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Old 08-25-2013, 09:29 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default this is why PSA is a joke!!!!!

Another example of why PSA is a shadow of BGS when it comes to grading modern cards.

2012 Topps WWE Heritage Autographs Kamala Auto Card PSA 10 GEM Mint | eBay

GEM MINT my ass!!!! look at the bottom left corner of this card.....................what a joke!!!

seriously gem mint??? thats ridiculous. I have BGS 8.5s that #@#@#@#@ all over those.

No wonder everyone is lining up for PSA, you get whatever grade you please.

BGS>PSA everyday of the week in modern cards.

rant over.
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Old 08-25-2013, 11:34 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Man that is a sweet card. Heritage cards are all beat to hell it seems in that series. Nice Kamala considering the card stock used in the product.

BGS has done the exact same thing. Seen many a gem mint BGS 9.5 with a bad corner.
Grading is not a perfect service, we all know that and neither PSA or BGS is perfect and has many cards over graded in holders.
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Old 08-25-2013, 01:49 PM   #3 (permalink)
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If the centering, Surface and edges are all 10's and the corners are 9 or 8.5 (one touched corner) the average would still be a 9.5 plus grade. You have to factor everything in, not just 1 flaw. If that were the case nothing would be GEM.
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Old 08-25-2013, 03:37 PM   #4 (permalink)
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While I agree this is how PSA and BGS do it (looking at the whole card and doing a little rounding up or down with each company with its own biases) as well as the statement that "otherwise nothing would be gem" isn't that why we are paying 10 times or more in some cases the value of the card raw when its supposedly in a 10 or 9.5 grade? To get that almost impossible to find "gem mint" copy? If its not really gem than what are we paying so much for? As I've said many times, I feel grading is largely a scam (a needed scam in some cases mind you) that was allowed to foster and grow once the Internet came along and you could no longer see the card in person or trust the person you were buying from. I think its biggest benefit is it TENDS to help us avoid unscrupulous people who tried to pass along trimmed cards or fakes of valuable and/or rare cards and/or didn't know how to grade. It also helps give us a rough idea that the card is at least in NM/M shape when it's a higher graded 99 percent of the time. With that said, it's still the same card just in a slightly fancier holder so it still boggles my mind sometimes the price differential between raw and graded 10 cards. Nonetheless I am not one to look a trend in the face and pretend it doesn't exist, so I play along but I do wish when I bought 10's I could be confident the card was worthy of the price point because of its condition. Unfortunately it remains a crapshoot as there seems to be little consistency between graders with what's a 10, what's a 9 and in some cases what's even an 8.

Last edited by bullingham; 08-25-2013 at 03:42 PM.
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Old 08-25-2013, 09:11 PM   #5 (permalink)
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There is no way in hell, BGS would give that card a 9.5 gem mint. stop pulling yourselves cmon. that corner is bad, I could not see BGS giving a sub grade of more than 8 for corners, meaning the best it would be is an 8.5.
I have many wcw autos graded, and some i cannot believe i only got a 9, if they were in PSA holders they would all be 10s.
If bgs has a sub grade of 8 for example, the best the card can get overall is .5 more....8.5.
You guys can talk up PSA all you want, I know who is the better grader. All my graded MJ cards (I have PSA and BGS), no one wants to touch the ones in PSA holders.
and that Kamala auto is the reason why
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Old 08-26-2013, 05:33 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Def agree that should NOT be a 10...8.5 tops. Check out my 1956 Willie Mays that I believe should have been graded higher than a 4...
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Old 08-26-2013, 05:57 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bootan View Post
There is no way in hell, BGS would give that card a 9.5 gem mint. stop pulling yourselves cmon. that corner is bad, I could not see BGS giving a sub grade of more than 8 for corners, meaning the best it would be is an 8.5.
I have many wcw autos graded, and some i cannot believe i only got a 9, if they were in PSA holders they would all be 10s.
If bgs has a sub grade of 8 for example, the best the card can get overall is .5 more....8.5.
You guys can talk up PSA all you want, I know who is the better grader. All my graded MJ cards (I have PSA and BGS), no one wants to touch the ones in PSA holders.
and that Kamala auto is the reason why
This quote part is so full of wrong idea's, it's not even funny. Many Many threads here have many cards with a Total grade from BGS a full point higher then it's lowest subgrade. BGS is a joke to me, how can you trust a company that runs not only BGS but also BCCG, which is a known joke.

Obiviously you've never had a card graded by PSA or you'd quickly realize that 10's aren't easy to get.

Cards sometimes get damaged in shipping, or whatnot while in their case. If you drop a graded card, it bangs around in the case. The card could have been perfect while being graded but damaged by the owner.
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Old 08-26-2013, 08:34 AM   #8 (permalink)
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This quote part is so full of wrong idea's, it's not even funny. Many Many threads here have many cards with a Total grade from BGS a full point higher then it's lowest subgrade. BGS is a joke to me, how can you trust a company that runs not only BGS but also BCCG, which is a known joke.

Obiviously you've never had a card graded by PSA or you'd quickly realize that 10's aren't easy to get.

Cards sometimes get damaged in shipping, or whatnot while in their case. If you drop a PSA graded card, it bangs around in the case. The card could have been perfect while being graded but damaged by the owner.
Fixed that for you, another PSA is a joke, I have plenty of Barry Sanders Gem Mint 10's that have been banged up in there cases and there barely are ever moved
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Old 08-26-2013, 09:16 AM   #9 (permalink)
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That card is ridiculous. I have two Kamalas and they are both better than gem apparently. Hopefully it got damaged in shipping or by the owner or something, but seriously the owner should be ashamed to even list it as a gem. The card is banged to S*it and probably shouldn't even qualify as an 8.5, if they gave that card a gem that is the biggest joke I have ever seen.
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Old 08-26-2013, 09:32 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ryangeorgelaw View Post
That card is ridiculous. I have two Kamalas and they are both better than gem apparently. Hopefully it got damaged in shipping or by the owner or something, but seriously the owner should be ashamed to even list it as a gem. The card is banged to S*it and probably shouldn't even qualify as an 8.5, if they gave that card a gem that is the biggest joke I have ever seen.
Have you seen the Strasburg BGS 9.5 superfractor.

Card looks like it was cut on one side with chainsaw and is o/c. Still got a 9.5
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Old 08-26-2013, 09:39 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Reasons such as these are why I stay away from the whole graded market. If I have a mint card I don't need someone else telling me it is, I can see for myself. I understand why there is a graded card market, but it isn't for me.
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Old 08-26-2013, 10:20 AM   #12 (permalink)
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You're going to find many inconsistencies regardless of grading company due to the fact that's it done by the human eye. Grading is extremely subjective and the main reason I'm more likely to sell off a Gem and keep a mint (way against the norm). I think the real problem with PSA is that they have made no effort through out the years to protect the longevity of the cards encased with at the very least a sleeve to protect the edges from damage. As for what Beckett needs to improve, they really need to provide hairnets to the balding graders.. I don't know how many times I've had to send back grader issued curlycue dna..
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Old 08-28-2013, 12:04 PM   #13 (permalink)
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. As for what Beckett needs to improve, they really need to provide hairnets to the balding graders.. I don't know how many times I've had to send back grader issued curlycue dna..
FYI - Don't touch the hairs it may not be from their heads... especially if it's curly...
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Old 08-28-2013, 03:04 PM   #14 (permalink)
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FYI - Don't touch the hairs it may not be from their heads... especially if it's curly...
Lmao, no worries there as they're encased curlycues!! I love BGS but that not only skeeves me out when I notice them but downright pisses me off.
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Old 08-28-2013, 05:03 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by bootan View Post
Another example of why PSA is a shadow of BGS when it comes to grading modern cards.

2012 Topps WWE Heritage Autographs Kamala Auto Card PSA 10 GEM Mint | eBay

GEM MINT my ass!!!! look at the bottom left corner of this card.....................what a joke!!!

seriously gem mint??? thats ridiculous. I have BGS 8.5s that #@#@#@#@ all over those.

No wonder everyone is lining up for PSA, you get whatever grade you please.

BGS>PSA everyday of the week in modern cards.

rant over.
I'm seeing something left on the scanner in that corner as well as fuzz to the right of the sticker that was on the scan
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