampton, the Fridge, Richard Dent and Steve McMichael.
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:18 PM   #565 (permalink)
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I would love to try and figure out a way to come up with a Sean Taylor auto in there. I know he is dead and unable to sign, but surely we can come up with something. Make it a 1/1.
Taylor is a fantastic choice!

I'd also nominate Chris Doleman (11 autos to date), Michael Sinclair (2 autos to date), Cortez Kennedy (just elected to the hall, only 2 lifetime autos ever), John Randle (suprisingly only 13 autos ever), Lee Roy Selmon (11), Bruce Smith (29), Sam Huff (20), Ray Nitschke (6), Mel Blount (16), Dick LeBeau (5), and Night Train Lane (2). Obviously a few of those guys have passed but most have very few autos considering how good they were!
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:50 PM   #566 (permalink)
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Taylor is a fantastic choice!

I'd also nominate Chris Doleman (11 autos to date), Michael Sinclair (2 autos to date), Cortez Kennedy (just elected to the hall, only 2 lifetime autos ever), John Randle (suprisingly only 13 autos ever), Lee Roy Selmon (11), Bruce Smith (29), Sam Huff (20), Ray Nitschke (6), Mel Blount (16), Dick LeBeau (5), and Night Train Lane (2). Obviously a few of those guys have passed but most have very few autos considering how good they were!
Or make it a triple letterman booklet with the letters R.I.P. I think that would make a neat card. And have a little bio on him as well. Number it /5.
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Old 09-29-2012, 11:41 PM   #567 (permalink)
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ok let's do this.

Gator, come up with a few unique 1/1s (maybe 10-20 if possible) and have fun with it. Obviously if the player is deceased, you'll have to account for a cut signature in the card. 1/1 booklets would be neat.

SPastik, you let me know how you want to divvy up the SB defensive squads from recent era (i'm thinking 80 and beyond) and we'll come up with the quad auto checklist. Once we divide and conquer and knock out this part, you and I will get together and see about some of the older squads to see which players we can get 4 autos of.

Shane (Newton) and Tajirosa, come up with the defensive player checklist for the autos (obviously dead players will have a shorter run since they are not able to sign new items). This set I'm imagining the living players should have a higher print/auto run but have a few lower numbered parallels (i.e. /99 base, /50, /25, /10 1/1 plates)

Sunsfan, you're the wildcard here. take a look at everybody else's assignments and see what you can fit in to complement the product.

ready? BREAK

DBO- due date?
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Old 09-29-2012, 11:49 PM   #568 (permalink)
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ok let's do this.

Gator, come up with a few unique 1/1s (maybe 10-20 if possible) and have fun with it. Obviously if the player is deceased, you'll have to account for a cut signature in the card. 1/1 booklets would be neat.

SPastik, you let me know how you want to divvy up the SB defensive squads from recent era (i'm thinking 80 and beyond) and we'll come up with the quad auto checklist. Once we divide and conquer and knock out this part, you and I will get together and see about some of the older squads to see which players we can get 4 autos of.

Shane (Newton) and Tajirosa, come up with the defensive player checklist for the autos (obviously dead players will have a shorter run since they are not able to sign new items). This set I'm imagining the living players should have a higher print/auto run but have a few lower numbered parallels (i.e. /99 base, /50, /25, /10 1/1 plates)

Sunsfan, you're the wildcard here. take a look at everybody else's assignments and see what you can fit in to complement the product.

ready? BREAK

DBO- due date?
So am I running a post or a corner? I thought I was supposed to block on this play? I'm down. Ill PM you details of my ideas tomorrow sometime.
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Old 09-29-2012, 11:53 PM   #569 (permalink)
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ok let's do this.

Gator, come up with a few unique 1/1s (maybe 10-20 if possible) and have fun with it. Obviously if the player is deceased, you'll have to account for a cut signature in the card. 1/1 booklets would be neat.

SPastik, you let me know how you want to divvy up the SB defensive squads from recent era (i'm thinking 80 and beyond) and we'll come up with the quad auto checklist. Once we divide and conquer and knock out this part, you and I will get together and see about some of the older squads to see which players we can get 4 autos of.

Shane (Newton) and Tajirosa, come up with the defensive player checklist for the autos (obviously dead players will have a shorter run since they are not able to sign new items). This set I'm imagining the living players should have a higher print/auto run but have a few lower numbered parallels (i.e. /99 base, /50, /25, /10 1/1 plates)

Sunsfan, you're the wildcard here. take a look at everybody else's assignments and see what you can fit in to complement the product.

ready? BREAK

DBO- due date?
Fantastic, I love it! When we finish this assignment can we send it to the real UD (and the real Topps and the real Panini) and tell them to make these cards for us!

Anyway, working on my part! I'll pm when I've got a good list
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Old 09-30-2012, 01:02 AM   #570 (permalink)
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speaking of Spastik working on his part, he did his part AND my part, but then came up with another awesome idea that i'll work on to make up for him doing everything

i'll let him post it so he can get the credit
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Old 09-30-2012, 01:24 AM   #571 (permalink)
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speaking of Spastik working on his part, he did his part AND my part, but then came up with another awesome idea that i'll work on to make up for him doing everything

i'll let him post it so he can get the credit


Here's what I sent Clarka:

Was thinking while I did the Bears – if we do an RIP Sean Taylor maybe we do an RIP Dave Duerson (Bears) as well? Too soon? Anyways, here’s the teams I came up with. For older teams I used pro bowl/all pro guys first and then filled in behind that based on career/that year’s stats. I found 20 I really liked (and 20 is a nice round number for a set) - those teams have a "!" before their listing.

! 79-80 Steelers - Donnie Shell/Jack Ham/Jack Lambert and either Mike Wagner or Mel Blount
! 81 49ers - Ronnie Lott/Dwight Hicks/Carlton Williamson/Keena Turner
82 Redskins –Dexter Manley/Tony Peters/Jeris White/Dave Butz
! 83 Raiders – Howie Long/Rod Martin/Vann McElroy/Lester Hayes
84 49ers – Ronnie Lott/Keena Turner/Dwight Hicks/Carlton Williamson
! 85 Bears – Richard Dent/Dan Hampton/Mike Singletary/Otis Wilson
! 86 Giants – Leonard Marshall/Lawrence Taylor/Jim Burt/Harry Carson
87 Redskins – Charles Mann/Darrell Green/Barry Wilburn/Dexter Manley (or Monte Coleman to make this all different from the 92 team)
! 88 49ers – Charles Haley/Michael Carter/Tim McKyer/Ronnie Lott (or someone else to make this a different four from the 84 team)
89 49ers – Charles Haley/Tim KcKyer/Ronnie Lott/Pierce Holy
90 Giants – Pepper Johnson/Lawrence Taylor/Reyna Thompson/Erik Howard
! 91 Redskins – Darrell Green/Charles Mann/Wilber Marshall/Fred Stokes
! 92 Cowboys – Ken Norton/Jim Jeffcoat/Kevin R. Smith/Leon Lett
93 Cowboys - Ken Norton/Thomas Everett/Russell Maryland/Kevin R. Smith or Bill Bates
! 94 49ers - Merton Hanks/Tim McDonald/Dana Stubblefield/Deion Sanders
95 Cowboys – Darren Woodson/Charles Haley/Brock Marion/Larry Brown
! 96 Packers – LeRoy Butler/Reggie White/Eugene Robinson/Santana Dotson (or Gilbert Brown)
97 Broncos – John Mobley/Maa Tanavusa/Neil Smith/Darrien Gordon
! 98 Broncos – Bill Romanoski/Steve Atwater/Trevor Pryce/Ray Crockett
! 99 Rams – Todd Lyght/Kevin Carter/Mike Jones (has to be here since he made the Super Bowl saving tackle)/D’Marco Farr
! 00 Ravens – Ray Lewis/Rod Woodson/Sam Adams/Duane Starks or Rob Burnett or Peter Boulware
! 01 Patriots – Lawyer Milloy/Ty Law/Willie McGinest/Mike Vrabel or Tedy Bruschi
! 02 Buccaneers – Derrick Brooks/Simeon Rice/Warren Sapp/John Lynch (Shelton Quarles, Ronde Barber, and Dexter Jackson are all also choices. Personally I’d put Barber over Rice).
03 Patriots – Rodney Harrison/Ty Law/Willie McGinest/Richard Seymour
04 Patriots - Tedy Bruschi/Richard Seymour/Willie McGinest/Mike Vrabel (Troy Brown would be a nice 4 here since this is the year he played some DB and had 3 interceptions. Larry Izzo made the Pro Bowl but as a special teamer so I don’t know if he’s worth it).
05 Steelers – Troy Polamalu/Joey Porter/Casey Hampton/James Harrison
! 06 Colts - Robert Mathis/Dwight Freeney/Cato June/Nick Harper (real tempted to put Bob Sanders in this 4 since he was a huge part of their defense for so long, but he played only 4 regular season games due to injury. He did play the playoffs though.)
! 07 Giants – Justin Tuck/Osi Umeniyora/Michael Strahan/Antonio Pierce or Mathias Kiwanuka
! 08 Steelers - James Farrior/James Harrison/Troy Polamalu/Lamarr Woodley
! 09 Saints – Jonathan Vilma/Roman Harper/Darren Sharper/Tracy Porter (a must since he had the dagger INT return for a TD in the Super Bowl)
! 10 Packers – Charles Woodson/Clay Matthews Jr./Tramon Williams/Nick Collins
11 Giants – Jason Pierre-Paul/Corey Webster/Osi Umeniyora/Aaron Ross or Antrel Rolle

Also, an idea for an insert set - great plays in super bowl history? I know 2000 Finest has a Mike Jones autograph of "the tackle" when he tackled Kevin Dyson. Maybe we recreate some of these - like Ahman Bradshaw's tuck and roll, or Desmond Howard's kickoff return TD to seal it, Steve Tasker's strip of Leon Lett, or Tracy Porter's INT return of Peyton. Pick like 10-20 plays and maybe those could be autos too, or just plain inserts, or both (one base insert, one parallel set).
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Old 09-30-2012, 10:20 AM   #572 (permalink)
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ok let's do this.

Gator, come up with a few unique 1/1s (maybe 10-20 if possible) and have fun with it. Obviously if the player is deceased, you'll have to account for a cut signature in the card. 1/1 booklets would be neat.

SPastik, you let me know how you want to divvy up the SB defensive squads from recent era (i'm thinking 80 and beyond) and we'll come up with the quad auto checklist. Once we divide and conquer and knock out this part, you and I will get together and see about some of the older squads to see which players we can get 4 autos of.

Shane (Newton) and Tajirosa, come up with the defensive player checklist for the autos (obviously dead players will have a shorter run since they are not able to sign new items). This set I'm imagining the living players should have a higher print/auto run but have a few lower numbered parallels (i.e. /99 base, /50, /25, /10 1/1 plates)

Sunsfan, you're the wildcard here. take a look at everybody else's assignments and see what you can fit in to complement the product.

ready? BREAK

DBO- due date?
i'll add something 1-3 with this

1. vince lombardi/reggie white dual cut book 1/1 (kinda like triple threads)

2. 2010 clay matthews/charles woodson/troy polamalu/james harrison

3. black /99, blue /50, gold /25, red /10 (all signed in that color)
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Old 09-30-2012, 11:06 AM   #573 (permalink)
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i'll add something 1-3 with this

1. vince lombardi/reggie white dual cut book 1/1 (kinda like triple threads)

2. 2010 clay matthews/charles woodson/troy polamalu/james harrison

3. black /99, blue /50, gold /25, red /10 (all signed in that color)
I absolutely love idea #3.
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Old 09-30-2012, 01:49 PM   #574 (permalink)
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ok let's do this.


Shane (Newton) and Tajirosa, come up with the defensive player checklist for the autos (obviously dead players will have a shorter run since they are not able to sign new items). This set I'm imagining the living players should have a higher print/auto run but have a few lower numbered parallels (i.e. /99 base, /50, /25, /10 1/1 plates)
Alrighty then. Defensive player set coming right up.

Heroes of the Hall (Print run of 25 each, first 5 of the print run have patches)

Steve Atwater
Len Dawson
Jack Ham
Ronnie Lot (Im thinking instead of a patch maybe we could have a ginter DNA style relic where we insert a piece of his finger in the patch window)
Dick Butkus
Paul Kraus
Dick LeBeau
Deacon Jones
Randy White
Andre Tippett

I think this set gives a good variety of positions and includes a lot of hard hitters and big name players on big market teams.

SSP sub set

Legends Never Die (all deceased players /3)
Reggie White
Junior Seau

Someone come up with 3 more dead legends please


SSSSSP sub set

Seventeen (each card is /1, it will include every charter member of the HOF)

Base
Im thinking for base we could either do a reprint of everyones topps rookie but chrome it out. But I would like to go oldschool with it and only make standard chrome cards with a very rare refractor variation.
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Old 09-30-2012, 01:57 PM   #575 (permalink)
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Alrighty then. Defensive player set coming right up.

Heroes of the Hall (Print run of 25 each, first 5 of the print run have patches)

Steve Atwater
Len Dawson
Jack Ham
Ronnie Lot (Im thinking instead of a patch maybe we could have a ginter DNA style relic where we insert a piece of his finger in the patch window)
Dick Butkus
Paul Kraus
Dick LeBeau
Deacon Jones
Randy White
Andre Tippett

I think this set gives a good variety of positions and includes a lot of hard hitters and big name players on big market teams.

SSP sub set

Legends Never Die (all deceased players /3)
Reggie White
Junior Seau

Someone come up with 3 more dead legends please


SSSSSP sub set

Seventeen (each card is /1, it will include every charter member of the HOF)

Base
Im thinking for base we could either do a reprint of everyones topps rookie but chrome it out. But I would like to go oldschool with it and only make standard chrome cards with a very rare refractor variation.
Dave Duerson and Sean Taylor are two deceased legends that would work well.
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