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Old 06-14-2013, 12:43 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Stat Monsters View Post
It's odd that PSA would not grade this if it's based on a population of reproductions and "fakes" in the marketplace.

I thought it was that very skill set that you're paying a professional grading service for, to have an expert eye to identify what is real and what is not for authenticity beyond just looking at the edges, corners, surface and centering.

If PSA nor Beckett can't authenticate the cards, and fear having illegitimate cards pass through the scrutiny of their supposed experts, then what type of confidence does that instill in the grading market to any other card(s) that have been graded in the past as well as going forward into the future.
I think it's because on these particular cards (and a few others) the majority are fakes/reprints and they'll have a lot of unhappy customers out the cash for PSA to tell them they're fake. So instead they just don't accept any. I mean we're talking hundreds of fakes for every legit one they receive. At least. Has to be a processing and customer service nightmare.
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Old 06-14-2013, 02:04 AM   #27 (permalink)
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friggen awesome..send in all 6 wrappers and u get a free signed ball...love it
Ahhh, if only people knew. Where's that friggin' Marty McFly and his Delorian?
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Old 06-14-2013, 02:00 PM   #28 (permalink)
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PSA has stopped grading other cards for similar or same reasons. For example, I think the Modesto Mark McGwire and Entenmanns Michael Jordans are no longer graded.
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Old 06-16-2013, 12:48 PM   #29 (permalink)
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I think the wrapper lends credibility to the idea that the cards might be genuine, worth seeking out a professional grading company that will authenticate the cards, one way or another.

However, even if the pro grading company won't grade them, it doesn't mean the cards are fake. It just means the grading company won't put their reputation on the line grading the cards. If there are known fakes running around in PSA / Beckett holders, then it could undermine the credibility of those companies. So they play it safe.

If it was me, and I couldn't get a professional opinion one way or another, I'd probably wind up keeping the cards forever. I just couldn't sell them to someone for a reasonable price. If the cards are fake, then any price I charge is too much. If the cards are real, then any price I could get is too little.
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Old 06-16-2013, 01:05 PM   #30 (permalink)
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One other problem is that, even if the cards are fakes, they might not be intended to deceive. For example, let's say that some collector in the 1970's got hold of a beat-up Babe Ruth candy wrapper. Then he also got some reproduction cards to go along with it. Then he put them in a book. Then, some time later, he died.

Years later, someone goes through the book and runs across the wrapper and cards. Then he sells them at a flea market to a collector.

A while back, when I owned a collectibles store, there was a local Barbie doll collector who had died. He was a gay man. His family disowned him, but they also thought they were entitled to the stuff from his estate. Meanwhile, his gay friends thought they were entitled to it. So they were selling stuff on the sly to local collectibles stores (like mine). But they recruited a heterosexual couple to sell the stuff, claiming that the stuff was family heirlooms.

The monkey wrench here is that the dead collector had a mixture of genuine vintage Barbie items and reproductions. For example, he might have a #3 Barbie doll (worth a few hundred dollars) that was altered to look like a #1 Barbie doll (worth a few thousand dollars). He might have an outfit which originally came with a dress, shoes, purse and necklace. The dress and purse might be genuine vintage, but the shoes and necklace were modern reproductions. The original owner wasn't doing this to deceive anyone, but after he died, it was hard to tell the real stuff from the fakes.

Then there was the question of who actually owned the stuff. The whole thing was a mess, even though there was value to be had in the collection.
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Old 06-20-2013, 05:51 AM   #31 (permalink)
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I actually take a bit of comfort in the fact that they admit they are unable to authenticate something.

Edited to add:

It doesn't surprise me that they can't authenticate somethings. It actually surprises me that they are able to authenticate so many things. Given the fact that there is a limited set of data points and that their testing abilities are limited by their inability to take samples for more scientific tests.

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Old 07-15-2013, 12:18 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Hey Guys
I happen to be a vintage collector and have been for a while. Both the card and wrapper in this thread are fake. Sorry about that.
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Old 07-16-2013, 07:52 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Why/How are they fake? Details Please
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Old 07-16-2013, 08:17 AM   #34 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon View Post
Hey Guys
I happen to be a vintage collector and have been for a while. Both the card and wrapper in this thread are fake. Sorry about that.
yeah any info would be welcomed.............. could you elaborate
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Old 07-16-2013, 09:53 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon View Post
Hey Guys
I happen to be a vintage collector and have been for a while. Both the card and wrapper in this thread are fake. Sorry about that.
Works for me

/THREAD

No disrespect, but you need to back up what you are saying with facts. To just state that is worthless to the OP. I really want to hear your input.
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Old 07-16-2013, 11:24 AM   #36 (permalink)
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its no secret that these are often faked and I am taking all steps involved to make sure . If they are fake, I take pride in making sure they dont hit the market again.
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Old 07-16-2013, 11:27 AM   #37 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by chipmaster View Post
Works for me

/THREAD

No disrespect, but you need to back up what you are saying with facts. To just state that is worthless to the OP. I really want to hear your input.
No worries guys. My bad on not elaborating. I have studied these cards, most likely, more than any grading company grader. And I have compared notes with SGC and BVG. As a matter of fact the head vintage grader at BVG is a close personal friend of mine, Andy Broome. I see him regularly and we go to lunch and talk hobby stuff. We also get together for outside the hobby stuff too. At any rate that card has all of the qualities of many of the fakes I have seen. It is dark all over, especially the borders and back. If you were to hold that card in your hand the paper wouldn't feel like 80-90 yr old paper. It's not smooth to the touch and doesn't have the requisite patina and gloss a real card will. I doubt very seriously Beckett will holder it. If they do, I will come back and say I was wrong...but I will be astounded too. Here is a thread with more information than anywhere else in the hobby....by a long, long ways...BTW, some of these cards are actually not able to be authenticated 100% one way or the other. Those won't be put in slabs either....

1928 George Ruth Candy Cards (Set of 6) - Net54baseball.com Forums


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Old 07-16-2013, 11:39 AM   #38 (permalink)
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Thanks for the response, it's exactly what I would expect with what you originally wrote. Thanks for backing up your words, it means A LOT on these boards. Much respect.

I'm reading that link, and there's some EXCELLENT info there, thanks again
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Last edited by chipmaster; 07-16-2013 at 11:42 AM.
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Old 07-16-2013, 11:49 AM   #39 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chipmaster View Post
Thanks for the response, it's exactly what I would expect with what you originally wrote. Thanks for backing up your words, it means A LOT on these boards. Much respect.

I'm reading that link, and there's some EXCELLENT info there, thanks again
You are welcome. It was totally my bad for just talking smack and leaving. I should have known better especially with my experience on chat boards.
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Old 07-16-2013, 08:19 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Anyone know if PSA would slab the wrapper?

I think the wrapper alone could be valuable
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Old 07-16-2013, 09:09 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Anyone know if PSA would slab the wrapper?

I think the wrapper alone could be valuable
I don't think it's real and I am not sure I have seen wrappers slabbed by them before, regardless.
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