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Old 10-15-2013, 01:01 PM   #51 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Pat3ntP3nd1ng View Post
Didn't Panini grade the T-206 Honus Wagner card that was admittedly altered/trimmed which made it sell for probably $1.5 Million more than it should have been worth. Ummm??? Only one you would trust?

That Absurdly Expensive Honus Wagner Baseball Card Was Actually Altered in the 80's | Extra Mustard - SI.com
PSA graded the T-206 Honus Wagner. It was the very first card PSA ever graded.

It has alway been suspected of being trimmed. The book "The Card" discusses it in detail.

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Old 10-15-2013, 01:14 PM   #52 (permalink)
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The card last sold for over 2.8 million.

Industry experts believe it has actually gained value since the Mastro addmision.

The owner could have put the card back to PSA and chose not to and has no plans of selling it.

He is the owner of the Arizona Diamondbacks and has a tremendous high end collection.
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Old 10-15-2013, 01:22 PM   #53 (permalink)
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PSA graded the T-206 Honus Wagner. It was the very first card PSA ever graded.

It has alway been suspected of being trimmed. The book "The Card" discusses it in detail.


One hell of a way to get out of the blocks as a grading company. Very first card is altered and you grade it as unaltered.

All that being said both Beckett and PSA have their faults. Both have certified forged Autos and memorabilia cards as real, but I'm sure are trying to make positive strides in the right direction considering that the card collecting hobby is becoming increasingly infested with scammers and fakes.

Personally I like BGS better that PSA because they put sub-grades on their cards and they also have a better protective encasement method.
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Old 10-15-2013, 01:36 PM   #54 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by dpeck100 View Post
The card last sold for over 2.8 million.

Industry experts believe it has actually gained value since the Mastro addmision.

The owner could have put the card back to PSA and chose not to and has no plans of selling it.

He is the owner of the Arizona Diamondbacks and has a tremendous high end collection.

Yeah, reminds me of the DB Cooper story. The money he extorted from his hijacking is worth more now because of the history and the story behind it.

If this card had been graded a PSA 4 and not been altered thus not have such a interesting history the value would be less than half the current value.
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Old 10-15-2013, 11:55 PM   #55 (permalink)
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Look you guys are right this is just a debate.

but dpeck when you say high end collectors are going to PSA over BGS is just wrong. There is no more high-end than MJ cards, lets be realistic. My bro has a collection that makes us wrestling card collectors just look silly when you compare $$$ wise.

eberyone he deals with is BGS only, PSA the leftovers they try to unload.

I have graded almost 50 wcw cards with bgs, and like I said im pretty anal. Ive got only one 10. I am the owner of that PSA 10 Tank ABbot geoff was talking about and I too cannot believe thats called a gem mint.

for me its vintage psa, bgs everything else.
I subbed that Tank Abbott and it used to be gem mint I am sure.....
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Old 10-16-2013, 12:16 AM   #56 (permalink)
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well if thats the case, thats another reason PSA is inferior to BGS, the cards do not get protected as well whilst they are slabbed.

what a joke!!!
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Old 10-16-2013, 01:22 PM   #57 (permalink)
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I cannot understand why neither grading company uses a case that is UV protective like the magnetic cases. I know when I get something framed for my wall that is autographed or a rare print I use museum glass so that it does not fade.
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Old 10-17-2013, 06:27 AM   #58 (permalink)
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pretty sure beckett's slabs are UV protected geoff
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Old 10-28-2013, 03:50 AM   #59 (permalink)
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One hell of a way to get out of the blocks as a grading company. Very first card is altered and you grade it as unaltered.

All that being said both Beckett and PSA have their faults. Both have certified forged Autos and memorabilia cards as real, but I'm sure are trying to make positive strides in the right direction considering that the card collecting hobby is becoming increasingly infested with scammers and fakes.

Personally I like BGS better that PSA because they put sub-grades on their cards and they also have a better protective encasement method.
I have serious doubt the card is even authentic. I mean if he did all this con stuff, why not just make a fake one. Card is to good to be true.
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Old 10-28-2013, 09:48 AM   #60 (permalink)
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So how did it go in chantilly?
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Old 10-29-2013, 12:57 PM   #61 (permalink)
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So how did it go in chantilly?
Curious myself
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Old 10-29-2013, 01:54 PM   #62 (permalink)
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this thread has survived a lot longer than I thought it would. I guess that goes to show how much we get off topic.
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Old 10-29-2013, 04:17 PM   #63 (permalink)
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yeah dude. curious if the seller went to get it authenticated.
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Old 10-29-2013, 04:55 PM   #64 (permalink)
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I should just alert Chris Olds on twitter about the Bulldog not being authentic. He usually pays attention to the wrestling stuff at beckett
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Old 10-31-2013, 09:44 PM   #65 (permalink)
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you should geoff, imagine if it actually got graded, what a joke!!!
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Old 11-07-2013, 12:56 PM   #66 (permalink)
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Sooooo nothing from the op?
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Old 12-19-2013, 05:18 PM   #67 (permalink)
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BGS is so watered down now with them giving out BGS 9.5 gem mint on almost anything. Many collectors don't even want a BGS 9 anymore. Complete joke. I still think a PSA or BGS 9 is still a nice card and worth having in cased. Just seems with BGS now giving out so many BGS 9,5s collectors see some poor ones getting in they think almost anything sent in should get a bgs 9.5.
-sorry for bumping an old thread-

I just got back a whole lot of cards fom BGS. My brother and I sent over 10 PSA 10's asking for a minimum grade of 9.5. Guess what??? Just 3 came back 9.5s

Watered down my ass, PSA gives out 9's and 10's likes it christmas everyday.
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Old 12-19-2013, 07:23 PM   #68 (permalink)
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Anyone else notice that the seller of the fake British Bulldog auto is banned...
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Old 12-20-2013, 02:32 AM   #69 (permalink)
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Hi , i have enjoyed reading debates and opinions so i thought ill add mine on this topic..
i own many graded cards , both psa & bgs and as a collector when i compare the cards , there is a major difference...

for example i have the same card BGS 9 & PSA 10 , the BGS 9 is in so much better condition.

in the past i have sent PSA cards to Beckett and all the time only 30% of my PSA 10 come back as BGS 9.5 for example i send 20 x psa 10,only 6-7 come back 9.5 never one 10.

i have come to the point which i dont send them anymore because i think that a PSA 10 drives more demand than a BGS 9 , but little do we know that most times the BGS 9 is in better condition..

thats why most times a BGS 9.5 is always higher in $$$ than a PSA 10.

people talk up PSA but their grading system is much more flexible than Beckett...
i have seen bordered cards way out in centering and they recieve a PSA 10...

At the end , i guess its what makes you comfortable.

One of my cards i sent to beckett couple years ago ( i always request minimum grade of 9 BGS raw or other company graded cards) came back and it didnt meet the criteria , i sent it in to PSA and it came back a PSA 10. Since then i stay away from PSA ( buying and sending in for grading ) but ill just hang on to the PSA 10 that i have and see what happens.

that is my opinion anyway , but i have had personal experience with my collection and with my money i have spent , and that is why i feel like i do....

How about cards getting graded without protective sleeves ( what is that ??? )
from day dot , when i started collecting as a youngster i was toldto " put your cards in sleeves and top loaders " and here we are as collectors sending cards in for grading to PSA and they come back without sleeves.... just a joke !!!! that is exhibit A of amateurs
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Old 12-20-2013, 07:50 AM   #70 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by panash View Post
Hi , i have enjoyed reading debates and opinions so i thought ill add mine on this topic..
i own many graded cards , both psa & bgs and as a collector when i compare the cards , there is a major difference...

for example i have the same card BGS 9 & PSA 10 , the BGS 9 is in so much better condition.

in the past i have sent PSA cards to Beckett and all the time only 30% of my PSA 10 come back as BGS 9.5 for example i send 20 x psa 10,only 6-7 come back 9.5 never one 10.

i have come to the point which i dont send them anymore because i think that a PSA 10 drives more demand than a BGS 9 , but little do we know that most times the BGS 9 is in better condition..

thats why most times a BGS 9.5 is always higher in $$$ than a PSA 10.

people talk up PSA but their grading system is much more flexible than Beckett...
i have seen bordered cards way out in centering and they recieve a PSA 10...

At the end , i guess its what makes you comfortable.

One of my cards i sent to beckett couple years ago ( i always request minimum grade of 9 BGS raw or other company graded cards) came back and it didnt meet the criteria , i sent it in to PSA and it came back a PSA 10. Since then i stay away from PSA ( buying and sending in for grading ) but ill just hang on to the PSA 10 that i have and see what happens.

that is my opinion anyway , but i have had personal experience with my collection and with my money i have spent , and that is why i feel like i do....

How about cards getting graded without protective sleeves ( what is that ??? )
from day dot , when i started collecting as a youngster i was toldto " put your cards in sleeves and top loaders " and here we are as collectors sending cards in for grading to PSA and they come back without sleeves.... just a joke !!!! that is exhibit A of amateurs

I understand where you are coming from as far as the grading standard the 2 companies use, but other than that you have holes all over your post. First of all I would be shocked if you could find 1 person who has ever had a card damaged due to a PSA case. I have owned thousands of PSA cards and never once has a card been damaged from the case. As far as value, lets take Emmitt Smiths 1990 Score supp RC for example. A PSA 10 usually sells in the 250-300 range. A BGS 9.5? 150-175. look it up. and thats just 1 example. saying their a joke when there cards have brought in literally millions at auctions is just not logical.
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Old 12-20-2013, 08:40 AM   #71 (permalink)
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There might be a few shiny cards that sell for more in a BGS slab but there is not one key rookie card from any genre of cards that does in the Gem Mint grade.

Since this is a wrestling card thread.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/121209102230?ru=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fsch%2Fi.html%3F_sacat%3D0%26_from%3DR40%26_nkw%3D121209102230%26_rdc%3D1



Why is this still sitting on EBAY? Maybe because it would be a PSA 8 at best and most likely a PSA 9 OC or PSA 7 with the centering.

If a PSA 10 ever surfaced of this card it would sell for easily four times as much as this and I have had two large dealers tell me they have buyers for the card at $10,000.

When you have over 80% market share of all graded cards it says something.
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Old 12-20-2013, 08:41 AM   #72 (permalink)
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I understand where you are coming from as far as the grading standard the 2 companies use, but other than that you have holes all over your post. First of all I would be shocked if you could find 1 person who has ever had a card damaged due to a PSA case. I have owned thousands of PSA cards and never once has a card been damaged from the case. As far as value, lets take Emmitt Smiths 1990 Score supp RC for example. A PSA 10 usually sells in the 250-300 range. A BGS 9.5? 150-175. look it up. and thats just 1 example. saying their a joke when there cards have brought in literally millions at auctions is just not logical.
There was a Kamala Topps Heritage autograph that was on Ebay and discussed on this Forum in another post that was a PSA 10. If that card wasn't damaged in the case, there is no logical explanation. I am not really into graded cards all that much and don't really take a side on the PSA vs. BGS debate. But one thing I will say is I do wish they (PSA) put the cards in sleeves to prevented damage once encapsulated. I don't have the time before work or I would find the Kamala post quick. It was a very sad example of a 7 let alone a 10.
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Old 12-20-2013, 08:47 AM   #73 (permalink)
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There was a Kamala Topps Heritage autograph that was on Ebay and discussed on this Forum in another post that was a PSA 10. If that card wasn't damaged in the case, there is no logical explanation. I am not really into graded cards all that much and don't really take a side on the PSA vs. BGS debate. But one thing I will say is I do wish they (PSA) put the cards in sleeves to prevented damage once encapsulated. I don't have the time before work or I would find the Kamala post quick. It was a very sad example of a 7 let alone a 10.

There are quite a few sets where a plastic sleeve is placed on the inside. The Wrestling All Stars for example has one in every slab.

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Old 12-20-2013, 09:44 AM   #74 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by dpeck100 View Post
There might be a few shiny cards that sell for more in a BGS slab but there is not one key rookie card from any genre of cards that does in the Gem Mint grade.

Since this is a wrestling card thread.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/121209102230?ru=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fsch%2Fi.html%3F_sacat%3D0%26_from%3DR40%26_nkw%3D121209102230%26_rdc%3D1



Why is this still sitting on EBAY? Maybe because it would be a PSA 8 at best and most likely a PSA 9 OC or PSA 7 with the centering.

If a PSA 10 ever surfaced of this card it would sell for easily four times as much as this and I have had two large dealers tell me they have buyers for the card at $10,000.

When you have over 80% market share of all graded cards it says something.
Centering is terrible on that All Star Hogan no doubt......
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Old 12-20-2013, 10:37 AM   #75 (permalink)
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Here is something for your BGS guys to chew on.

With buyers premium this card sold for $33,842.41

Case closed.
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